AddBlue?

[GoneAnon]

samoht said:

HTP99 said:

Most manufacturers use the term "Blue" for their more environmentally friendly cars; blue is fresh and high-tec and more futuristic, green is too earthy and a bit too hippy.

The story I heard is that 'green' has acquired a legal meaning, such that advertising a car as 'green' could be subject to legal action, especially as it still consumes fossil fuels, etc.

Therefore, the manufacturers settled on 'blue' as an alternative word for supposedly-less-environmentally-damaging vehicles.

Planet earth is known as The Blue Planet because it is the only one (in our system!) that looks blue when seen from space.
So the manufacturers use "Blue" for their environmental efforts. According to Mercedes-Benz, at least.

[EUbrainwashing]

Every six months I have a new SEAT Alhambra 2.0TDI 182bhp. When they arrive - delivery miles - the computer tells me I have an AddBlue range of 6,000mls plus but after about half of that, 3500mls, the first one started telling me to refill. I booked it into the local dealer and they did the refill under warranty on the basis that they believed the tank was not filled-up on PDI - apparently the factory dispatch them with the tank only partially filled and this dealer said they always topped the AddBlue up within a PDI new-car inspection. My car did not come from them.

The second model I took delivery of did the same thing, at 3,500mls it was telling me 500mls to go for AddBlue (or the world will end). This time the same SEAT dealership told me they found AddBlue consumption varied in much the same way as fuel usage does - dependent on driving style. I had not been getting very exciting fuel returns so I can assume it would follow that I could be also guzzling AddBlue. Or maybe the vehicle was not filled on PDI - I could not say but still I am guessing it was not.

I paid the dealer about £28.00 to refill, which was completed at very short notice - same morning as I called. In addition the workshop did a free all points 'safety' inspection, topped the washers up, checked the tyres and corrected them to my preferred pressure (for full load) plus they washed and leathered the body and vacuumed the carpet and load area (which the car needed anyway saving me £12 at the hand car wash).

So - the long and short - if it is a new vehicle perhaps the AddBlue tank is not as full as perhaps anticipated/imagined. Many new cars do not come with a full fuel tank free of charge by default from new so why should the AddBlue tank be expected to be full from new either I suppose. Because I am every-time into a new one soon after 6,000mls I cannot say if it really needs filling again so soon or not.

Now that diesel fuel costs more than petrol, needs to be fed AddBlue and is not a real match for a modern-tec petrol model in the 'go' department perhaps the time has come to reappraise the wisdom of the previously 'no brainer' decision over the last 20 years. About 20 years ago I ran a new BMW 530d and there was a very clear advantage in that car over the 530i in economy and, I consider, driving pleasure.

Edited by EUbrainwashing on Monday 10th April 14:08

[RammyMP]

EUbrainwashing said:

Every six months I have a new SEAT Alhambra 2.0TDI 182bhp. When they arrive - delivery miles - the computer tells me I have an AddBlue range of 6,000mls plus but after about half of that, 3500mls, the first one started telling me to refill. I booked it into the local dealer and they did the refill under warranty on the basis that they believed the tank was not filled-up on PDI - apparently the factory dispatch them with the tank only partially filled and this dealer said they always topped the AddBlue up within a PDI new-car inspection. My car did not come from them.

The second model I took delivery of did the same thing, at 3,500mls it was telling me 500mls to go for AddBlue (or the world will end). This time the same SEAT dealership told me they found AddBlue consumption varied in much the same way as fuel usage does - dependent on driving style. I had not been getting very exciting fuel returns so I can assume it would follow that I could be also guzzling AddBlue. Or maybe the vehicle was not filled on PDI - I could not say but still I am guessing it was not.

I paid the dealer about £28.00 to refill, which was completed at very short notice - same morning as I called. In addition the workshop did a free all points 'safety' inspection, topped the washers up, checked the tyres and corrected them to my preferred pressure (for full load) plus they washed and leathered the body and vacuumed the carpet and load area (which the car needed anyway saving me £12 at the hand car wash).

So - the long and short - if it is a new vehicle perhaps the AddBlue tank is not as full as perhaps anticipated/imagined. Many new cars do not come with a full fuel tank free of charge by default from new so why should the AddBlue tank be expected to be full from new either I suppose. Because I am every-time into a new one soon after 6,000mls I cannot say if it really needs filling again so soon or not.

Now that diesel fuel costs more than petrol, needs to be fed AddBlue and is not a real match for a modern-tec petrol model in the 'go' department perhaps the time has come to reappraise the wisdom of the previously 'no brainer' decision over the last 20 years. About 20 years ago I ran a new BMW 530d and there was a very clear advantage in that car over the 530i in economy and, I consider, driving pleasure.

Edited by EUbrainwashing on Monday 10th April 14:08

The adblue tanks are not filled when the cars leave the factory. Why do you get a new Alhambra every 6 months, is this your own decision?

[Sheepshanks]

EUbrainwashing said:

This time the same SEAT dealership told me they found AddBlue consumption varied in much the same way as fuel usage does - dependent on driving style. I had not been getting very exciting fuel returns so I can assume it would follow that I could be also guzzling AddBlue. Or maybe the vehicle was not filled on PDI - I could not say but still I am guessing it was not.

I think AdBlue is just injected at a set ratio to the amount of fuel being used so it follows that if you're getting low MPG then your AdBlue consumption will be high.

Also the first warning should come on with something like 1500 miles to go - if that pops up at 3500 miles then it implies you could go 5000 miles on the 17 litres the Alhambra holds, which is around 300 miles per litre. In comparison, our Tiguan is averaging 40MPG and 400miles per litre of AdBlue.

Not a big deal, but the dealer isn't doing you an favours - certainly VW and Audi have a fixed price of £1.50 per litre. If SEAT do the same, and you take it in fairly soon after the warning then hard to see how they'd get more than about £20 worth in. Perhaps that's the VAG scam - quote an attractive price but charge for a full tank regardless.

[Andy665]

EazyDuz said:

Save up a few bottles of piss and use that, literally the same thing

Nothing could be further from the truth

[peterz3]

my wife's new merc has a add blue symbol next to the fuel cap some thing to do with keeping no2 down ,could be pigs piss so the merc engineer said
peter z3

[Trabi601]

EUbrainwashing said:

Every six months I have a new SEAT Alhambra 2.0TDI 182bhp.

Harsh. What have you done to deserve that?!

(Way, way OT - but there's a guy lives near me who gets a new lease car every few months - he had a whole string of identical, but different coloured Focuses, then a couple of poverty 1-series, followed by some poverty Minis and now a couple of Kia C'eeds - all very odd, almost seems a punishment to get a string of such mundane and boring cars).

[Bristol spark]

Well i filled up with fuel earlier at Shell, and they had 10L container for £14, not filled it yet.

Interestingly its clear, and not actually blue!

[Trabi601]

Andy665 said:

EazyDuz said:

Save up a few bottles of piss and use that, literally the same thing

Nothing could be further from the truth

Everyone knows it's pig piss

[DanSkoda]

I'm sure I've read some literature that AdBlue consumption is "usually" between 0.5 and 3% of fuel economy, obviously if you're giving it death everywhere those figures can be off.

[caelite]

w8pmc said:

So do current Diesels have both DPF & AdBlue?

I did realise the 2 are very different in method & results, but i thought the majority of cars running with AdBlue didn't have DPF. I could of course (& not for the first time) be wrong.

DPF has been around for some time & AdBlue a more recent introduction, but i'm sure i've read a few times that AdBleu is the next generation of cleaning for diesel cars.

You are most likely thinking of EGRs. EGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) valves have been the method of choice for reducing NOx emissions throughout E4/5. They did this by introducing exhaust gases at the inlet to pass through the combustion again, reducing combustion temperatures. EGR, in my opinion, has been instrumental in reducing the operating life of many modern engines.

However with modern SCR systems becoming more accepted some manufacturers are dropping EGR completely in favour of greater adblue consumption on the SCR (see: Iveco, and some Scania's). This making the engine itself more reliable and easier to maintain as it places all the emissions guff down the pipe reducing its direct interaction with the engine.

DPFs perform a different function, they filter particulate. EGR/SCR reduces NOx.

[Willy Nilly]

caelite said:

w8pmc said:

So do current Diesels have both DPF & AdBlue?

I did realise the 2 are very different in method & results, but i thought the majority of cars running with AdBlue didn't have DPF. I could of course (& not for the first time) be wrong.

DPF has been around for some time & AdBlue a more recent introduction, but i'm sure i've read a few times that AdBleu is the next generation of cleaning for diesel cars.

You are most likely thinking of EGRs. EGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculation) valves have been the method of choice for reducing NOx emissions throughout E4/5. They did this by introducing exhaust gases at the inlet to pass through the combustion again, reducing combustion temperatures. EGR, in my opinion, has been instrumental in reducing the operating life of many modern engines.

However with modern SCR systems becoming more accepted some manufacturers are dropping EGR completely in favour of greater adblue consumption on the SCR (see: Iveco, and some Scania's). This making the engine itself more reliable and easier to maintain as it places all the emissions guff down the pipe reducing its direct interaction with the engine.

DPFs perform a different function, they filter particulate. EGR/SCR reduces NOx.

I think, might be wrong, that the particulates can be cleaned up in the engine by running a different calibration, but this increases NOX which is then cleaned up by SCR. As you say, SCR does it's business outside of the engine and if it fails doesn't take the engine down with it, unlike EGR.

[mondeoman]

Willy Nilly said:

I think, might be wrong, that the particulates can be cleaned up in the engine by running a different calibration, but this increases NOX which is then cleaned up by SCR. As you say, SCR does it's business outside of the engine and if it fails doesn't take the engine down with it, unlike EGR.

If it fails, your engine won't start, at all.

[powerstroke]

Trabi601 said:

Andy665 said:

EazyDuz said:

Save up a few bottles of piss and use that, literally the same thing

Nothing could be further from the truth

Everyone knows it's pig piss

Yes if you say so !! everyone else knows its a synthetic UREA and distilled water mix...

[powerstroke]

mondeoman said:

Willy Nilly said:

I think, might be wrong, that the particulates can be cleaned up in the engine by running a different calibration, but this increases NOX which is then cleaned up by SCR. As you say, SCR does it's business outside of the engine and if it fails doesn't take the engine down with it, unlike EGR.

If it fails, your engine won't start, at all.

most faults make the system give a warning light or limp mode , not filling up and allowing it to run out
will cause a non start because its a legal requirement for it !!!

[Willy Nilly]

mondeoman said:

Willy Nilly said:

I think, might be wrong, that the particulates can be cleaned up in the engine by running a different calibration, but this increases NOX which is then cleaned up by SCR. As you say, SCR does it's business outside of the engine and if it fails doesn't take the engine down with it, unlike EGR.

If it fails, your engine won't start, at all.

It won't start because the software won't let it, the engine is unharmed. If you have an issue with EGR it generally plays havoc with the engine.

[RammyMP]

My car has told me the adblue tank needs filling, done 8000 miles since I brilled the 20l tank.

[750turbo]

Trabi601 said:

EUbrainwashing said:

Every six months I have a new SEAT Alhambra 2.0TDI 182bhp.

Harsh. What have you done to deserve that?!
....

Perhaps he works for the OEM? Management (type) car?

[myvision]

2016 2.0 A6 and over the first 20k I've averaged a litre to 500 miles.

[Willy Nilly]

RammyMP said:

My car has told me the adblue tank needs filling, done 8000 miles since I brilled the 20l tank.

Then put some more in it. My company vehicle has a 50 odd litre tank and will sup that dry in 3 days at full load.