Who doesn't like big wheels?

[gravitygravy]

Super/hyper cars are a bit different when they need to fit the wheels over huge discs and callipers and no-one expects a floaty ride. That said, huge rims are a fairly recent thing - cars like the Countach were on 15" rims in the 80s and the Testarossa was on 16".

[Fun Bus]

Kawasicki said:

I swapped the V12 in my Lamborghini for an i4 diesel with common rail and turbo and it drove so much better. The fuel economy was transformed too. I rarely used the stupid V12 after that.

This thread is just another where contributors are desperate to prove how much of "motoring enthusiast" they are.

"You've 14" wheels? Pah! I've 8" on white steelies..."

[Olivera]

Kawasicki said:

Some cars with small sidewalls ride waaay better than other cars in their class with much taller sidewalls.

Sidewall height is only one indicator of ride quality.

+1, sidewall height alone primarily affecting ride quality is vastly overstated on PH. It is just one factor along with tyre compound, spring rate, chassis stiffness, bushings etc.

I generally think those claiming that reducing rim diameter by just 1" massively improves ride quality are deluded. A small improvment to ride yes, but that also comes with more undamped tyre bounce and worse turn-in as the sidewall rolls over.

An old Almera on 15" wheels I owned a long time ago had dogst ride - a Boxster on 19" rims rode significantly better.

[cerb4.5lee]

arun1uk said:

13" and big sidewalls is the way forward

I take your point...however I'm not sure many would buy one of those as a comfortable cruiser though.

[ch37]

This popped up locally, original wheels, what the hell...




Yet another case of unavoidably large wheels if you want a decent spec.

[Four Litre]

InductionRoar said:

Very few scenarios where they look or perform better over their smaller counterparts.

I usually agree - however my 981 Boxster on 20" wheels runs a lot smoother that my wifes Toureg that has mahoosive tyres.

I know as i have a broken back!

[sideways man]

Some manufacturers go to the trouble of fitting alloy suspension components. There’s obviously a benefit in reducing unsprung weight, but then fit incredibly heavy wheel/tyres which reduce any gain. My daily Volvo has 225/40x17, not big in modern sizes,but compared to 185/60x13 on my Escort they are massively heavy!
In addition, I ruined a tyre on the Volvo by hitting a pothole. Only time that’s happened in 30+ years of driving. Big wheels; I’m not a fan.

[BGarside]

InitialDave said:

What tyres are you using?

Goodyear EfficientGrip. The sidewalls are soft though giving poor steering feel so will try something different next time.

[monthefish]

RichieG1 said:

Big wheels certainly look good, but I like to drive my cars, and smaller wheels handle and ride better. My last 4 cars;

330d - came on 18s, swapped to 17 rode better, handled better
530d - came on 19s, swapped to 18 rode better, handled better
535i - came on 20s, swapped to 18 rode way better, handled a bit better
GTi Performance - just acquired on 19s and waiting for shipping from Germany on a lighter set of 18s

All of the above improved (or will) the dynamics of the car and were broadly cost neutral once I'd eBay'ed the flashy big wheels.

It's looks vs performance. Simples.

Define 'handled better'

[monthefish]

Kawasicki said:

Some cars with small sidewalls ride waaay better than other cars in their class with much taller sidewalls.

Sidewall height is only one indicator of ride quality.

The quality/calibration of engine/powertrain mounting has a much bigger influence on ride than switching from a typical 50 to 45 or 40 profile.

Tall sidewalls, often have horrible, undamped bouncing ride.... yuck...

..not to mention the slight, but perceptible, delay in turn in whilst the sidewall deforms due to the initial load of cornering.

[InitialDave]

BGarside said:

Goodyear EfficientGrip. The sidewalls are soft though giving poor steering feel so will try something different next time.

Ah, ok. Happens yo be the size I need for something else, so was interested if you'd found something really good.

monthefish said:

Define 'handled better'

Handling is a term that seems to be used in a variety of ways by people.

[dan98]

I've downsized nearly every car I've owned, usually to a set of stty steels.
Eg. Golf 18" > 15"

Better MPG, much smoother ride, more chuckable, somehow slightly more responsive, no worries with kerbing etc etc.

The only downside being a noticeable lack of sure footedness 100mph >. (autobahn use).
Still easily worth it though for every other benefit.

[Ferruccio Fan]

18" down to 15" is quite a drop , makes a mockery of needing 18s to cover big brakes if 15s will happily fit over them .

[Frankthered]

I think that the point that the fans of small wheels are making is that for any specific car, it is most likely that it will ride better on smaller wheels with higher profile tyres than it does on bigger wheels with lower profile tyres.

Yes, there is also likely to be a reduction in grip and not so sharp a turn-in but for most people, in "normal" driving, these downsides are probably much less noticeable than the ride.

This is not to say that cars running around on larger wheels don't have a great ride/handling set-up - the final design of each model will be optimised around a specific wheel & tyre combination and that will be the best size of wheel to use for that car, whether it is 16", 19" or even 22".

The term "handling" I had always understood to describe the way the car responds to inputs from the driver and is not to be confused with ultimate grip (or roadholding).

It is entirely possible that an unsettled ride, or indeed an excess of grip, can upset the handling of a car in terms of compliance and / or adjustability and feedback. Contemporary reviews of the Alfasud Sprint complained that the handling of the car wasn't quite as good as the Alfasud because the (HUGE) 14" wheels with 185/60 tyres didn't work quite as well as the 13" wheels on the standard car. (I believe the standard tyres were 175/70-13.)

There isn't really a right or wrong answer to this, it's just down to personal preference. I tend to favour smaller wheels and can sympathise with the view that it is frustrating that the best equipped models always come with bigger wheels whether you want them or not!

[DaveCWK]

I flip flop between liking big wheels/small tyres & not.
Having that super direct turn in that you get with ultra low profiles is a nice feeling IMO, much better than the squidgy vague off centre steering you get in most older performance cars with 50+ section tyres.
But noise, a crashy ride & general impracticality sucks.

I'm actually not sure i've ever experienced a car that has what I thought was a happy compromise between the two.

[M4cruiser]

I'm a big-wheel hater too.
Our oldest car came with 13 inch when new; some have put 17 inchers on their version, crazy. But that's a personal non-standard non-approved choice.

What really gets me is the manufacturer's standard 16 inch with 50 profile on our shopping hatchback. Really don't need that, nor the extra cost of tyres when replacing them.

[dan98]

DaveCWK said:

I flip flop between liking big wheels/small tyres & not.
Having that super direct turn in that you get with ultra low profiles is a nice feeling IMO, much better than the squidgy vague off centre steering you get in most older performance cars with 50+ section tyres.
But noise, a crashy ride & general impracticality sucks.

I'm actually not sure i've ever experienced a car that has what I thought was a happy compromise between the two.

IMO most German cars are fine on German roads, even with silly big wheels, and especially at higher speeds.
However they are often absolutely dire in the UK, hence the downsizing.
I've no idea why people put up with it (although I'm particularly sensitive to it).

And now most other manufacturers seem desperate to copy the German model, we are where we are.
Cars actually designed for UK roads usually hit the right spot - Rover, older Fords etc, but not sure if anything is these days....?

[knitware]

I bought a new BMW 5 Series 3 years ago, it's gone back now, but it was a fantastic car. I opted for the SE spec and 17" wheels, I placed a few options but the dealer was surprised at my wheel choice when 19s" 'would suit the car better'. I floated down the road, sublime.

[Olivera]

M4cruiser said:

I'm a big-wheel hater too.
What really gets me is the manufacturer's standard 16 inch with 50 profile on our shopping hatchback. Really don't need that, nor the extra cost of tyres when replacing them.

A 16 inch wheel with 50 profile is still excessive, and too expensive - are you still driving in the 1970s?

[cybertrophic]

juansolo said:

Porsche have only managed it recently. Mine is on the smallest wheels that fit because on the big ones it came with it the ride was intolerable.

Honestly, after having to have the 21” alloys on a Cayenne welded for the second time in as many years due to the potholes on rural roads causing them to crack, I switched to 19” wheels with actual sidewalls on the tyres and the ride has improved ten fold whilst not noticeably affecting the road holding.

Massive alloys with rubber-band tyres are just an aesthetic from the concept car images and don’t work on anything other than mirror-smooth motorways.