The Best ///M/Barge/General Rant/Look at this/O/T(Vol XVIII)

[ferrisbueller]

Chris Stott said:

My 996 (C2, manual) has been my daily for 10 years, averaging over 10k a year (now on168k Miles).

Copes with pretty much everything - though it’s a bit scarey in snow on regular tyres (zero front end grip).

Only real issue with covering a lot of miles in what is now an 18 year old car is the running costs mount up - can get some big bills to keep it in good order.

Which I think is to be expected.

I know someone who ran a basic Cayman as a daily for 25k a year and the bills were of a significance sufficient to put me off such frivolities for life (and it depreciated like a bh, too, obvs).

[LaurasOtherHalf]

ferrisbueller said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Quite. Leave that to the yanks.

anonymous said:

[redacted]

£15k still seems to get a seat at the table. In absolute terms a significant percentage increase. In relative terms, not sure. I wonder whether a C4 might be a dailyable keeper. Compared to an E46 M3 in the colder months the Pork should be a better bet.

I still don't think the prices are out of the question though given the bubble. When I had my air-cooleds £15k got you a ropey 993, a ok 964 or G series. To get minters you generally had to hunt out enthusiast owned £20k+ cars.

So with the bubble and inflation I think a decent 996 at £15k seems good value (should you like a 996).

[ATM]

LaurasOtherHalf said:

ferrisbueller said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Quite. Leave that to the yanks.

anonymous said:

[redacted]

£15k still seems to get a seat at the table. In absolute terms a significant percentage increase. In relative terms, not sure. I wonder whether a C4 might be a dailyable keeper. Compared to an E46 M3 in the colder months the Pork should be a better bet.

I still don't think the prices are out of the question though given the bubble. When I had my air-cooleds £15k got you a ropey 993, a ok 964 or G series. To get minters you generally had to hunt out enthusiast owned £20k+ cars.

So with the bubble and inflation I think a decent 996 at £15k seems good value (should you like a 996).

I agree. Mintest e46 will be just shy of 20k if seller is sane. Mintest 996 probably 25 - 30k.

Personally I couldn't get as excited about an e46. Its a good road car made better by their m division but you cant compare it to a ground up designed sports car.

The m car will probably cost less than the 996 to keep going too.

[ATM]

ferrisbueller said:

Chris Stott said:

My 996 (C2, manual) has been my daily for 10 years, averaging over 10k a year (now on168k Miles).

Copes with pretty much everything - though it’s a bit scarey in snow on regular tyres (zero front end grip).

Only real issue with covering a lot of miles in what is now an 18 year old car is the running costs mount up - can get some big bills to keep it in good order.

Which I think is to be expected.

I know someone who ran a basic Cayman as a daily for 25k a year and the bills were of a significance sufficient to put me off such frivolities for life (and it depreciated like a bh, too, obvs).

I think if you're going to do something like this you should start with a higher mileage example and stick to a cheaper specialist for servicing.

Not the best example but you get the idea. Half its original purchase price today. What will it be worth in 3 years if you do another 25k per year. If its only worth £15k then that's only 3.3k per year or £275 per month.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/112693954081

[ferrisbueller]

Main thing for an idle ponderer is the navigation of the minefield of the numerous mechanical frailties. Any value proposition is tilted by a 5k bill to sort out a fundamental mechanical problem, especially when we're talking £10-15k in terms of original purchase.

I do believe in certain cases it is possible to buy in to an appreciating asset and offset bills with capital gain and such a thing is an appealing idea if funds are limited. Indeed, it makes certain things accessible which otherwise wouldn't be.

I have no Porsche affiliation - the plasticity of their nature has put me right off over the last decade. I have flirted with GT2s and GT3s but never taken the plunge. I like interesting, fun, involving cars, ideally analogue in nature as almost everything made post 2005-ish holds the appeal of white goods i.e. minimal/none. Don't like turbos, do like manuals and nothing too big, nor heavy. And gasoline, please.

I spend countless hours musing indulgences I'll never make and cruising classifieds making improper noises at automotive treasures I'll never own. I guess this is the plight of the threadist. Now and again, I like a feasibility study, also known as a reality check, at which point I tend to put dreams back in their lockers.

I categorically would not spend £30k on a depreciating asset, especially one with basic design flaws. I my be denying myself a plethora of automotive orgasmatrons but I'll take that risk. I could lash a fraction of that into something though, if it were worth it.

[LaurasOtherHalf]

I think it was a very small window of opportunity for a mint 996 to be £15k though and they were pretty rare. I remember seeing a low mileage (maybe 50k) C2 3.4 with full history in speed yellow for £17.5k at a dealer, most people on whichever thread I posted it on derided it for being over priced when there were plenty being sold for less albeit with much more miles and less history.

Were there that many mint ones at £15k?

[ATM]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

If my mention of a gen 2 997 through this into the mix I apologise. My intention was to compare this with an early 996 and another 15 - 20 grand thrown at it in an effort to make it betterer.

I went early 996 because i wanted to try one of these older cars and already had the 981. It seemed a bit daft going 987 so the only choice which made sense to me was 996 - especially considering the engine woes of the 3.8 gen 1 997. I toyed with the 986 but just dont really fit in them. Although i keep coming back to that. Considering the entry price of a 986 is basically nothing then surely some money for big boy (big legs) mods can be factored in.

If i was starting from a blank sheet I'd be going 987 3.4 gen 2 or a punt on a 986 with big boy mods.

[ferrisbueller]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

And that is what it boils down to I think. Hence poking at early 996s. A 2.7 lacks clout for me. It may be pure un all, but she ain't quick.

And if big money is being thrown then the letters G and T better be on the rump.

[Patrick Bateman]

Long gearing is the worst thing about the 2.7 for me, comfortably.

[ATM]

Patrick Bateman said:

Long gearing is the worst thing about the 2.7 for me, comfortably.

Or its slow?

[Patrick Bateman]

Slow is really a relative term though, I just think of it as hot hatch quick.

And no, not the current crop of hot hatches.

Highly strung engines and long gearing are perhaps what combine to make it feel more sluggish than it is when we're talking about overtaking. I found this was when third being too long was most obvious.

[bungle]

Leins said:

What about a sub-£20k manual C4S?: https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...



For me the best looking of all watercooled 911, and a good few pub dinners cheaper than a widowmaker in the current market

Always loved these and now genuinely tempted... But aren't the 3.6's the engines to a avoid? 3.4 = Good? I could be completely wrong, my Porsche knowledge not great unfortunately.

[ferrisbueller]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Limited exposure but felt like 4 litre ratios on a 2.7 litre donk.

[joesnow]

I’ve been thinking a lot about what Barchetta said about peak car, and I have to agree really.

It was another reminder as to how I enjoy driving, and with this in mind, I’ve just put a deposit on a minty Honda Integra Type R in 1998 Japanese spec. It’s running a few mugen mods so gives 220bhp from 1800cc and weighs 1101kg.

I had a uk spec back in the mid 2000s but it was a daily. I shouldn’t have sold it really, but changed it for an M3 Evolution.

I’ve never found a car that’s as eager to attack a B road. Can’t wait to pick it up on Friday.
Happy bunny.

[chappardababbar]

joesnow said:

I’ve been thinking a lot about what Barchetta said about peak car, and I have to agree really.

It was another reminder as to how I enjoy driving, and with this in mind, I’ve just put a deposit on a minty Honda Integra Type R in 1998 Japanese spec. It’s running a few mugen mods so gives 220bhp from 1800cc and weighs 1101kg.

I had a uk spec back in the mid 2000s but it was a daily. I shouldn’t have sold it really, but changed it for an M3 Evolution.

I’ve never found a car that’s as eager to attack a B road. Can’t wait to pick it up on Friday.
Happy bunny.

Well done mate, but pics obviously

[joesnow]

But of course.

[joesnow]

chappardababbar said:

Well done mate, but pics obviously

We’ve had a few similarities in our fleets. My current daily is an RS4 Avant and I’ve owned an s2000 as well. Of everything, the Integra was the one that I miss, but it was also my first quick car. It might be a slight case of nostalgia, but I can’t wait to drive it and track it too.
How did you find yours?

[ATM]

chappardababbar said:

joesnow said:

I’ve been thinking a lot about what Barchetta said about peak car, and I have to agree really.

It was another reminder as to how I enjoy driving, and with this in mind, I’ve just put a deposit on a minty Honda Integra Type R in 1998 Japanese spec. It’s running a few mugen mods so gives 220bhp from 1800cc and weighs 1101kg.

I had a uk spec back in the mid 2000s but it was a daily. I shouldn’t have sold it really, but changed it for an M3 Evolution.

I’ve never found a car that’s as eager to attack a B road. Can’t wait to pick it up on Friday.
Happy bunny.

Well done mate, but pics obviously

Yes well done.

Reading about the little 500 biposto which Loony posted made me think. Its apparently special because its light yet it is 995kg. The standard 124 spider is only 70 or 80kg more and that's a much bigger car but it is also known for being light. I think the sweet spot now is to look for cars which are light and moderns struggle with this due to safety regs. Can a stripped out biposto excite like the older integra or is the biposto fighting a battle it can't win as it's strangled by modern safety regs?

[chappardababbar]

joesnow said:

chappardababbar said:

Well done mate, but pics obviously

We’ve had a few similarities in our fleets. My current daily is an RS4 Avant and I’ve owned an s2000 as well. Of everything, the Integra was the one that I miss, but it was also my first quick car. It might be a slight case of nostalgia, but I can’t wait to drive it and track it too.
How did you find yours?

The most exciting, most fun, most rewarding car I've ever owned. Really special feeling, something I've never quite replicated. But it was my first car so I can't trust my memories.

Mine was M.I.N.T. I mean perfect, and i kept it that way...really hope it's had a good life since I sold it. You will love it.

btw I sold you the RS4!!

[joesnow]

chappardababbar said:

The most exciting, most fun, most rewarding car I've ever owned. Really special feeling, something I've never quite replicated. But it was my first car so I can't trust my memories.

Mine was M.I.N.T. I mean perfect, and i kept it that way...really hope it's had a good life since I sold it. You will love it.

btw I sold you the RS4!!

Ha! I can hardly believe it!
The old girl is going great guns at 115k and has been well fettled by the chaps at MRC. It’s a grunty rocket ship and the engrossing allrounder that it always was.

Teg looks extremely fresh! They are a great drive.

Hope the Porsche is still running well. Looked excellent in brown with roof bars