VW in trouble over alleged US emission test manipulations
Discussion
EricE said:
Still no word from VW? According to some forum comments they have issued a sale stop for all diesel models in the USA.
Surely that goes without saying?Apart from anything else, in some states they can't be registered until this is fixed.
I wonder if VW are going to end up buying cars back off customers?
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said:marmitemania said:
I wonder how the usual pious, smug VW driving type will react if this comes to the UK. I bet they will still loyally stick by VAG.
Pious, smug VW driving type here. How should react?marmitemania said:
You should react by buying another VAG product without question because that is the perceived and done thing, not because they are well made, reliable or nice to drive. They have a poor reputation in America because they are not the most well built or reliable cars, but the Americans can see past the supposed German engineering and build quality that we seem to lap up in this country. I really don't get our fascination with all things German as I have said before we now have shampoo with built in German engineering for our hair! I think it's about time we grew up a little.
Very true, I see it every day at work. I work in a 50 year old power station equipped with English Electric switchgear and even after all these years of constant use it feels solid and never gives much trouble. On the newer FGD plant fitted 9 years ago, it is equipped with Siemens switchgear which in comparison is utter garbage. It feels cheap, isn't as intuitive and already gives bother, there's no way it'd last as long as the English Electric stuff.
The problem is all the proper British engineering companies have been allowed to be taken over by German giants such as Siemens so these days you have no choice but to buy their stuff!
It's not just cars that use the "German means quality" myth.
Edited by Rammy76 on Sunday 20th September 16:47
Rammy76 said:
marmitemania said:
You should react by buying another VAG product without question because that is the perceived and done thing, not because they are well made, reliable or nice to drive. They have a poor reputation in America because they are not the most well built or reliable cars, but the Americans can see past the supposed German engineering and build quality that we seem to lap up in this country. I really don't get our fascination with all things German as I have said before we now have shampoo with built in German engineering for our hair! I think it's about time we grew up a little.
Very true, I see it every day at work. I work in a 50 year old power station equipped with English Electric switchgear and even after all these years of constant use it feels solid and never gives much trouble. On the newer FGD plant fitted 9 years ago, it is equipped with Siemens switchgear which in comparison is utter garbage. It feels cheap, isn't as intuitive and already gives bother, there's no way it'd last as long as the English Electric stuff.
The problem is all the proper British engineering companies have been allowed to be taken over by German giants such as Siemens so these days you have no choice but to buy their stuff!
It's not just cars that use the "German means quality" myth.
Edited by Rammy76 on Sunday 20th September 16:47
marmitemania said:
You should react by buying another VAG product without question because that is the perceived and done thing, not because they are well made, reliable or nice to drive. They have a poor reputation in America because they are not the most well built or reliable cars, but the Americans can see past the supposed German engineering and build quality that we seem to lap up in this country. I really don't get our fascination with all things German as I have said before we now have shampoo with built in German engineering for our hair! I think it's about time we grew up a little.
So basically because you don't like VAG, nothing to do with the alleged fraud?bhstewie said:
hstewie said: So basically because you don't like VAG, nothing to do with the alleged fraud?
Isn't it admitted fraud at this point? VW have 'fessed up.I think this will very badly damage VW in the 'states since the diesels tend to be bought by the 'eco conscious' types as an alternative to something like a Prius. The thought that they emit harmful pollutants by the bucketload + the fact that they will now be modified to the detriment of performance/economy will launch substantial class action lawsuits. That on top of the fact that the US reputation of VW is for unreliable, poor quality yet expensive to repair (and probably now unresellable) crap will hit them hard.
AnotherClarkey said:
Isn't it admitted fraud at this point? VW have 'fessed up.
I think this will very badly damage VW in the 'states since the diesels tend to be bought by the 'eco conscious' types as an alternative to something like a Prius. The thought that they emit harmful pollutants by the bucketload + the fact that they will now be modified to the detriment of performance/economy will launch substantial class action lawsuits. That on top of the fact that the US reputation of VW is for unreliable, poor quality yet expensive to repair (and probably now unresellable) crap will hit them hard.
It'll be interesting to see what happens here - I'm not clear if it doesn't affect UK vehicles or if we simply don't know yet.I think this will very badly damage VW in the 'states since the diesels tend to be bought by the 'eco conscious' types as an alternative to something like a Prius. The thought that they emit harmful pollutants by the bucketload + the fact that they will now be modified to the detriment of performance/economy will launch substantial class action lawsuits. That on top of the fact that the US reputation of VW is for unreliable, poor quality yet expensive to repair (and probably now unresellable) crap will hit them hard.
I have a Golf simply because I like them, it's the "safe" option I guess - I certainly don't think they're an example of the finest German engineering.
If I'd been told I should be aghast at the ethics what VW are supposed to have done then fair enough, but it just turned into a moan about VW build quality.
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: It'll be interesting to see what happens here - I'm not clear if it doesn't affect UK vehicles or if we simply don't know yet.
Well obviously something that detects the US emissions test and alters the ECU map isn't going to have much effect on a UK vehicle. The question is whether their ECU does the same for NEDC and, if so, whether that's actually illegal? bhstewie said:
hstewie said: It'll be interesting to see what happens here - I'm not clear if it doesn't affect UK vehicles or if we simply don't know yet.
I don't think it affects EU cars as we here in EU are happy to inhale as much NOx as humanly possible for as long as CO2 is below 100g (or whatever the tax free threshold happens to be). If I was a tree I would already be stting myself because after EU is done with cars, trees and other green CO2 emitting plants will become the next chopping target. It's easiest to cut emissions where those impacted can't do feck all about it.bhstewie said:
hstewie said:marmitemania said:
You should react by buying another VAG product without question because that is the perceived and done thing, not because they are well made, reliable or nice to drive. They have a poor reputation in America because they are not the most well built or reliable cars, but the Americans can see past the supposed German engineering and build quality that we seem to lap up in this country. I really don't get our fascination with all things German as I have said before we now have shampoo with built in German engineering for our hair! I think it's about time we grew up a little.
So basically because you don't like VAG, nothing to do with the alleged fraud?marmitemania said:
No it's not because I don't like VAG> I don't buy into the German love as a whole. It just smacks of the devious underhandedness of which the Germans are known for. They run Europe as it is. I just think that they think they are untouchable and run on the don't do as I do do as I say principle. I hope this has caught up with them and takes them down a peg or two. By buying in to all things German no matter how poor they are we are feeding their economy and make them stronger, providing jobs for their people. What about our country? People moan how we have nothing and our country and manufacturing has had it, we have only ourselves to blame.
Wow, I hope your tin hat doesnt get a hole in it. Condi said:
marmitemania said:
No it's not because I don't like VAG> I don't buy into the German love as a whole. It just smacks of the devious underhandedness of which the Germans are known for. They run Europe as it is. I just think that they think they are untouchable and run on the don't do as I do do as I say principle. I hope this has caught up with them and takes them down a peg or two. By buying in to all things German no matter how poor they are we are feeding their economy and make them stronger, providing jobs for their people. What about our country? People moan how we have nothing and our country and manufacturing has had it, we have only ourselves to blame.
Wow, I hope your tin hat doesnt get a hole in it. 
marmitemania said:
Oh and I'm not trolling either it's just my opnion and I await someone to give me a reasonble defence of VAG and why we should buy there cars over all others.
I suspect most of us don't have a clue what you're actually getting at - where has anyone said "we should buy there cars over all others"?If they've broken the law they should face the consequences - I don't see anyone defending them or suggesting otherwise.
marmitemania said:
Oh and I'm not trolling either it's just my opnion and I await someone to give me a reasonble defence of VAG and why we should buy there cars over all others.
We have a VAG car and a British car and we bought both because they were best at what they do. I'd be interested to know what you'd buy in place of a four year-old Octavia VRS for the same money as transport for a small family? Condi said:
marmitemania said:
It wont do it's made in England.
Just like the British Leyland car your still driving was made in England? Or has that rusted away by now. kambites said:
marmitemania said:
Oh and I'm not trolling either it's just my opnion and I await someone to give me a reasonble defence of VAG and why we should buy there cars over all others.
We have a VAG car and a British car and we bought both because they were best at what they do. I'd be interested to know what you'd buy in place of a four year-old Octavia VRS for the same money as transport for a small family? Ford Mondeo
Vauxhall insignia
Citroen C5
Mazda 6
Toyota Avensis
Loads more if you look
All available with Diesels as I assume that's you're fuel of choice and all coming in at roughly the same sort of money. It's easy you don't have to buy a VAG product because everyone else does there not going to tell you off. Well they might.
marmitemania said:
Whilst all of these cars are foreign you do not have to buy a German car as a default.
Ford Mondeo
Vauxhall insignia
Citroen C5
Mazda 6
Toyota Avensis
Loads more if you look
All available with Diesels as I assume that's you're fuel of choice and all coming in at roughly the same sort of money. It's easy you don't have to buy a VAG product because everyone else does there not going to tell you off. Well they might.
Personally I would never buy a diesel, but that's beside the point. In response ot those.Ford Mondeo
Vauxhall insignia
Citroen C5
Mazda 6
Toyota Avensis
Loads more if you look
All available with Diesels as I assume that's you're fuel of choice and all coming in at roughly the same sort of money. It's easy you don't have to buy a VAG product because everyone else does there not going to tell you off. Well they might.
Too big (wont fit in the garage)
Too big
So rare I know little about it and probably too big.
Too big
Not available as a hatch (as far as I know?) and also probably too big.
If you want a well packaged hatch with a decent boot which isn't the size of a house, the Octavia seemed to have no competition.
I'd probably never buy a Golf (or indeed anything else with a VW badge on it) but VAG do have some worthwhile cars.
Edited by kambites on Sunday 20th September 19:02
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