RE: Jaguar XE V6 S: UK Review

[neelyp]

PHMatt said:

Audidodat said:

What are the emissions/economy like between those old engines and the new ones?

I thought this was piston heads.

Try the 21st century.
It's lovely, I'm sure you'll like it.

[Kawasicki]

paralla said:

I always wonder why JLR products are so heavy considering all the aluminium.

This is 50kg heavier than an equivalent 340i auto.

It would handle even better and have more competitive emissions if it hadn't eaten all the pies.

I think the jaguar is heavier potentially because the XE structure is taken from XF, so basically it's much bigger than the 3 series. Just look at the track width differences;

BMW 1531 mm / 1572 mm
Jaguar 1602 mm / 1603 mm

The Jaguar body is also about 40mm longer AND wider than the 3 Series.

Jaguar have done a great job, no doubt. It's not easy to beat the development budget of the Germans though.

[SimonD]

Kawasicki said:

I think the jaguar is heavier potentially because the XE structure is taken from XF, so basically it's much bigger than the 3 series. Just look at the track width differences;

BMW 1531 mm / 1572 mm
Jaguar 1602 mm / 1603 mm

The Jaguar body is also about 40mm longer AND wider than the 3 Series.

Jaguar have done a great job, no doubt. It's not easy to beat the development budget of the Germans though.

No, this is an all new body, and it's scaled up for the new XF.

They've said that they've made big savings with the new Alu body, and 'spent' those savings in the suspension department to deliver a really decent setup.

[73RS]

As a fan of classic cars, I find the list of extras on this car nonsensical. They sum to £10,298, add weight and complexity and an astonishing 23% to the price. I couldn't find any I would select. A smart alternative would be the £9,995 M3 Evo coupe 3.2 litres currently advertised on Pistonheads. Heated washer jets!

[Limpet]

I've had a go in a diesel version after 100k in 320d BMWs. The thing I really liked about the XE is that it doesn't need adaptive suspension to handle properly. On bog standard suspension, it is beautifully damped, body control is a step up from BMWs, and it rides better too. Unlike an F30 on standard suspension, it doesn't flop over on its springs when pushed hard into a corner, and it remains composed and taut whatever you ask it to do. The F30 just isn't in the same league without the Adaptive Damping, and even then the Jaguar rides loads better.

Apart from the truly second rate infotainment system (think £50 Chinese Android tablet) it's a hell of a car to be honest. More refined and better to drive than the 3-series, and the Ingenium engine is streets ahead of the N47 in refinement terms too, if not quite as strong feeling.

[PHMatt]

neelyp said:

PHMatt said:

Audidodat said:

What are the emissions/economy like between those old engines and the new ones?

I thought this was piston heads.

Try the 21st century.
It's lovely, I'm sure you'll like it.

I have nothing against the car at all. I quite like the way it looks.
I just think PH have done an enormous injustice to the S54 engine from the M3 which to this day remains a masterpiece. In CSL guise it's utterly stupendous that a "mass produced" car (3 series, not CSL) had 112.5bhp per liter with no turbo's.
Admittedly you're probably getting about 10mpg at 360bhp but the economy of turbo engines isn't as black and white as it seems.
Off boost they're probably hugging daisy's. On boost I'd be surprised if there wasn't a mass extinction of all life on Earth.

[CGJ0]

P-Jay said:

Nice car, seems expensive for a non-halo model, it's about the same price as an M3 would have been in 2006 inflation corrected.

How is a 2006 inflation corrected price useful?

[Kawasicki]

SimonD said:

Kawasicki said:

I think the jaguar is heavier potentially because the XE structure is taken from XF, so basically it's much bigger than the 3 series. Just look at the track width differences;

BMW 1531 mm / 1572 mm
Jaguar 1602 mm / 1603 mm

The Jaguar body is also about 40mm longer AND wider than the 3 Series.

Jaguar have done a great job, no doubt. It's not easy to beat the development budget of the Germans though.

No, this is an all new body, and it's scaled up for the new XF.

They've said that they've made big savings with the new Alu body, and 'spent' those savings in the suspension department to deliver a really decent setup.

So xf and xe don't share the same basic structure?

I would say jaguar are using the heavier xf suspension modules to save money. The additional stiffness this brings to the smaller xe is wellspun by marketing. If they had a huge budget they would have saved weight. They are also using an 8 cylinder block for a six cylinder engine.

I'm a big fan of the car, and I really like Jaguars in general.

[DonkeyApple]

PHMatt said:

Audidodat said:

What are the emissions/economy like between those old engines and the new ones?

I thought this was piston heads.

The real questions between this and the direct competition:

Which one sounds better going up through the rev range?

Which one allows the best 'little bit of silly sliding'?

Which has the nicest gearbox map for fun drives?


All this MPG ballsacking is for Eco diesels not these types of cars.

Traffic light GP stats are for youngsters and tourists.

And ICE really is for people who have no choice but to sit in traffic jams etc.

It's a sign of just how much fun has been sucked out of motoring that so many people seem to forget what fun cars are really about.

[ORD]

I agree.

Nobody who is worried about mpg is going to buy the 6 cyl petrol, so it is irrelevant.

It's still a slusher, though, so the rest of your questions are also irrelevant. It will always be a motorway/town car because it has the gearbox of a motorway/town car.

[Alex P]

There is some nonsense spouted on here!

First, if all you are bothered about is 0-60 times, ALL 'premium' manufacturers are well behind the times because Mitsubishi managed 0-60 mph in less the 4 seconds in a 4dr saloon (Evo 9 FQ 360) almost 10 years ago! The Germans are only just catching up!

As someone who has actually driven the XE S I can tell you that is is a great car because it manages to be both a sports saloon and a comfortable car - it actually rides and handles well, unlike many competitors that do one or the other (and sometimes not even that very well).

As for MPG and CO2 emissions, as long as it does circa 30 mpg when driven normally and less when driven hard (which they do) then I really don't care what the on paper figures are. Again, regarding CO2 emissions, I buy my own cars so CO2 is not an issue until I tax it for the year and the current RFL is less than my manual focus ST with over 100 bhp less.

Regarding interiors, interior colour combinations are a matter of taste. I don't like all black like many people do so the prospect of a typical Audi interior leaves me cold. Having spent 8 years in the motor trade I have also seen plenty of grubby looking 'German' interiors that look past their best and suffer from rattles/broken components to know that how someone actually looks after their car is just as important as the 'quality' of the plastics. I don't like the texture of certain BMW leathers, the 'smooth' Audi leather looks and feels like plastic and the hard wearing Mercedes Artico actually is. I have driven German cars with nice interiors, such as the E39 5 series and cars like the Mercedes SL, but most are really not that special inside, especially from a materials point of view.

Anyway, back to the XE S, it is a great car to drive and must be one of the best small saloons dynamically, I just wish that Jaguar would offer the V6 engine in cheaper specifications, such as the Prestige and R-design, like they do for the US market.

[ORD]

No point in this country. Jaguar would sell literally 2 or 3 lower spec V6s.

[Alex P]

Possibly, though I think there is more of a market for non-S V6s than you might think, after all, in the only year the Jagaur marketed the V6 XF petrol (duratec) properly, Jaguar sold circa 500 and that did 27 mpg combined and cost near £500 a year to tax: my parents have one and they love it.

TBH I could easily see Jaguar upgrading the S model to the 380 bhp version of the V6 to keep ahead of the likes of the C43 AMG and that would leave a bit of headroom for a cheaper version of the V6 with less kit - also bear in mind that there is currently no V6 diesel XE and the new tax regime from next year applies a £310 surcharge to the £145 year RFL for any car costing over £40k, irresptive of what engine it has or what it pollutes - the assumption being that if you can afford to spend more than £40k on a car, you should be able to pay the surcharge for the first five years. Seems very sensible as people who have to buy cheaper, older cars (over 5 years old) will just pay a standard rate of £145 as it is assumed that they cannot not afford the latest low emission tech and should not be penalised for driving an older car.

[MrML]

DonkeyApple said:

PHMatt said:

Audidodat said:

What are the emissions/economy like between those old engines and the new ones?

I thought this was piston heads.

The real questions between this and the direct competition:

Which one sounds better going up through the rev range?

Which one allows the best 'little bit of silly sliding'?

Which has the nicest gearbox map for fun drives?


All this MPG ballsacking is for Eco diesels not these types of cars.

Traffic light GP stats are for youngsters and tourists.

And ICE really is for people who have no choice but to sit in traffic jams etc.

It's a sign of just how much fun has been sucked out of motoring that so many people seem to forget what fun cars are really about.

I can confirm that it sounds lovely in the mid range (though dissapointingly it's quieter at max revs?)

With torque vectoring pretty much eliminating any understeer and sharp throttle response/no lag with it being supercharged it's very lively at the rear - needs traction in 'trac dsc' to move around a bit, thought that's just a single jab of the button. (Can be completely turned off too but not something I've felt the need to do on the road)

Gearbox plenty sharp enough in dynamic (using paddles) genuinely feels as quick to me as VAG dsg boxes..

[big_rob_sydney]

williamp said:

So its 0-60 is 5.1, the same as an old Audi S4. So it can match a very old metric. I would add that you, me and anyone else does not need a 4 door sports saloon to be any quicker in the 0-60. I mean that: quicker then most, if not all 70s/80s supercars, and probably 90s sportscars. Yet it has 4 doors, a decent boot, and isn't the quickest car in the range. You cant expect the next generation to be quicker then the last. The real news, as other manufacturers are all working towards, is being more efficient in every metric: performance with decent fuel consumption, weight saving, not being larger then the last generation but having better packaging.

The story of the XE is not that it isn't any quicker then an old Audi. It excels in so many other areas, which are more important

Great reply. Thank you.

However, I would disagree with some aspects.


You, me, and anyone else may not NEED to, but as far as the marketplace goes, we may WANT to. Ever wonder why we have watches for sale that are waterproof to 200 meters? Or why we have hiking boots that can go down the side of an active volcano? Or why we have a NSL of 70mph, and yet there are cars for sale here that can easily do double, and in some rare cases triple? Its because people WANT it. And its not up to you to tell them they cant have it.

And, I cant expect the next generation to be quicker than the last?!? Seriously? Progress is precisely why I expect that, and so much more.

And, in case you missed it, almost ALL cars are getting bigger.

[big_rob_sydney]

Alex P said:

There is some nonsense spouted on here!

First, if all you are bothered about is 0-60 times, ALL 'premium' manufacturers are well behind the times because Mitsubishi managed 0-60 mph in less the 4 seconds in a 4dr saloon (Evo 9 FQ 360) almost 10 years ago! The Germans are only just catching up!

Technically you're right, but those cars are not in the same customer group. I dont expect a rally fanboi cares what an executive express can do, or vice versa.

FWIW though, I owned a 22B, and love rally cars.

It would be a bridge too far even for me to expect these lardarse exec barges to compete with a rally car. If we stick to fitness for purpose, then I would have expected something in the 4.X bracket at least for a car that pretends to have sporting credentials. Certainly, for £55k or thereabouts, its a disgusting lack of progress.

[ORD]

This is the most cringeworthy stuff I have seen for a while. It is 'disgusting' for a repmobile not to have a sub-5 second 0-60 time? This place can be worse than Top Gear for utterly idiotic tripe at times.

I drive a car with that kind of acceleration, and it is batst crazy fast for our roads. The idea that pace of that kind is now necessary for a sporty exec saloon is laughable.

Cars are for driving, not top trumps. If the Jag drives well, it is easily fast enough to be a lot of fun.

I would probably agree that it's hard for a car to be 'sporty' without having a bit of speed, but 5 seconds 0-60 is loads faster than any sensible threshold.

[big_rob_sydney]

ORD said:

This is the most cringeworthy stuff I have seen for a while. It is 'disgusting' for a repmobile not to have a sub-5 second 0-60 time? This place can be worse than Top Gear for utterly idiotic tripe at times.

I drive a car with that kind of acceleration, and it is batst crazy fast for our roads. The idea that pace of that kind is now necessary for a sporty exec saloon is laughable.

Cars are for driving, not top trumps. If the Jag drives well, it is easily fast enough to be a lot of fun.

I would probably agree that it's hard for a car to be 'sporty' without having a bit of speed, but 5 seconds 0-60 is loads faster than any sensible threshold.

Yes. You're quite right. Expecting an improvement of a lousy 0.1 seconds with a generation of development is clearly asking for too much.

So we should stop all progress, for the simple reason that ORD said so.

I will agree with you on one thing; there really is some idiotic tripe on here.

[ORD]

Woh! An internet hard man! And he can do sarcasm!

I had better agree with you before you say something else mean.

[300bhp/ton]

Am I the only one who doesn't like this new "want to be a German car" look all new Jags seem to have now???

Not taking anything away from their ability or how they drive. But I really don't like the looks of any of the modern Jags (XK is ok, not as nice as older one. F-Type also, but hit with the ugly stick a bit too much).


Jaguar is one of my all time favourite brands, as a family we've owned 7 or 8 Jags. But I really don't like the look of any of the current saloon range and have no desire to own one.