RE: PH Blog: boom and bust?

[sleep envy]

jeremyc said:

nd if you'd put that £120K into gold at the same time you'd be even better off today ....

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Bullion wouldn't look quite as good polishing it on the driveway

[CampDavid]

sleep envy said:

CampDavid said:

Is it not important that they could, if they wanted to though?

Depends on the individual I guess but with all the rare aircooled RS stuff heading over there I doubt they'd do very many miles in them.

The chap I bought my 993 RS from had a collection of over 140 cars.

When he wanted to drive a particular car he'd phone up the guy who ran his garage.

The car was readied and delivered to him to pretty much anywhere in Europe.

Sounds like a hard exsistance

It's hard to know what'll happen. I still have by guide to classic car purchasing which my Dad bought in late 1988/early 1989 which tells you which cars to buy. So many cars in there are "blue chip investments which will see a remarkable rise in value"

[jeremyc]

sleep envy said:

jeremyc said:

And if you'd put that £120K into gold at the same time you'd be even better off today ....

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Bullion wouldn't look quite as good polishing it on the driveway

Anyway, as any fool knows 996 GT3s are the next big thing.

[sleep envy]

CampDavid said:

Sounds like a hard exsistance

TBH I'd rather have been his fleet manager than him.

All the toys without having to fund them

jeremyc said:

nyway, as any fool knows 996 GT3s are the next big thing.

Damn straight!! Think we can manipulate the market?

[CampDavid]

sleep envy said:

CampDavid said:

Sounds like a hard exsistance

TBH I'd rather have been his fleet manager than him.

All the toys without having to fund them

jeremyc said:

nyway, as any fool knows 996 GT3s are the next big thing.

Damn straight!! Think we can manipulate the market?

I think we should Hexagon all the red Mk1s personally

[Dave Hedgehog]

Beefmeister said:

I think that the smart money would go on one of these right now:

http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/use...



The Carrera GT is one of the last true driver's Supercars - n/a screaming V10, manual gearbox, stunning uncomplicated styling. Especially with the replacement being a techno-fest I think the CGT will start to rise in value even more than they are doing currently.

Get 'em while they're hot!

didnt the owner of the yellow one on the evo fleet pay 90k for his?

[LotusOmega375D]

Dave Hedgehog said:

Beefmeister said:

I think that the smart money would go on one of these right now:

http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/use...



The Carrera GT is one of the last true driver's Supercars - n/a screaming V10, manual gearbox, stunning uncomplicated styling. Especially with the replacement being a techno-fest I think the CGT will start to rise in value even more than they are doing currently.

Get 'em while they're hot!

didnt the owner of the yellow one on the evo fleet pay 90k for his?

A little bird tols me that these are very popular with the Americans at the moment. I think the only thing going against them is that Porsche made rather a lot of them (a bit like Ferrari with the F40), so that could make them vulnerable to a drop in value.

[Beefmeister]

LotusOmega375D said:

A little bird tols me that these are very popular with the Americans at the moment. I think the only thing going against them is that Porsche made rather a lot of them (a bit like Ferrari with the F40), so that could make them vulnerable to a drop in value.

Fair point about volumes, but I think the tipping point will be the 918 Spyder. It's so different and modern that people will yearn for a proper supercar and the CGT is the only Pork answer...

The fact that you can have one for a lot less than that 993 GT2 shows how crazy things have got.

[Hightop]

Chris, I was reading all the GTPP long termers updates on your old 993 GT2 only last weekend due to a sudden reignited obsession with them.

Always been my favourite of your cars.

Do you wish you'd held onto it?

I was always looking forward to you changing the steering wheel for non airbag etc once the warranty ran out. Or maybe you did this and I missed it.

Was there ever an 'end of term' type write up in the mag?

Apologies for going slightly off topic - this story and the sight of a GT2 propted me to get logged in again for the first time in years!

[J4CKO]

Beefmeister said:

I think that the smart money would go on one of these right now:

http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/use...



The Carrera GT is one of the last true driver's Supercars - n/a screaming V10, manual gearbox, stunning uncomplicated styling. Especially with the replacement being a techno-fest I think the CGT will start to rise in value even more than they are doing currently.

Get 'em while they're hot!

Hmm, not sure about that, the 911 fraternity are like Baldrick with his Turnips, I can sort of see the appeal, the ultimate, rare and sought after versions of a (relatively) normal sports car versus an anomaly, nobody is quite sure where the CGT fits, its a bit Playboy, its a bit flash and I am probably not alone in wanting the CGT a lot more than it regardless of how good it is relative, the 911 brings out the inner geek, the collector and the anorak, this looks like a normal 911 with some rahter half baked bolt ons but we know it is the grail itself.

If someone paid 90k for one, that is some depreciation from new and the 993 GT2 now costs as much as it did from the showroom, also, there seems to be no shortage of CGT's out there, though they seem to be nearer 300k than 90k !

[havoc]

Stuart said:

Interesting article though. I was struck by the fact that a 993 GT2 is worth more than a 959, but the cost of maintenance makes perfect sense as an explanation.

Only if you view the cars as appreciating chattels (i.e. an alternative to an oil painting, race horse, ornamental bust...) rather than as cars. Which clearly is happening, sadly.

It also sidesteps the thorny issue of potential appreciation - some of those cars may well have minimal maintenance costs, but:-
- they're already overpriced and therefore subject to the whole 'bubble' issue;
- they're old and therefore rust has got to be considered - a restoration could be a big maintenance cost.
...and conversely some of the ones which cost £5k a year just to sit still might not need any restoration work for 10 years and be relative bargains which are expected to appreciate (grab your modern classic now while you can...).


My biggest fear here though is that classic racing soon becomes too big a risk for the truly interesting metal to take part in. Stuff like the LM and SS Classics without the 250GTOs, DB4s/5s and lightweight E-Types just wouldn't be the same...





PS - I agree that the Veyron is one of the biggest automotive white elephants ever though. Think the 'new Enzo', P1 and 918 will probably also fall into this category...replacement battery pack every (e.g.) 5 years at £50,000 a pop???

[Mr. Magoo]

theres talk of a bubble in classic car prices....do me a favour £300K+ for a porsche GT2 sounds like great value....what could possibly go wrong.

[camerman]

Another one for the Porsche museum ?
They have been buying up classics on the quiet for about a year.

[boringbeige]

I think 993GT2's are a steal at £300 ish k. I think the global market (India/China) will soon be paying double that and more. So if anyone wants one and can afford, buy one now whilst they're a bargain.
PS, I've got one rhd, 15k miles.

[enroz]

There are some people who try to influence the market(HELLO BRANDS HATCH FERRARI) by buying up as many of a certain type of vehicle to take them out the market when they are at an all time low. 308 GT4 anyone?

I've alway thought that the 1950's Merc convertibles were under priced, and it shows here with the 1957 300SL Roadster going at a mere £448K, whilst the 1955 300SL Gullwing (Alloy)went for £2.4M. I can see why they are more expensive, but £2M more??

[Streetrod]

Keep up PH, there has been a thread running on this sale since October:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

The high end classic market has been showing huge growth for nearly ten years now (The same could not be said of the stock market) With the right cars continuing to fetch record prices at auction. This has been fuelled by them being seen as a very safe bet from an investment point of view and the fact that the social life now associated with the high end classics is now so attractive.

People with the money want to be seen with the right crowd in the right car. Pebble Beach, Concorso d'Eleganza Villa d'Este, Amelia Island Concours d'Elegance, the list goes on of concours events that are a now must attend events for some people. Even the Queen got involved this year with the event held at Windsor Castle.

People are now having to invest millions to guarantee invites to some of these events. Add the fact that the classic racing scene has never been as healthy means that some owners are happy to race their £25m Ferrari GTO's, why do you think the Goodwood Revival is so popular

Will the bubble burst? For the right cars I don't think so, but I do see the gap growing between the really nice cars and the just OK ones

[Streetrod]

enroz said:

I've alway thought that the 1950's Merc convertibles were under priced, and it shows here with the 1957 300SL Roadster going at a mere £448K, whilst the 1955 300SL Gullwing (Alloy)went for £2.4M. I can see why they are more expensive, but £2M more??

It did not sell at that price on the night as it did not hit its reserve, as its one of only 29 cars making it rarer than a GTO, that accounts for the price

Edited by Streetrod on Wednesday 7th November 14:05

[J4CKO]

I am hoping there is a knock on, I reckon my 944 is now worth almost 3 grand !

it is weird how a cars, from the same manufacturer can be worth so much or so little, a lot of the population would just see an old Porsche and if compared to a new Boxster would think the "new one" is worth a load more.

Is it just me that thinks the CGT looks too much like an overgrown Boxster ?

Edited by J4CKO on Wednesday 7th November 14:12

[ASM993]

Chris, did you actually sit in the Esprit? There was a very mouldy smell in there....

[Mermaid]

Beefmeister said:

I think that the smart money would go on one of these right now:

http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/use...



The Carrera GT is one of the last true driver's Supercars - n/a screaming V10, manual gearbox, stunning uncomplicated styling. Especially with the replacement being a techno-fest I think the CGT will start to rise in value even more than they are doing currently.

Get 'em while they're hot!

& so much better than the 4.0RS GT3