RE: Caterham confirms supercharged R600
Discussion
HustleRussell said:
Not to mention that it is bafflingly common for someone to spend simular money to an R600 on a new, high-spec luxury car... with a 4 cylinder diesel engine!
Yes, in Ireland the best selling car last year was the BMW 520D econobox which sells there for that sort of money. Now that is BAD value.Of course £45k is an insane amount to spend on a daft toy with basic equipment. Mine cost me £32 k 5 years ago and I still can't work out where the money actually went. It's as if one pays a premium not to have things like pas abs tcs etc. Sure it's quick -except when it's wet- but my turbodiesel gets from A to B quicker when long motorway trips are involved . And it uses half the fuel and doesn't leave me half deaf and often pretty damp.
And not any of this matters one iota; I could not care less how many keyboard warriors know better , can drive their Evos quicker or relax more comfortably into their silky leather seats in their AMG Mercedes. What I do know is that every journey in a Caterham is an event, that driving one on track is the most exhilirating thing I have ever done in a car, that I can't sleep the night before I am making a long trip in the Seven and that life with one is so much better than without one. And actually- the fewer people share this obsession the better- I really could not give a f**ck if others don't get it. I do, my friends do and if you would rather stick with your Evo you have probably made a more rational choice. But when did logic ever matter when passion is the subject eh ?
And not any of this matters one iota; I could not care less how many keyboard warriors know better , can drive their Evos quicker or relax more comfortably into their silky leather seats in their AMG Mercedes. What I do know is that every journey in a Caterham is an event, that driving one on track is the most exhilirating thing I have ever done in a car, that I can't sleep the night before I am making a long trip in the Seven and that life with one is so much better than without one. And actually- the fewer people share this obsession the better- I really could not give a f**ck if others don't get it. I do, my friends do and if you would rather stick with your Evo you have probably made a more rational choice. But when did logic ever matter when passion is the subject eh ?
Int'l Adventurer said:
It will be fantastic, but £16k for a supercharger???? 
Don't get me wrong, I love Caterhams but struggle with the value proposition.
I know that Caterham have to make money but this is getting ridiculous.
To be fair, the sequential gearbox is a pretty pricey bit of kit, plus there'll be a load of extra cooling and gubbins that'll be needed. Not exactly cost price, but they're not a charity!!Don't get me wrong, I love Caterhams but struggle with the value proposition.
I know that Caterham have to make money but this is getting ridiculous.
coppice said:
; I could not care less how many keyboard warriors know better ,?
Are you referring to me there?Even if you aren't, do you not think it is a bit infantile to brand anyone with a different opinion than yhou as a "keyboard warrior".
I dont really understand how PH has this mental defect whereby they can't grasp the very basic concept of opinion.
The Wookie said:
Int'l Adventurer said:
It will be fantastic, but £16k for a supercharger????
Don't get me wrong, I love Caterhams but struggle with the value proposition.
I know that Caterham have to make money but this is getting ridiculous.
To be fair, the sequential gearbox is a pretty pricey bit of kit, plus there'll be a load of extra cooling and gubbins that'll be needed. Not exactly cost price, but they're not a charity!!Don't get me wrong, I love Caterhams but struggle with the value proposition.
I know that Caterham have to make money but this is getting ridiculous.
Personally think Caterham continue to have the balance just right, I like the current development and the continued Fred in the shed approach, the brand and everything associated with it is key, mass producing just to bring down costs to appeal to a wider audience would be a disaster.
Wonderful news. Mr. Harris sir, crack open the camcorder please. Got to have a great noise too. Some folks seem to have been getting the wrong end of the cost thing though. This is a racing car. The engine is not a standard Duratec, it is fettled by Caterham's own performance guys with throttle bodies, mapping etc. Once that R500 engine is done, as a crate motor it isn't far off half the value of the car. The R600 is a new category of race car. People have been charging Se7ens forever. Some will make it onto the road but of the two Caterhams I have had the pleasure to blat in, I preferred the 120 to the 150hp.
blindswelledrat said:
Are you referring to me there?
Even if you aren't, do you not think it is a bit infantile to brand anyone with a different opinion than yhou as a "keyboard warrior".
I dont really understand how PH has this mental defect whereby they can't grasp the very basic concept of opinion.
" Keyboard warrior" is a widely used term and its purpose is, as you say, to disagree with people whose opinions you don't share. It's lazy usage but I am not the only person guilty of employing the term .I was not referring to you at all - but responding to some general themes in a thread. What I was saying is that love of Sevens is irrational and that they cost a bloody fortune. Even if you aren't, do you not think it is a bit infantile to brand anyone with a different opinion than yhou as a "keyboard warrior".
I dont really understand how PH has this mental defect whereby they can't grasp the very basic concept of opinion.
I suggest you grow some slightly thicker skin and stop looking for reasons to get offended. As you have chosen to accuse me of being infantile I suppose I have to conform to your view by making the very childish- but irresistible-comment that the grammar in your second sentence really does leave a lot of room for improvement.
Bund said:
Ill be there on Saturday as Im looking to drive a Supersport next year. Are you supported?
Yeah, with McMillan. I'm doing Supers with them next year...tracksport at the moment.As for R600 lap times, not sure, but significantly quicker than a 300. Looks spectacular though.
ETA: DeadPrussian - It's currently on a fairly hard Avon slick. Looked like it resulted in a similar power to grip ratio as the 300 (so still moving around a lot).
Edited by RacerMike on Thursday 4th October 19:42
scubadude said:
Furyblade_Lee said:
I honestly feel though unless they put a few driving / traction aids it will be too much for the road and they will have to be careful if they sanction an official roadgoing version. Someone will put one through IVA independently though I am sure. Some friends have kitcars / 7's with 3-400bhp and you would not want joe public riding round in those. You need to be a) a mentalist and b) have a fair degree of driving talent and restraint, or c), they will have a huge accident.
<mouth hanging open in shock smilie>What?
I bet your some nutless looser who works in health and safety, has to do a risk accessment before using a toilet and buys bread thats pre-sliced and the crust is removed aren't you?
Joe Public does not buy Caterhams, you need to be informed and finaced to even consider one.
There needs to be risk in life, there needs to be 300bhp lightweight cars, there needs to be sharp points on scissors and some source of adrenalin- modern man is reduced to such a dribbling wreck by the nanny state as it is and you want driver aids on a powerful lightweight specialist car???
Christ- grow a real pair or hand your girlie ones in on the way out sunshine- this is a motoring forum FFS.
Good stuff Caterham, this looks awesome- PLEASE do not ever listen to boneheads like the above. The best traction control for a caterham is a rightfoot with a brain behind it.
Just IMVHO of course :-)
I disagree that fast Caterhams are too much for the road. I had a Duratec R500 with sequential box, and it was the quickest thing you could imagine on a road. I had a remapped GTR at the same time, and although similar on paper the R500 just blew it away. A few things:
1) It's very light, so gets more grip on a bumpy road
2) Very narrow, which effectively makes the road wider. Very short, which makes overtakes quicker.
3) There's no lag, and the box was properly close ratio
The R500 was absolutely devastating to overtake people with. You'd sit behind them at 5000rpm, and then as soon as the opportunity came *bang* full throttle and you're past them. Compared to the Nissan you're waiting for the turbos to spool up whilst you worry about the width of the car and whether you can fit past them.
Being small and light, they're just so easy to place. Ah, happy memories..!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ls_GJSygD8
1) It's very light, so gets more grip on a bumpy road
2) Very narrow, which effectively makes the road wider. Very short, which makes overtakes quicker.
3) There's no lag, and the box was properly close ratio
The R500 was absolutely devastating to overtake people with. You'd sit behind them at 5000rpm, and then as soon as the opportunity came *bang* full throttle and you're past them. Compared to the Nissan you're waiting for the turbos to spool up whilst you worry about the width of the car and whether you can fit past them.
Being small and light, they're just so easy to place. Ah, happy memories..!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ls_GJSygD8
ewenm said:
As we're finding, cost is absolute, value is relative (and personal).
Personally I don't see value in the expensive watches that many PHers seem to like. That doesn't mean I think the watch manufacturer shouldn't be selling watches at those prices or that those who buy them are foolish, merely that they have different value-judgements to me.
Personally I don't see value in the expensive watches that many PHers seem to like. That doesn't mean I think the watch manufacturer shouldn't be selling watches at those prices or that those who buy them are foolish, merely that they have different value-judgements to me.
See also the Lotus esprit 350 and RS500 threads - some people seem to have a problem understanding your first sentence.The variety of cars on here is what makes it an interesting place to browse.
I've only ever driven an Westfield Seight in this sector of cars so I can't begin to imagine what this would be like to take for a run!
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