RE: Jag launches 4x4s
Discussion
Article said:
The reason, Jag says, is that AWD accounts for just five per cent of the UK luxury saloon market.
Isn't that simply because it's almost frickin' impossible to buy a luxury saloon in the UK with AWD in the first place?It's like saying that you're not going to introduce a 200mpg 500bhp V12 because 200mpg cars currently account for 0% of cars sales....
Watchman said:
Ah yes. I was thinking of my own 6-pot Scooby, although you are right, most are 4-pots.
Not sure I understand the point about low mass in the context of symmetrical 4WD.
Means you can get away with shifting it further forwards as it has less effect on dynamics and still offers decent bonnet clearance.Not sure I understand the point about low mass in the context of symmetrical 4WD.
JonnyVTEC said:
Watchman said:
Ah yes. I was thinking of my own 6-pot Scooby, although you are right, most are 4-pots.
Not sure I understand the point about low mass in the context of symmetrical 4WD.
Means you can get away with shifting it further forwards as it has less effect on dynamics and still offers decent bonnet clearance.Not sure I understand the point about low mass in the context of symmetrical 4WD.
H4 or H6 is a very shallow configuration. I can't find a suitable comparator picture, but look how high the crank pulley is on the Forester, particularly relative to the wheel centres.
I'm another potential customer that would prefer a 4x4 saloon / estate over an SUV or RWD only saloon / hatch.
I'd really like a Merc Estate, as some of the bigger ones feel like a properly nice place to be. Same with a BMW 5 Series Touring. But in both cases the RWD only would put me off.
Buying an Audi Quattro A6 doesn't appeal in the same way (other than an RS6, but that would be financial suicide!).
I'd really like a Merc Estate, as some of the bigger ones feel like a properly nice place to be. Same with a BMW 5 Series Touring. But in both cases the RWD only would put me off.
Buying an Audi Quattro A6 doesn't appeal in the same way (other than an RS6, but that would be financial suicide!).
[quote=Dazed & Confused]
Isn't that simply because it's almost frickin' impossible to buy a luxury saloon in the UK with AWD in the first place?
It's like saying that you're not going to introduce a 200mpg 500bhp V12 because 200mpg cars currently account for 0% of cars sales....
[/quote]
You can spec' your A6/7 with or without 4WD/Quattro? Suspect they've used that as a benchmark?
Isn't that simply because it's almost frickin' impossible to buy a luxury saloon in the UK with AWD in the first place?
It's like saying that you're not going to introduce a 200mpg 500bhp V12 because 200mpg cars currently account for 0% of cars sales....
[/quote]
You can spec' your A6/7 with or without 4WD/Quattro? Suspect they've used that as a benchmark?
Interesting that it isn't coming to the UK - I saw a RHD AWD badged XJL on trade plates with plastic wrap on it heading south down the M40 earlier this week. It also had the JAGUAR script under the cat logo which I thought that JLR had ditched for branding.
Demonstrator? Or something destined for other RHD markets?
Demonstrator? Or something destined for other RHD markets?
This is mostly frustrating Mercedes, BMW and now Jaguar refusing to offer AWD in the UK on their coupes/saloons/estates, you can forgive the Germans as they don't want to re-engineer the platform to accept AWD in a RHD format, but Jaguar??????
I note that BMW have started to sell the new F30 with Xdrive in RHD but have chosen to launch with that best seller the 320i????????
Subaru may not use expensive materials on the inside granted, in fact their interiors are definitely low rent but they are comfortable and satisfying to drive, and it's fair to say you're paying for tried, tested and proven mechanicals, nothing else. Generally they are well screwed together and very reliable, and 4x4 is exactly what they are all about and have been doing so very capably since the 60's.
You've got the Forester and Legacy these days if you want a highly capable non fire-spitting continental load lugger with AWD security, and they handle pretty damn good out of the box!! Plenty of Subaru dealers on the continent if anything should happen and won't cost Audi money to fix.
You don't have to buy Audi or any of the other luxo 4x4 if you can live without that bit of luxury and a pretty face, and you can save yourself a shedload of money over 4x4 Audi, BMW or LR which you could spend on other things like a driving/skiing trip to Andorra or the Alps or how about that house extension you've been wanting. What a buzz getting there knowing you aren't going to get stuck and you can just enjoy driving in the snow without chains or socks or drama.
Would you like Diesel or Petrol?
You've got the Forester and Legacy these days if you want a highly capable non fire-spitting continental load lugger with AWD security, and they handle pretty damn good out of the box!! Plenty of Subaru dealers on the continent if anything should happen and won't cost Audi money to fix.
You don't have to buy Audi or any of the other luxo 4x4 if you can live without that bit of luxury and a pretty face, and you can save yourself a shedload of money over 4x4 Audi, BMW or LR which you could spend on other things like a driving/skiing trip to Andorra or the Alps or how about that house extension you've been wanting. What a buzz getting there knowing you aren't going to get stuck and you can just enjoy driving in the snow without chains or socks or drama.
Would you like Diesel or Petrol?
[quote=Dazed & Confused]
Isn't that simply because it's almost frickin' impossible to buy a luxury saloon in the UK with AWD in the first place?
It's like saying that you're not going to introduce a 200mpg 500bhp V12 because 200mpg cars currently account for 0% of cars sales....
[/quote]
Exactly.
I've bought many BMWs over the years both 3 and 5 series and several Alpina versions and I would have bought a 4wd one in a heartbeat if they'd bothered selling them here.
Very short-sighted by Jaguar.
Isn't that simply because it's almost frickin' impossible to buy a luxury saloon in the UK with AWD in the first place?
It's like saying that you're not going to introduce a 200mpg 500bhp V12 because 200mpg cars currently account for 0% of cars sales....
[/quote]
Exactly.
I've bought many BMWs over the years both 3 and 5 series and several Alpina versions and I would have bought a 4wd one in a heartbeat if they'd bothered selling them here.
Very short-sighted by Jaguar.
mikEsprit said:
As a northern USA resident and a fan of British vehicles, the odds that I will be driving a Jaguar as my main vehicle by the end of the decade have just increased a lot.
+1. Was sorely tempted by a Jag XJ as it's so much cooler and nicer than anything posh from Germany, Japan or America. But the lack of AWD swayed me in favor of the Germans in the form of an Audi A8L, the least ostentatious of the usual suspects.Digga said:
I've been waiting for this - the crossover of LR 4x4 expertise into Jag. I've felt for a while that one facter that draws people out of luxo-barges and into 4x4s in winter grip. PLus, for the mad power outputs of the top-range models, we are reaching sensible limits for 2wd.
I'm just thoroughly disappointented teh UK won't get a look in, given our roads and winters.
Our winters are nothing like what they experience in certain areas of the USA and Canada. We get a week of Snow and people get all excited about 4x4s. Snow can last for months in the US and Canada and I am guessing that is why they are only heading there. I'm just thoroughly disappointented teh UK won't get a look in, given our roads and winters.
Also, I can't imagine many people wanting 4x4 version in a petrol!
I think that there is too much emphasis on 4x4 for UK winters. EVO magazine did an excellent article on an XFR with and without winter tyres on a snow/slush track and also compared it against a standard-tyred Mitsubishi Evo XI or something. The winter tyred XFR blitzed the other two cars. (Google - Evo XFR Tyres).
Edited by LewisR on Monday 20th August 11:58
LewisR said:
I think that there is too much emphasis on 4x4 for UK winters. EVO magazine did an excellent article on an XFR with and without winter tyres ona snow/slush track and also compared it against a standard-tyred Mitsubishi Evo XI or something. The winter tyred XFR blitzed the other two cars. (Google - Evo XFR Tyres).
Yup. The real problem is that people are simply not prepping their cars suitably for the brief condition changes that we see every so often.It isn't really logical to buy a more costly to run 4x4 if you mostly live in an urban, semi-urban environment just to cover you for a couple of weeks when it may or may not snow.
My prefered solutions are to firstly keep a couple of sets of snow socks in the boot of the BMW and a pre '72 Rangie (Landy will suffice) in the garage.
Even a couple of big bags of sand in the boot can help a RWD car get more traction.Most people who do buy a 4x4 to cover them for the odd bit of snow still don't prep it properly and then get confused when their wide, sporty tyres don't give them any traction.
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