RE: Harris at the New York show: PH Blog
Discussion
LuS1fer said:
The issue with the X4 is that everyone else's 4x4s look better - Evoque, Audis, Ssang Yong...
Looks are subjective but i can't help but conclude that as BMWs get uglier and uglier, their fans are living in a perpetual state of denial.
I initially blamed safety legislation but then other manufacturers managed to make their cars look pretty svelte.
Still, it's not my money and people can spend it on whatever they want.
I do.
I'm a BMW fan, I loved the styling of the E60 and the current Grand Coupe. Looks are subjective but i can't help but conclude that as BMWs get uglier and uglier, their fans are living in a perpetual state of denial.
I initially blamed safety legislation but then other manufacturers managed to make their cars look pretty svelte.
Still, it's not my money and people can spend it on whatever they want.
I do.
However my problem with the X4 isn't just the styling, it's that it lacks any sort of class whatsoever.
Would not want to drive it, the X4, its X6 brother abomination is on par with the smart car and Prius for stupid looking vehicle.
TTmonkey said:
Whats the poblem with the X4 exactly? Is it just the general concept?
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
BeirutTaxi said:
TTmonkey said:
Whats the poblem with the X4 exactly? Is it just the general concept?
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
It's not a band wagon though is it? It's a unanimous agreement, in the same way Hitler is hated. I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
My household's Yeti has more style than the X4 but..
The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
Escort Si-130 said:
Would not want to drive it, the X4, its X6 brother abomination is on par with the smart car and Prius for stupid looking vehicle.
TTmonkey said:
Whats the poblem with the X4 exactly? Is it just the general concept?
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
k99 said:
My household's Yeti has more style than the X4 but..
The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
Coupes are meant to add style, not take it away.The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
Personally coupes should add something in terms of performance and handling, improving upon the general driving themes of the 4 door car designed to drive on the road.
When improving upon the general driving themes of an SUV, should they not have more ground clearance and more off road ability, more room...?
The more you disect it, the more preposterous coupe SUVs become, especially as a mainstream mass produced product. I can understand one or two people being bonkers enough to want a lowered off roader with performance car looks, but when it it gets mashed into a thing that your granparents drive becasue it hurts their knees less to get into...it loses some appeal for me
On one of his videos Chris Harris stated that he preferred to abstain on commenting on the looks of cars, as such opinions are only subjective.
He appears to have broken his own rule in this case.
I think that it is unfair to any car manufacturer for a motoring journalist to disparage one of their products on appearances alone. Car manufacturers want to make cars that will sell and if you don't like a car on appearances, well there's bound to be other people who do. By all accounts BMW make some very good drivers cars, so I think the criticism is particularly unfair in this instance unless the car is known to be compromised in areas other than styling.
But this is just my opinion.
He appears to have broken his own rule in this case.
I think that it is unfair to any car manufacturer for a motoring journalist to disparage one of their products on appearances alone. Car manufacturers want to make cars that will sell and if you don't like a car on appearances, well there's bound to be other people who do. By all accounts BMW make some very good drivers cars, so I think the criticism is particularly unfair in this instance unless the car is known to be compromised in areas other than styling.
But this is just my opinion.
TurboHatchback said:
Some interesting stuff on show. I find it ever harder to care about the latest versions of huge, heavy £40k plus cars though, I am most excited about the upcoming Renault Twingo and the Mk4 MX5.
The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
Couldn't have put it better myself. Exactly this ^^^The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
k99 said:
My household's Yeti has more style than the X4 but..
The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
But they aren't better looking. Coupes do tend to be better-looking as they have some flow to the styling.The X4 and X6 are just coupe versions of their SUV siblings.
It's a similar argument to saying that manufactures shouldn't produce coupe versions of saloon cars.
If I want a better looking and willing to accept a less practical version of a saloon - then I buy a coupe. Same goes for a SUV surely.
Cutting 45 degrees off a shed doesn't make it more stylish.
I think this custom abomination from the 70s illustrates the point very well - a Transit coupe....
TTmonkey said:
Whats the poblem with the X4 exactly? Is it just the general concept?
I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
If you want more objective journalism, rather than largely subjective, then I fear you're in the wrong place. Perhaps this is more your cup of tea:I hate this 'band wagon' style of journalism. There are many car styles that I dont like/get/make sense, but I'm guessing its a personal taste issue as I doubt that you've driven it yet.
http://www.whatcar.com/
TurboHatchback said:
Some interesting stuff on show. I find it ever harder to care about the latest versions of huge, heavy £40k plus cars though, I am most excited about the upcoming Renault Twingo and the Mk4 MX5.
The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
What a load of codswallop.The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
I can only assume that you have never driven a X6. I sold my DB9 because I preferred driving the X6. It is still too fast to legally exploit the power, can keep up with most cars through the wiggly bits and is as comfortable as any car I have owned excluding the 7 series.
The fact I can chuck a dog in the boot or a bale of hay if required, don't have to worry about flooded roads too much and can also return 33mpg means that to me it combines the best traits of a 4x4, coupe and 4 door car.
Simond S said:
TurboHatchback said:
Some interesting stuff on show. I find it ever harder to care about the latest versions of huge, heavy £40k plus cars though, I am most excited about the upcoming Renault Twingo and the Mk4 MX5.
The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
What a load of codswallop.The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
I can only assume that you have never driven a X6. I sold my DB9 because I preferred driving the X6. It is still too fast to legally exploit the power, can keep up with most cars through the wiggly bits and is as comfortable as any car I have owned excluding the 7 series.
The fact I can chuck a dog in the boot or a bale of hay if required, don't have to worry about flooded roads too much and can also return 33mpg means that to me it combines the best traits of a 4x4, coupe and 4 door car.
Simond S said:
What a load of codswallop.
I can only assume that you have never driven a X6. I sold my DB9 because I preferred driving the X6. It is still too fast to legally exploit the power, can keep up with most cars through the wiggly bits and is as comfortable as any car I have owned excluding the 7 series.
The fact I can chuck a dog in the boot or a bale of hay if required, don't have to worry about flooded roads too much and can also return 33mpg means that to me it combines the best traits of a 4x4, coupe and 4 door car.
As someone who has bought one there will be no convincing you but compare the figures for an X6 and a 5-series touring with a similar engine and the X6 is much worse in every single way. It may have a slightly deeper fording depth for the two times a year you simply can't go round some water but all of the rest of the time it will be worse.I can only assume that you have never driven a X6. I sold my DB9 because I preferred driving the X6. It is still too fast to legally exploit the power, can keep up with most cars through the wiggly bits and is as comfortable as any car I have owned excluding the 7 series.
The fact I can chuck a dog in the boot or a bale of hay if required, don't have to worry about flooded roads too much and can also return 33mpg means that to me it combines the best traits of a 4x4, coupe and 4 door car.
Each to their own of course, there is no 'point' to lots of cars but we buy them because we enjoy them, just most of them aren't as repulsive to look at as the X6/X4 (eye of the beholder etc). Some enjoy how a car actually drives and many just seem to enjoy showing off how much money they have/had/have borrowed. Whilst people are entitled to drive whatever car they like there exists stereotypes about the types of person that buy them for a very good reason usually.
For me the only interesting products coming from the US manufacturers are the new sports cars - Mustang and Corvette - and the bread and butter, high volume pickups. And the most interesting of these is the new Ford F150 which has adopted Jaguar`s aluminium technolgy for the body, albeit mounted on a high strength steel frame. Considering this is the top selling vehicle in the USA, it is a bold move and a powerful vote of confidence in the Jaguar-developed technology. But you have to struggle to find out much about the F150 or the other pick ups, many of which incorporate some interesting ideas and most of which are customer driven.
As for the apparently endless BMW series vehicles, all they are trying to do is fill every conceivable nook and cranny of the market place. There is no gain in getting worked up about it. But it is a pain having to sift through all the guff if you are in the market for one of their products. And I can see that putting some people off.
As for the apparently endless BMW series vehicles, all they are trying to do is fill every conceivable nook and cranny of the market place. There is no gain in getting worked up about it. But it is a pain having to sift through all the guff if you are in the market for one of their products. And I can see that putting some people off.
Tomatogti said:
TurboHatchback said:
Some interesting stuff on show. I find it ever harder to care about the latest versions of huge, heavy £40k plus cars though, I am most excited about the upcoming Renault Twingo and the Mk4 MX5.
The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
Couldn't have put it better myself. Exactly this ^^^The hate for the X4 (and X6) is because anyone who knows anything about cars can see they are utterly pointless. They combine all the worst traits of 4x4s, coupes and 4 door cars for absolutely no advantage whatsoever. The result (compared to a conventional saloon/hatch/estate) is heavy, poor handling, slow, thirsty, cramped and a visual abomination. They offer no benefits at all over other models except some bizarre fashion/status symbol value which invariably means the drivers of them are people one should strive to avoid.
Where as most regular coupe cars have cramped rear seating and are hard to get into the rear if your anything but young and fit.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff