RE: Chris Harris video: Camaro ZL1 vs Mustang GT500

[neiljohnson]

loving that mustang for me though & it would be even if it had less power

[300bhp/ton]

r1ch said:

Quite weighty though, what was it, 1800 kg for the one?

Yes, but not overly so compared to other modern cars:

2010 BMW M3 Convertible auto	1905kg
2006 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano	1753kg
2012 Aston Martin Vanquish	1739kg
2011 Jaguar XKR-S Convertible	1795kg

[300bhp/ton]

cabbron said:

great value over there but no so by the time you landed one on these shores.

Still pretty good value though. What else even in the same performance ballpark and power levels is anything but less than double the cost? Not too mention in the UK cars like this have a very high retention value and long term residuals.

[300bhp/ton]

Gibbo205 said:

S3000 said:

Couldnt see the real 670 HP in action..
But i bet the new M5 is faster, even if it has 110 hp less.

Off the mark I'd agree, that Mustang will be an absolute handful to get off the mark, it won't have any traction in 1st anywhere near full throttle and 2nd gear will take some pulling off I'd imagine apart from a really hot day with sticky tyres.

Having driven the M5 V10 and owned a Saleen Mustang with 577BHP, the Mustang once rolling was faster in 2nd, 3rd and 4th upto 165mph!

So I'd imagine once that Shelby is hooking up in maybe 2nd, 3rd for sure, it will be the quicker car, lighter than an M5, more BHP and more torque!

Although, if you want off the line performance you need to fit some ET's or drag radials and alter the rear suspension setup. That way you'll be able to use a lot of the power off the line, alla:

[300bhp/ton]

DaveH23 said:

£35,000... Isn't that a fully spec'd Golf GTI money?

However why do I think that price might double when brought over here?

Shipping
handling
VAT
IVA

Probably won't double, but will certainly be more than simply swapping the base $ to £. That said, even all in they are still a heck of a lot cheaper than anything else with similar performance.

Or you could buy a lower spec model and tune it for less money or look at a couple of year old example instead, e.g.

2007 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 2dr coupe
£28,995.00
Only 950 miles from new !!! Garaged , perfect unmarked Shelby !



Also has a warranty from a UK seller.

It's essentially the same car and would only need a few tweaks to up is't already 500hp to well over 600hp.

[300bhp/ton]

Zad said:

What the Ford needs, is for Ford to get it's hands on it. Some of that Ford Europe chassis magic that made the Fiesta, Puma, Focus and Mondeo into really decent drivers cars. Mentioning US gas station fuel got me thinking, I wonder what BHP that pony engine could do on decent UK petrol.

Not this again, too many people listening to Clarkson....



In the US they don't use RON as an Octane measurement they use PON or AKI, so the number appears lower. Although most of the time it's actually higher or equal grade to what we get in the UK.

e.g.

98RON superunleaed in the UK is about the same grade fuel as 93 octane fuel in the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating

[willisit]

I've yet to watch this, but I've been waiting for it... I saw many-a-Camaro/Mustang recently on holiday and they look "right" in their native lands. Here? They're a bit of an event.

Personally, I'd buy the Chevy but the Mustang is a pretty car in person (and looks far smaller which is nice).

Despite the Camaro being available as a UK car - I'd get a US one (cheaper and likely to be easier to get parts for, as 300 would attest to) and the ZL1. I'm not sure I'd be happy owning the basic car after seeing the ZL1.... heh

[yorky500]

I just called up our local Stealership. GT500 hardtop is GBP45,000

Base 2013 5.0l 'stang (for which they have just taken delivery) is GBP25,250

I will try and pop in on Saturday for a shifty.

[Janosh]

A mate of mine is moving to the states in August and was considering a M3...

Suffice to say a zeeeL1 is now at the top of the list

[PascalBuyens]

willisit said:

Mustang is a pretty car in person (and looks far smaller which is nice).

To be honest, I don't like what they did to the headlights, 2013 model looks like it's skint eyed to me

As for dimensions, looks can be deceiving:

GT500: L: 188.2in - W: 73.9/80.9 (excl/incl mirrors) - H: 55.1 in
Camaro: L: 190.4in - W: 75.5 (excl. mirrors) - H: 54.2 in.

[300bhp/ton]

PascalBuyens said:

To be honest, I don't like what they did to the headlights, 2013 model looks like it's skint eyed to me

I think their aim was to evolve the design like they did in the late 60's, e.g.

[CraigyMc]

300bhp/ton said:

Although most of the time it's actually higher or equal grade to what we get in the UK.

Eh.. what? I was with you right until you posted that.

I can go into Tesco here and get 99RON super unleaded. That's about 94-95 AKI.
In California I couldn't find anything higher than 91AKI for general retail sale. I'm sure if you went looking for specialist racing fuel by the drum, you could find it but you won't get it from a pump.

California is the most populous state in the whole US.

Consequently, I call bullst.

C

[theholygrail]

Base 2013 5.0l 'stang (for which they have just taken delivery) is GBP25,250

That's the figure that I really find astounding. You're hardly going to feel short changed driving even a "base" model! Fantastic video of course. Looks-wise, the Camaro wins hands down for me.

[bobbylondonuk]

yorky500 said:

I just called up our local Stealership. GT500 hardtop is GBP45,000

Base 2013 5.0l 'stang (for which they have just taken delivery) is GBP25,250

I will try and pop in on Saturday for a shifty.

5.0 for 25k?

[LuS1fer]

300bhp/ton said:

2007 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 2dr coupe
£28,995.00
Only 950 miles from new !!! Garaged , perfect unmarked Shelby !

Also has a warranty from a UK seller.

It's essentially the same car and would only need a few tweaks to up is't already 500hp to well over 600hp.

This is the old iron block engined Shelby which weighs nigh on 4000lbs. The big leap in the GT500s cred came with the transition to the all-alloy block to take some of the weight out of the nose. The earlier GT500s also had clutch issues. Ford also improved the later suspension set-up considerably.

I imagine the bulk of the warranty is also only going to be an aftermarket one which you can buy yourself and from my knowledge, you won't really need the warranty as these cars have no real issues (save that clutch which probably won't be covered anyway).

One thing that hasn't really been touched on here as well is that your average Ferrari or even M5 will cost you another arm and leg to run and service and parts may require a mortgage. Practicality is not high on the agenda. These two cars can both be run with barely a raised eyebrow when it comes to servicing or parts and in general, they tend to be bulletproof and they have 4 seats and a big boot.

[willisit]

PascalBuyens said:

To be honest, I don't like what they did to the headlights, 2013 model looks like it's skint eyed to me

As for dimensions, looks can be deceiving:

GT500: L: 188.2in - W: 73.9/80.9 (excl/incl mirrors) - H: 55.1 in
Camaro: L: 190.4in - W: 75.5 (excl. mirrors) - H: 54.2 in.

Perhaps I should have put the word "looks" in italic, or bold - the idea was that between the old and new Mustang models, that they would redesign it to "look" smaller - where in fact, the car held the same dimensions as it had done previously.

They have succeeded - it looks smaller.

[LuS1fer]

All cars have grown bigger, globally. If you watched Top Gear USA last week, you'd have seen a Nissan Silvia with a "pursuit" Camaro in one of the challenges. The Camaro looked enormous next to the little "Nee-sann"

[jonnydm]

I know Chris won't be happy with this comment and its a bit predictable etc. and not really the point but having looked at both US list prices, I think I'd rather go with an M3...

[yorky500]

bobbylondonuk said:

yorky500 said:

I just called up our local Stealership. GT500 hardtop is GBP45,000

Base 2013 5.0l 'stang (for which they have just taken delivery) is GBP25,250

I will try and pop in on Saturday for a shifty.

5.0 for 25k?

Yup. m/t and cloth seats - Base model

This is the price here in Dubai, UAE

[LuS1fer]

jonnydm said:

I know Chris won't be happy with this comment and its a bit predictable etc. and not really the point but having looked at both US list prices, I think I'd rather go with an M3...

I'm sure many would agree but the "reality" is you have to look at what you get for the money. These cars are top of the range muscle and generally come with all the bells and whistles and no real options. An M3 list price is only a starting point for a lot of expensive options but I've not done the comparison so can't give a definitive view.

My own view is that people seem to want and strive for the "perfect car" and when they get there, find them to be anodyne and boring in daily use and this is where the sense of constant occasion kicks in with these cars. Whether you're comfortable with that depends on your personaility - I would possibly feel faintly ridiculous if I considered an objective view which is why mine doesn't have the loud stripes.