The McLaren F1 does nothing for me
Discussion
AreOut said:
Alfanatic said:
At all times and in all modes the Veyron gives its driver access to the very best braking it has on offer. If you are in top speed mode, which is easier to access than a McLaren's deleted rev limiter mode, then you would need to stop the car to access the mode again. However, the McLaren's rev limiter is where it is to protect the engine against damage, so it's not like turning that off and forgetting about it is an option either. That's the kind of risk you take only when you are the manufacturer, at the circuit, doing high speed runs and calculating that the risk of blowing the engine is small compared to the publicity gains of managing an officially recognised 14mph over the current record.
well the rev limiter at 7500 rpm is a bit too safe I'd say, that engine is made out of 2 M3 engines that has higher rev limiter and is still under more load..6 cylinders in F1 have to take care of around 600 kgs and 6 cylinder in M3 have to take care of 1500 kgs, still they regularly see >300.000 km, I am ready to bet that F1 with 8K limiter will easily see twice the mileage of Veyron with standard rev limiter
So no, I definitely wouldn't bet my multi million pound asset's health on the rev limiter of an M3.
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
Alfanatic said:
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
Murray has said the only thing he would change on the F1 is to use modern braking technology 
Dave Hedgehog said:
Alfanatic said:
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
Murray has said the only thing he would change on the F1 is to use modern braking technology Dave Hedgehog said:
Alfanatic said:
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
Murray has said the only thing he would change on the F1 is to use modern braking technology EDIT: oops, I see 900T-R beat me to it while I was busy waxing lyrical
Alfanatic said:
Exactly, though I believe there is also a small bracket somewhere that irks him, I can't remember the details, but it is one tiny component in the car that for some reason or another he had no control over. It's a great car. I can relate to what the OP is saying, as to me its appeal has always been cerebral rather than emotional, and contemporary tests raved mostly about the engine and attention to detail rather than the driving experience, but I have nothing but admiration for the car or the vision. An extraordinary car, and it doesn't need to be faster than a Veyron to keep its kudos this late into its retirement. Things move on, and few stars shine so brightly as the Big Mac did during its reign on the top step.
It's the bracket which holds the plunger switch for the underbonnet courtesy light.Globs said:
CHIEF said:
Ok whilst it doesn't have the drama of a Ferrari or a Lambo I still think it looks senational.
Not really in the same class as this though...
The F1 is a bit of a limbo car IMO, it doesn't really seem to 'fit'. Maybe that's what people like about it?
Not sure what you mean about it being a 'limbo' car that doesn't 'fit'?
Alfanatic said:
That is also the first time I've heard of the F1 engine being two M3 engines joined at the hip. I am not even sure the E36 M3 had even made it to the market when the F1 engine had made it to a test bed.
The E36 M3 was launched in February 1992, with a 3 litre straight six (S50B30).The F1 was launched in May 1992, with a 6064cc V12 (S70/2).
Paul Rosche (BMW) was really the main man. The S70/2 was done in quite a short amount of time and they decided not to put anything new (untried) and complex into it - so the spec is actually fairly simple. It misses variable lift, variable intake lengths, really exotic materials - that sort of thing.
The two engines do share some approaches. Vanos is pretty similar on both, for example. The S70/2 uses M3 plugs.
They are also different in many ways. Apart from obvious things like the block, crankshaft, and exhausts, there are plenty of places where the S70/2 is a step further on in terms of performance. Example: the S70/2 has two sets of injectors per cylinder, one set for the manifold and one set further up.
The S70/2 isn't "two M3 engines" - it's a lot better than that; but it was done at the same time as, and by the same people as, the aforementioned M3 engines.
C
Edited by CraigyMc on Sunday 7th October 20:33
Alfanatic said:
You might say that. Personally I'll go with what the chap who set the rev limiter said. That is also the first time I've heard of the F1 engine being two M3 engines joined at the hip. I am not even sure the E36 M3 had even made it to the market when the F1 engine had made it to a test bed. Besides, BMW already had a V12 available if they had wanted to just chuck something together from the parts bin and they went to great lengths to point out that the McLaren engine was completely bespoke, indeed often stating that tye exhaust headers alone cost more than an entire 750i engine.
So no, I definitely wouldn't bet my multi million pound asset's health on the rev limiter of an M3.
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
So no, I definitely wouldn't bet my multi million pound asset's health on the rev limiter of an M3.
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
I didn't mean 2 M3 engines literally (of course) but the concept is same and materials on F1 are supposedly better.
"out of the box" = without any ifs and buts, Yugo will reach 250 mph if its pulled by Bloodhound.. the fact is that veyron cant reach its designated top speed if you use both pedals in the process
and removing ECU limiter is a 2 minute job for any experienced tuner and is hardly considered a modification...
AreOut said:
I didn't mean 2 M3 engines literally (of course) but the concept is same and materials on F1 are supposedly better.
"out of the box" = without any ifs and buts, Yugo will reach 250 mph if its pulled by Bloodhound.. the fact is that veyron cant reach its designated top speed if you use both pedals in the process
and removing ECU limiter is a 2 minute job for any experienced tuner and is hardly considered a modification...
Pressing a button / turning a key is not a modification. Altering the software away from factory standard is, and you also don't need two minutes and an experienced tuner to turn a key."out of the box" = without any ifs and buts, Yugo will reach 250 mph if its pulled by Bloodhound.. the fact is that veyron cant reach its designated top speed if you use both pedals in the process
and removing ECU limiter is a 2 minute job for any experienced tuner and is hardly considered a modification...
Edited by Alfanatic on Monday 8th October 08:41
rohrl said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
Alfanatic said:
A Veyron can hit over 240mph, out of the box, as supplied with no modifications required. An F1 cannot. And more to the point, I am absolutely certain that G. Murray is not losing any sleep over it.
Murray has said the only thing he would change on the F1 is to use modern braking technology Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff