The Best ///M/Barge/General Rant/Look at this/O/T(Vol XVIII)
Discussion
I think he'd smile more if you spelled his name correctly 
I can see the enormity of the "record". It is as much a function of nobody else having a go as anything else. Taking a minute off is impressive but isn't it just a reflection of 35 years' progress? They haven't raced anything capable of such times, quite possibly since the 80s, and nobody else has had a pop. However, it's nice that Porsche went back 35 years later and did it. The video they produced was nice, too.
Look at it in context; it's not going to be that long before a road car gets near the 1983 time.
I can see the enormity of the "record". It is as much a function of nobody else having a go as anything else. Taking a minute off is impressive but isn't it just a reflection of 35 years' progress? They haven't raced anything capable of such times, quite possibly since the 80s, and nobody else has had a pop. However, it's nice that Porsche went back 35 years later and did it. The video they produced was nice, too.
Look at it in context; it's not going to be that long before a road car gets near the 1983 time.
Hats off to Porsche for new Nurburg lap record it is a hell of achievement, I love the fact they do it just because 'they can'
The latest 911 RSR (Cayman now in a 911 body
) sounds awesome too, such an antidote to Formula E...
Anyone on here driven Angelesy track ? Im off there next week for a track day and some local hoonage.
The latest 911 RSR (Cayman now in a 911 body
) sounds awesome too, such an antidote to Formula E...Anyone on here driven Angelesy track ? Im off there next week for a track day and some local hoonage.
Rocket. said:
Anyone on here driven Angelesy track ? Im off there next week for a track day and some local hoonage.
Not since it has been redeveloped though. Great location and track - you'll have a blast!ETA: fourteen years ago! Excuse the lack of focus.
Edited by jeremyc on Thursday 7th June 09:11
Nice one JC, looks like plenty of run off then the Irish Sea !
Ferris and Moose
there is plenty to moan at Porsche about including but limited to :4 pot Caymans, bore scoring, GT car allocations, the list is fairly endless but really this ?? I seriously lament the loss of Concorde, such a backward step
so however cynical stuff like this it may seem, to do nothing and people lose interest then go backwards, no thanks !
Ferris and Moose
there is plenty to moan at Porsche about including but limited to :4 pot Caymans, bore scoring, GT car allocations, the list is fairly endless but really this ?? I seriously lament the loss of Concorde, such a backward step
so however cynical stuff like this it may seem, to do nothing and people lose interest then go backwards, no thanks !
It's progress but only as a consequence of the fact that now is the time you chose to measure it. That progress could have been marked earlier if someone had been bothered previously.
It's a feat, for sure, but it's not incredible. It's entirely credible given modern technology and a not inconsiderable 1,200 bhp (depending who you believe). Indeed, people have been doing similar laps, and faster, in racing sims for years.
I remember Carl Lewis running 9.92 when I was a kid. I've since watched Usain Bolt run it, cruising, in 9.58 (beating the existing World Record by a tenth). That's amazing. And it's something thousands of people have tried, tens of thousands of times, day in day out, where progress can clearly be tracked and seen.
Rocking up with a 919 and trashing a 35 year old record is like me celebrating beating an 8 year old in a penalty shoot out - I still would, but people may wonder what the fuss is about.
It's a feat, for sure, but it's not incredible. It's entirely credible given modern technology and a not inconsiderable 1,200 bhp (depending who you believe). Indeed, people have been doing similar laps, and faster, in racing sims for years.
I remember Carl Lewis running 9.92 when I was a kid. I've since watched Usain Bolt run it, cruising, in 9.58 (beating the existing World Record by a tenth). That's amazing. And it's something thousands of people have tried, tens of thousands of times, day in day out, where progress can clearly be tracked and seen.
Rocking up with a 919 and trashing a 35 year old record is like me celebrating beating an 8 year old in a penalty shoot out - I still would, but people may wonder what the fuss is about.
Fair enough old chap, fwiw I do like a sim but I'm not convinced the 'lack of peril' can ever truly be ignored and I don't care how safe the car is, it still takes some balls and a whole lot of skill to really go for it there in whatever you drive.
Are you saying the whole thing is a bit pointless however fast they went or you would expect it to be faster ?
I'm not sure if you have seen the the speed of the thing on the lap of Spa, its worth a look it was nuts, if they had drawn a line under it there then no complaints from me so I think they deserve a pat on the back for going to the next level, thats all.
Are you saying the whole thing is a bit pointless however fast they went or you would expect it to be faster ?
I'm not sure if you have seen the the speed of the thing on the lap of Spa, its worth a look it was nuts, if they had drawn a line under it there then no complaints from me so I think they deserve a pat on the back for going to the next level, thats all.
The sim reference was more in terms of the fact that physics models in games have kind of chartered progress in virtual reality. IIRC the first model of the Nurburgring in Gran Turismo could be lapped in 4 mins something by that game's equivalent of an F1 car. There are sim racing YouTubers making a living out of posting 'ring reference laps in various cars. As you say, learning the track on PlayStation was very different to driving it.
It is rather meaningless but as far as a "because we can" exercise goes it is admirable. FWIW, I'd have thought sub-5 mins should be possible. The margin feels like it should be bigger. That 919 could nudge 240 mph and the full hybrid acceleration is bonkers.
I'm all for pushing boundaries but I just thing it's a shame that the 'ring reference lap is the metric cars are benchmarked on. Where's the pleasure factor? We all know everything is too fat, too digital, too artificial and too boring. A 'ring laptime does nothing in terms of addressing those things. I'm not sure who buys a car based on such a thing? Is it the modern equivalent of the MPG bore?
Like many others around here, I think modern cars and their capabilities are completely wasted on me. I've not owned anything post 2009.
It is rather meaningless but as far as a "because we can" exercise goes it is admirable. FWIW, I'd have thought sub-5 mins should be possible. The margin feels like it should be bigger. That 919 could nudge 240 mph and the full hybrid acceleration is bonkers.
I'm all for pushing boundaries but I just thing it's a shame that the 'ring reference lap is the metric cars are benchmarked on. Where's the pleasure factor? We all know everything is too fat, too digital, too artificial and too boring. A 'ring laptime does nothing in terms of addressing those things. I'm not sure who buys a car based on such a thing? Is it the modern equivalent of the MPG bore?
Like many others around here, I think modern cars and their capabilities are completely wasted on me. I've not owned anything post 2009.
Agree with much of what you say, I think it's fair to say most on this thread want less weight and more involvement and less gimmicks than most of the modern stuff can offer. Race cars are a bit different, this 919 tribute to me is a bit like a modern Can-am car, a 'what if we turned everything up to 11 and see how fast it would go' I think that's what appeals, you could then of course argue what if Porsche went for it on an updated 956/962, more boost, latest tyre damper aero tech, I'd love to see that too, would only be fair after all.
The Nordschleife is a tricky one, there needs to be benchmarks and boundaries need to be pushed, not sure where else in the world it can be done on something that loosely resembles a road ? Raw figures are just part of the story of course and less important than what it feels like but by golly sub 5 mins round there must feel utterly bats
t crazy !
The Nordschleife is a tricky one, there needs to be benchmarks and boundaries need to be pushed, not sure where else in the world it can be done on something that loosely resembles a road ? Raw figures are just part of the story of course and less important than what it feels like but by golly sub 5 mins round there must feel utterly bats
t crazy !
I went to the London concours event in the city yesterday. I only went along as a friend had been given a couple of free tickets but oh my God - some of the cars were just stunning.
A few of my favourites below:
I don’t know much about these but this was so cool. Lancia Aurelia Coupé. It looked quite “hot rod” with a very low roof line lowered suspension - and looked ready for some proper driving.
The F1 was just awesome. Such a clean shape. Such a huge amount of want. And the sad realisation that I’ll probably never even get to sit in one!
This was stunning. I spent ages just looking at all the air flows into and out of the engine. It must generate so much heat and noise. And it’s all right behind your head. I would so love to blag a drive in one. But I guess that’s never going to happen either...
This was probably my favourite car of the show. The actual Stirling Moss 250SWB. Just stunning. 250SWB is possible my all time favourite car. And this was a RHD Competition version with the SEFAC hot rod engine. And raced by stirling Moss. Just awesome.
This grid of cars was pretty cool too. The Esprits looked great and well used as did the TVR. The F40 didn’t look so used but was still awesome!
There were so many amazing cars I didn’t get pics of: AC Cobra, Jag E types, Daytona, te new TVR, f50, that 1912(?) 28.5 litre Fiat monster, Miura, 300sl gullwing, etc etc etc. Aston 177 was incredible too. Way way nicer than I thought it would be.
And to top it off there was free flow champagne at the watch stands all afternoon too.
A few of my favourites below:
I don’t know much about these but this was so cool. Lancia Aurelia Coupé. It looked quite “hot rod” with a very low roof line lowered suspension - and looked ready for some proper driving.
The F1 was just awesome. Such a clean shape. Such a huge amount of want. And the sad realisation that I’ll probably never even get to sit in one!
This was stunning. I spent ages just looking at all the air flows into and out of the engine. It must generate so much heat and noise. And it’s all right behind your head. I would so love to blag a drive in one. But I guess that’s never going to happen either...
This was probably my favourite car of the show. The actual Stirling Moss 250SWB. Just stunning. 250SWB is possible my all time favourite car. And this was a RHD Competition version with the SEFAC hot rod engine. And raced by stirling Moss. Just awesome.
This grid of cars was pretty cool too. The Esprits looked great and well used as did the TVR. The F40 didn’t look so used but was still awesome!
There were so many amazing cars I didn’t get pics of: AC Cobra, Jag E types, Daytona, te new TVR, f50, that 1912(?) 28.5 litre Fiat monster, Miura, 300sl gullwing, etc etc etc. Aston 177 was incredible too. Way way nicer than I thought it would be.
And to top it off there was free flow champagne at the watch stands all afternoon too.
Great pictures chap, it is a fab event.
Some more details on that Aurelia here -
http://www.thornleykelham.com/restoration/lancia/1...
That F1 is local to me, on the road amongst normal traffic it looks utterly gorgeous.
Some more details on that Aurelia here -
http://www.thornleykelham.com/restoration/lancia/1...
That F1 is local to me, on the road amongst normal traffic it looks utterly gorgeous.
rejn said:
The F1 was just awesome. Such a clean shape. Such a huge amount of want. And the sad realisation that I’ll probably never even get to sit in one!
You might be surprised. It's owned by a PHer who is known for his generosity in showing and sharing it. 
rejn said:
This was probably my favourite car of the show. The actual Stirling Moss 250SWB. Just stunning. 250SWB is possible my all time favourite car. And this was a RHD Competition version with the SEFAC hot rod engine. And raced by stirling Moss. Just awesome.
Now owned by a certain Mr. Brawn I believe. Something of a legend himself.Output Flange said:
For me, the biggest shame of it all is that they're out running it round to get lap records rather than competing in LMP1.
While I'm absolutely looking forward to this year's Le Mans, it won't be quite the same as having two or more factories battling for the overall win.
Does undermine the "race" aspect somewhat. Should think the remaining factory team are calculating how far things can be turned down to maximise durability. While I'm absolutely looking forward to this year's Le Mans, it won't be quite the same as having two or more factories battling for the overall win.
The ACO are going to have to take a look at things again, along with WEC, to revive it. Mention of new classes. Have to hope to see some more competitive entrants soon. No small beans to fund a Le Mans win.
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