RE: Honda Civic Type R: the tech
Discussion
rich85uk said:
Well that looks awful, and 310bhp through the front wheels?! seems like alot of effort has gone into making sure it can put the power down but i just don't see it coping that well on a slightly damp average British road. Competition is pretty stiff too with the amount of 4 pot turbo high powered hot hatches out there at the moment, good luck Honda
Its a shame BMW are the only ones willing to brake away from this trend with the 135i
Have patience. The next Alfa hatch is to be RWD as well.Its a shame BMW are the only ones willing to brake away from this trend with the 135i
This new CTR is too late and too expensive. I'm sure its epic in the flesh but £30k? Thats the Audi S3, Golf R market...I am a honda fan but this just leaves me feeling frustrated. Maybe around 250 bhp and say £21k and target the Focus st market. Now moved to VW after having 4 Ctr's and an S2000. Remapped Mk5 gti and its perfect (and only £6k) Where's the new S2000 btw?
I think most people are forgetting the type r was supposed to be back to basics/roots driving. great engine, gearbox and handling. Most Type-r's (the FN2 does not count) are a motoring life affirming experience.
I don't think they were always made to look good, have many creature comforts, or ferry the family round comfortably. This is what made them different to mmost of the german (now mqb platform) cars.
search type r legend on youtube for fascinating peek behind the history of the older type r's
I don't think they were always made to look good, have many creature comforts, or ferry the family round comfortably. This is what made them different to mmost of the german (now mqb platform) cars.
search type r legend on youtube for fascinating peek behind the history of the older type r's
steven-chvtx said:
This new CTR is too late and too expensive. I'm sure its epic in the flesh but £30k? Thats the Audi S3, Golf R market...I am a honda fan but this just leaves me feeling frustrated. Maybe around 250 bhp and say £21k and target the Focus st market. Now moved to VW after having 4 Ctr's and an S2000. Remapped Mk5 gti and its perfect (and only £6k) Where's the new S2000 btw?
Why should it be cheaper than a Golf? Personally I prefer the Honda badge to VW and rightly so, they want to create the best hot hatch they can.£29,995 is an awful lot of money for a car that looks like an oversized radio controlled toy.
Owning the current one, this would have been my next car. Unfortunately a quick time around the Nürburgring is all it has going for it, having only ever owned hot hatches I have never had the desire to traipse down to Germany and thrash my car around the Nürburgring. For me the journey back and forth and day-to-day would be shared with much better machinery for the money.
Owning the current one, this would have been my next car. Unfortunately a quick time around the Nürburgring is all it has going for it, having only ever owned hot hatches I have never had the desire to traipse down to Germany and thrash my car around the Nürburgring. For me the journey back and forth and day-to-day would be shared with much better machinery for the money.
Edited by pacdes on Tuesday 2nd June 23:01
I covered 50k miles in my FN2 and loved it despite the ride quality but this new one seems to have moved the game on for Honda but not quite in the right way. I've gone for a Golf R this time round and I'm sure many other previous Type R customers have decided to try something different
Unusual (though not unknown) for the hot version to have different suspension to the cooking models, but an expensive option. The reasons for fitting the cheaper and more compact option as standard are rational if not welcomed by driving enthusiasts. In terms of their priorities for this model, I guess it's irrelevant - the torsion beam equipped Megane is competitive at the Ring, and it looks as if all other priorities are rescinded.
The price looks about right to me, a Golf R is about 30k and a Renaultsport 275 Trophy R is £36,430. Personally, and setting aside that I'm not in the market for that kind of car, I would find it hard to swallow the uplift on the base car, but then I have similar feelings about things like M BMWs and Cayman GT4s, it feels like they are taking the piss with margins, but in terms of market positioning it looks right.
Ali_T said:
rich85uk said:
Well that looks awful, and 310bhp through the front wheels?! seems like alot of effort has gone into making sure it can put the power down but i just don't see it coping that well on a slightly damp average British road. Competition is pretty stiff too with the amount of 4 pot turbo high powered hot hatches out there at the moment, good luck Honda
Its a shame BMW are the only ones willing to brake away from this trend with the 135i
Have patience. The next Alfa hatch is to be RWD as well.Its a shame BMW are the only ones willing to brake away from this trend with the 135i
If the Civic beats the Megane RS on the road, that's all that matters. I would rather the Honda than a Golf or Audi.
lee_erm said:
Why didn't PH ask the man why they had chosen torsion beam rear suspension? We already know the answer, amusing to hear the 'official' answer nevertheless.
I suspect your "official answer" is costs which is rubbish. It's packaging and the fact the standard Civic runs that set up. They're not going to re-engineer the whole rear floor pan for one model. The reason the EP3 and earlier had double wishbone is that all the cooking civic also had double wishbone. I've had several Type Rs in the past and I was really looking forward to getting back into one. I'm a big fan of Honda but visually this just does not appeal to me. As a 31 year old man I don't want to drive around in what looks like a modified boy racer chariot. I know what people will say. 'Who cares what other people think?'. 'At least it's not another boring German box' etc. But you know what, I care, and surely I'm a big part of the target market.
No I don't care about soft touch plastics and I'm not a badge snob, but when companies stick fake vents (according to Top Gear), plastic arches without changing the track width, and 4 exhausts on a 4 cylinder car then there is no justification. Type R's of the past weren't subtle, but they were fairly restrained. The extra parts were there for performance and you could remain safe in the knowledge that you owned a drivers car, not one for poncing around in, and with that came the nods of approval. I can't imagine arriving anywhere in the new Type-R and getting the nod from anybody but teenagers and 20 somethings.
I will of course go for a test drive. It might be so amazing to drive that I can look past it's appearance, but it will have to be bloody good. And if how it drives is the most important part, then surely the WRX has to be considered for the same money.
No I don't care about soft touch plastics and I'm not a badge snob, but when companies stick fake vents (according to Top Gear), plastic arches without changing the track width, and 4 exhausts on a 4 cylinder car then there is no justification. Type R's of the past weren't subtle, but they were fairly restrained. The extra parts were there for performance and you could remain safe in the knowledge that you owned a drivers car, not one for poncing around in, and with that came the nods of approval. I can't imagine arriving anywhere in the new Type-R and getting the nod from anybody but teenagers and 20 somethings.
I will of course go for a test drive. It might be so amazing to drive that I can look past it's appearance, but it will have to be bloody good. And if how it drives is the most important part, then surely the WRX has to be considered for the same money.
Honda toned down everything with the FN2, People complained about it being boring & slow etc...
Now they've opened up the taps again and there are still moans and groans, Personally I applaud Honda for offering something a bit 'out there' and aimed their expertise to driving engagement and enjoyment in this day and age and giving us a gear stick.
I think it's a shame they didn't offer the latest gen in a 3dr.
I also look forward to see what Chris Harris has to say about it and the x3 too many exhaust tips!
Now they've opened up the taps again and there are still moans and groans, Personally I applaud Honda for offering something a bit 'out there' and aimed their expertise to driving engagement and enjoyment in this day and age and giving us a gear stick.
I think it's a shame they didn't offer the latest gen in a 3dr.
I also look forward to see what Chris Harris has to say about it and the x3 too many exhaust tips!
krismccloy said:
Honda toned down everything with the FN2, People complained about it being boring & slow etc...
Now they've opened up the taps again and there are still moans and groans, Personally I applaud Honda for offering something a bit 'out there' and aimed their expertise to driving engagement and enjoyment in this day and age and giving us a gear stick.
I think it's a shame they didn't offer the latest gen in a 3dr.
I also look forward to see what Chris Harris has to say about it and the x3 too many exhaust tips!
I wouldn't say Honda toned down the looks for the FN2 compared to the EP3, it was pretty radical for the time (triangular exhausts and massive spoiler). However the FN2 was priced around £17k and was more affordable to a younger market who appreciated the looks.Now they've opened up the taps again and there are still moans and groans, Personally I applaud Honda for offering something a bit 'out there' and aimed their expertise to driving engagement and enjoyment in this day and age and giving us a gear stick.
I think it's a shame they didn't offer the latest gen in a 3dr.
I also look forward to see what Chris Harris has to say about it and the x3 too many exhaust tips!
At £30K this car is against some tough opposition and the kinds of people who can afford this car might be put off by the looks. It's borderline too expensive, especially with such an unattractive finance package.
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