Car trends that you hope die
Discussion
Absolutely, 100% spot on!
German car build quality in general (maybe not Porsche, I don't see many of them) but as a self-employed garage owner I assure you that in a couple of years South Korea (Kia and Hyundai) are going to slaughter the German car industry. Oh, their products may be boring but they do the job and keep on doing it!
German car build quality in general (maybe not Porsche, I don't see many of them) but as a self-employed garage owner I assure you that in a couple of years South Korea (Kia and Hyundai) are going to slaughter the German car industry. Oh, their products may be boring but they do the job and keep on doing it!
The dearth of interesting engines. It seems that all there is on the market is either 1.0-litre turbo 3-pots, 1.6-/2.0-litre turbo 4-pots, 3.0-litre turbo 6-pots and 4.0-/4.4-litre turbo V8s.
Surely a lower-stressed 1.2-1.8-litre NA 4-pot, 2.0-/2.5-/3.0-litre NA 6-pot or 4.0-/4.4-litre NA V8 would be more reliable and economical in the real world rather than in a laboratory? Not to mention sounding at lot better - we would be free of VAG farting too...
Surely a lower-stressed 1.2-1.8-litre NA 4-pot, 2.0-/2.5-/3.0-litre NA 6-pot or 4.0-/4.4-litre NA V8 would be more reliable and economical in the real world rather than in a laboratory? Not to mention sounding at lot better - we would be free of VAG farting too...
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
Tells you it's a sporty one innit.Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
swisstoni said:
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
Tells you it's a sporty one innit.Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
I agree. It's ghastly. Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
Simonium said:
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
I agree. It's ghastly. Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
AppleJuice said:
The dearth of interesting engines. It seems that all there is on the market is either 1.0-litre turbo 3-pots, 1.6-/2.0-litre turbo 4-pots, 3.0-litre turbo 6-pots and 4.0-/4.4-litre turbo V8s.
Surely a lower-stressed 1.2-1.8-litre NA 4-pot, 2.0-/2.5-/3.0-litre NA 6-pot or 4.0-/4.4-litre NA V8 would be more reliable and economical in the real world rather than in a laboratory? Not to mention sounding at lot better - we would be free of VAG farting too...
I agree 100% on the interesting engine front. I'm definitely sad to see the back of big NA motors, rotaries etc and reluctant to get on board with the current crop. Even 90's Nissan/Mitsubishi 4 cylinder turbo engines sound and behave interestingly next to the cold efficiency of new engines.Surely a lower-stressed 1.2-1.8-litre NA 4-pot, 2.0-/2.5-/3.0-litre NA 6-pot or 4.0-/4.4-litre NA V8 would be more reliable and economical in the real world rather than in a laboratory? Not to mention sounding at lot better - we would be free of VAG farting too...
My current and previous 2 cars are e92 M3, e46 m3 and a mk2 golf which I fitted a 2.8 12v VR6 engine into - I love N/A engines with character and these all have plenty.
There's no denying however that smaller motors with fewer cylinders equipped with turbos are more powerful and more efficient. The VR6 made 200bhp on the rollers and averaged 22mpg. The E46 (340bhp) averaged 19mpg and my current e92 (420bhp) is averaging 16.5mpg. A new M4 for example would average better economy than at least the E46 and E92 in the same conditions with a 3.0 twin turbo 6 and more torque available at any point in the rev range.
joeshaw123 said:
There's no denying however that smaller motors with fewer cylinders equipped with turbos are more powerful and more efficient. The VR6 made 200bhp on the rollers and averaged 22mpg. The E46 (340bhp) averaged 19mpg and my current e92 (420bhp) is averaging 16.5mpg. A new M4 for example would average better economy than at least the E46 and E92 in the same conditions with a 3.0 twin turbo 6 and more torque available at any point in the rev range.
I'd love a M4 for the reasons you mention, and after having a Z4M/E92 M3/E90 330i they've all managed to actually put me off N/A engines, none of them have any meaningful torque and all the performance is very high up the revs. I think a C63 AMG with the 6.2 V8 could get me to love N/A engines again though!
The engine in the M4 is mighty impressive I admit. I think my brother in law gets mid to high 20s on his, when not hooning about that is.
It also sounds very different to the N55, much more raspy and more like the E46 M3 when pressing on, although its not universally liked!
Having had turbo engines for a while now, they are very good and the torque is impressive, but they do lack the character and response of the lovely NA engines. I'm sure it is a case of he grass being greener however.
It also sounds very different to the N55, much more raspy and more like the E46 M3 when pressing on, although its not universally liked!
Having had turbo engines for a while now, they are very good and the torque is impressive, but they do lack the character and response of the lovely NA engines. I'm sure it is a case of he grass being greener however.
Calmchap said:
Simonium said:
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
I agree. It's ghastly. Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
foxbody-87 said:
Calmchap said:
Simonium said:
AppleJuice said:
Gaping bumper grilles:
Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
I agree. It's ghastly. Why?
I see the W213 E63 has a pair of intercoolers, but a D3 A8 4.2 TDI used two intercoolers and had a restrained lower bumper:
The R35 GT-R puts out similar power to the W213 E63 and yet its bumper is (reasonably) restrained:
Ooops.
AppleJuice said:
Surely a lower-stressed 1.2-1.8-litre NA 4-pot, 2.0-/2.5-/3.0-litre NA 6-pot or 4.0-/4.4-litre NA V8 would be more reliable and economical in the real world rather than in a laboratory? Not to mention sounding at lot better - we would be free of VAG farting too...
Ah yes the Queef-gearbox engine mapping. Another thing that needs to die.
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