Honda Civic (96-01) as a Daily Shed?
Discussion
Currently looking for a reliable shed to get me around now uni is over; sadly the Clio Williams will have to wait. Looking at the aforementioned Civic. I know it was similar to the Rover400/45 of similar age, but that's not putting me off too much as I can get the Civic bought and insured for sub £1k. Yes, they do seem to be driven by people 3 times my age, but as I experienced with the Panda, the ribbing from mates is well worth the minuscule insurance bills; try £300 on a 1.2 Panda at 20!
Back to the Civic, and it's seemingly remarkable value for money; £600 will get me one with sub 100k on it, although I'm led to believe that's no issue with the oily bits in them and they'll simply go on forever. As long as it doesn't need too much attention, and fuel economy isn't wallet busting (although I'm not expecting massive mpg figures on a 15 year old car), I'm not really bothered about speed or handling; that'll come later, when I'm earning decent money and can afford something more PH-worthy! I've even looked at getting the Aerodeck estate version as the extra space would be an advantage for all the kit I'd be lugging around.
So, what's PH's thoughts?
Back to the Civic, and it's seemingly remarkable value for money; £600 will get me one with sub 100k on it, although I'm led to believe that's no issue with the oily bits in them and they'll simply go on forever. As long as it doesn't need too much attention, and fuel economy isn't wallet busting (although I'm not expecting massive mpg figures on a 15 year old car), I'm not really bothered about speed or handling; that'll come later, when I'm earning decent money and can afford something more PH-worthy! I've even looked at getting the Aerodeck estate version as the extra space would be an advantage for all the kit I'd be lugging around.
So, what's PH's thoughts?
If you avoid rust, their only major problems are using oil and water. Mine amazingly has all three 
Parts are cheap enough and they are easy to work on. I had a timing belt, water pump and tensioner changed for £130 all in.
Just be careful when purchasing parts from the motor factors, the 3 and 5 doors use different parts and are often mixed up, so make sure they look the same. I had fun with a rear drum rebuild recently...
Parts are cheap enough and they are easy to work on. I had a timing belt, water pump and tensioner changed for £130 all in.
Just be careful when purchasing parts from the motor factors, the 3 and 5 doors use different parts and are often mixed up, so make sure they look the same. I had fun with a rear drum rebuild recently...
300bhp/ton said:
Who'd ever think a mass produced every day car might be expected to be used daily? 
While I understand your point, we're discussing one that's c15 years old, and as such I'm wanting to know about how well they have coped with 15 years of daily use, and how well they are likely to cope with more.Which model are you going for?
If you have to have a non vti model, try for the 1.5 Vtec-E. Gem of an engine. Super frugal in Econo mode (light pops up on the dash to tell you when you've entered the zone) and yet its damn quick with the foot down. I had a 1.5 5 door Vtec E on the dyno once. It was standard apart from an Induction kit and it made 127bhp, yet always returned over 45+mpg for me.
1.4 is barely any cheaper to buy/run, yet has only around 90bhp.
If you have to have a non vti model, try for the 1.5 Vtec-E. Gem of an engine. Super frugal in Econo mode (light pops up on the dash to tell you when you've entered the zone) and yet its damn quick with the foot down. I had a 1.5 5 door Vtec E on the dyno once. It was standard apart from an Induction kit and it made 127bhp, yet always returned over 45+mpg for me.
1.4 is barely any cheaper to buy/run, yet has only around 90bhp.
I'd agree that the 1.5 is the engine to go for if the VTi is going to be too expensive to insure. They don't tend to suffer many problems, but rear arches can succumb to rust eventually (as with virtualy all older Civics, even the non-Swindon models). The void bushes in the rear suspension are a common MOT failure, but are cheap and fairly easy to change.
Just like the Rover 400, they are a bit soggy to drive with standard suspension, but that is easily rectified using newer MG ZS parts which stiffen things up and maintain a sensible ride height.
Just like the Rover 400, they are a bit soggy to drive with standard suspension, but that is easily rectified using newer MG ZS parts which stiffen things up and maintain a sensible ride height.
Have looked at both the VTi and VTEC engined cars, guess it'll come down to whatever's the best value. While it would be immense fun to upgrade the suspension and fiddle with it, I'm not really bothered about performance this time around, just a cheap car that I'll run until it dies while saving for the sports car 
DanB7290 said:
300bhp/ton said:
Who'd ever think a mass produced every day car might be expected to be used daily?
While I understand your point, we're discussing one that's c15 years old, and as such I'm wanting to know about how well they have coped with 15 years of daily use, and how well they are likely to cope with more.Just find a one owner, circa 60k miles car with FHSH and you'll be fine. Finding the right car is the hard part.
p.s. brother had a 1.4 3 door 'm' reg for a while and it was good fun. Only had 20k miles on it too, was fine after we changed the (possibly original) tyres!
Edited by varsas on Monday 24th June 17:40
Mr2Mike said:
RobCrezz said:
If you can get a VTi with a b16 engine then you will have a great time, good fun cars.
I totally agree, though the B16 was never fitted to the 5 door shared platform Civic which the OP is considering.300bhp/ton said:
Is 15 years really all that old for a car?
Yes and no!I've used much older cars on long commutes with no trouble but the thing is, most people do not look after their cars and by the time they reach this age the neglect shows. You really don't want to be undoing a huge backlog of maintenance.
Fantastic cars. I had an EK4 and loved it, it wasn't terribly reliable but I gave it death on trackdays, autotests and sprint events as well as driving it daily. It had also be tuned a fair bit, which is never good for reliability. I gave up after the second engine swap.
If you hate the standard suspension (and you will) then I would highly recommend a set of used EK9 springs and dampers. Can be picked up for £100ish and will totally transform the soggy handling base spec models.
The worst thing about it will be the interior. Ghastly on anything lesser than an EK4. Most of them were horrid too...
EDIT: Also didn't see he was looking at the 5 door model.
If you hate the standard suspension (and you will) then I would highly recommend a set of used EK9 springs and dampers. Can be picked up for £100ish and will totally transform the soggy handling base spec models.
The worst thing about it will be the interior. Ghastly on anything lesser than an EK4. Most of them were horrid too...
EDIT: Also didn't see he was looking at the 5 door model.
SuperHangOn said:
Yes and no!
I've used much older cars on long commutes with no trouble but the thing is, most people do not look after their cars and by the time they reach this age the neglect shows. You really don't want to be undoing a huge backlog of maintenance.
I agree. But I guess I'd always buy on condition, unless you are really unlucky it shouldn't be difficult to tell if a car is either ok or not for the most part. Of course you can be unlucky, but that could happen on a 5 year car too.I've used much older cars on long commutes with no trouble but the thing is, most people do not look after their cars and by the time they reach this age the neglect shows. You really don't want to be undoing a huge backlog of maintenance.
Also on a banger/shed motor you simply wouldn't care too much about maintaining it or spending on it. Just enough to keep it running, usable and legal. Worst case you end up weighing it in as scrap.
I guess it isn't too old, only worry is how it's been treated in those 15 years. Yes, I am going to more than likely run it into the ground, but understandably I don't want to get it home and find it needs another few hundred spent on merely making it road legal. It occurred to me the other night that I've not really seen many cars over 10 years old on the roads these days, thought it'd simply be because I'm in Aberdeen and everyone seems to work for an oil company and therefore have a white Audi A4 S Line, but visiting the folks down in Birmingham, and I still haven't seen too many older cars. I know the scrappage thing sent many cars to an early grave though.
I would prefer the Aerodeck as the increased space would be useful, but it's not a dealbreaker; I'd go for the hatchback if it was decently priced. Are there other alternatives PH could recommend? Would need to be able to buy and insure for sub £1k for a 23 year old. I'm not sure where I stand with NCB, as I earned 4 years worth before deciding that as a student, a car was a terrible idea, but I believe they will reset to 0 after two years, which is coming up. It makes some difference, £350 a year compared to £600; it makes sense to go fully comp as TPFT is no cheaper according to a quick go on comparison sites.
I would prefer the Aerodeck as the increased space would be useful, but it's not a dealbreaker; I'd go for the hatchback if it was decently priced. Are there other alternatives PH could recommend? Would need to be able to buy and insure for sub £1k for a 23 year old. I'm not sure where I stand with NCB, as I earned 4 years worth before deciding that as a student, a car was a terrible idea, but I believe they will reset to 0 after two years, which is coming up. It makes some difference, £350 a year compared to £600; it makes sense to go fully comp as TPFT is no cheaper according to a quick go on comparison sites.
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