Morgan / Peugeot whoopsie
Discussion
Hatson said:
saaby93 said:
Matthen said:
saaby93 said:
Nope, pretty sure it is here - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.3132296,-0.89077...Steet view hasn't yet been updated.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.3131093,-0.89078...
Looks much better layout
98elise said:
DoubleD said:
Most cars dont require you to take a hand off the wheel to press the horn.
Nor does it stop you from braking or steering. Hitting the horn is not going to stop a crash from happening, but it does rob milliseconds and 100% commitment from doing what you should be doing - avoiding the object. I'm sure you could check your Instagram and also brake and steer, but it comes down to whether you would be doing it to the best of your ability.
You see it everyday; people leaning on the horn at roundabouts because of a 'near miss'. If there was genuine chance of a crash, people wouldn't lean on their horn in indignation. It is instead used to make the statement "your're an a-hole, how very dare you."
So my theory is the Peugeot driver didn't actually think it was going to be an accident until it was too late to react appropriately.
That does not stop it being ENTIRELY the Morgan driver's fault.
hondansx said:
If you are about to have a crash, it becomes instinctive - grip steering wheel for dear life and put the brake pedal through the floor.
Hitting the horn is not going to stop a crash from happening, but it does rob milliseconds and 100% commitment from doing what you should be doing - avoiding the object. I'm sure you could check your Instagram and also brake and steer, but it comes down to whether you would be doing it to the best of your ability.
Yes, moving your thumb half an inch to the horn push on the steering wheel is just like checking Instagram. It typically results in total paralysis of the right leg and the consequent inability to brake means loss of control of the vehicle. Hitting the horn is not going to stop a crash from happening, but it does rob milliseconds and 100% commitment from doing what you should be doing - avoiding the object. I'm sure you could check your Instagram and also brake and steer, but it comes down to whether you would be doing it to the best of your ability.
hondansx said:
If there was genuine chance of a crash, people wouldn't lean on their horn in indignation. It is instead used to make the statement "your're an a-hole, how very dare you."
Yes, the horn was used only for retribution in this case. The Peugeot driver already knew an accident was inevitable and didn't use the horn in an attempt to draw the Morgan driver's attention to his lack of observation, and they certainly weren't hoping that the Morgan driver might pull to one side to create a bit of extra space. This was almost completely equivalent to the horn use you get when two d
heads meet at a merge point in roadworks and neither wants to damage their manhood by giving way.
Edited by Mr2Mike on Thursday 20th April 13:12
hondansx said:
If you are about to have a crash, it becomes instinctive - grip steering wheel for dear life and put the brake pedal through the floor.
Hitting the horn is not going to stop a crash from happening, but it does rob milliseconds and 100% commitment from doing what you should be doing - avoiding the object. I'm sure you could check your Instagram and also brake and steer, but it comes down to whether you would be doing it to the best of your ability.
You see it everyday; people leaning on the horn at roundabouts because of a 'near miss'. If there was genuine chance of a crash, people wouldn't lean on their horn in indignation. It is instead used to make the statement "your're an a-hole, how very dare you."
So my theory is the Peugeot driver didn't actually think it was going to be an accident until it was too late to react appropriately.
That does not stop it being ENTIRELY the Morgan driver's fault.
yep if youve got time to hoot youve probably got time to avoidHitting the horn is not going to stop a crash from happening, but it does rob milliseconds and 100% commitment from doing what you should be doing - avoiding the object. I'm sure you could check your Instagram and also brake and steer, but it comes down to whether you would be doing it to the best of your ability.
You see it everyday; people leaning on the horn at roundabouts because of a 'near miss'. If there was genuine chance of a crash, people wouldn't lean on their horn in indignation. It is instead used to make the statement "your're an a-hole, how very dare you."
So my theory is the Peugeot driver didn't actually think it was going to be an accident until it was too late to react appropriately.
That does not stop it being ENTIRELY the Morgan driver's fault.
It looked as though the Pug had spotted the Morgan coming across and was worried it was going to keep coming out so hooted as a prevention measure
The Morgan is quite low so may have had restricted view of the exact position of the Pug due to barriers until he was already in the wrong place , so then thought he'd boot it to try to get out the way
The HC accepts people make mistakes so includes collision avoidance
So it wasnt 'entirely' down to the Morgan the collision occurred, although you could apportion the initial mistake to the Morgan
As usual there a percentage with the other vehicle and by the look of things a significant percentage with that road layout
saaby93 said:
yep if youve got time to hoot youve probably got time to avoid
Do PH drivers have the slowest thumbs in the world or something? I just can't comprehend how mentally challenged you would have to be if pushing the horn button meant you couldn't perform an emergency braking manoeuvre.Timbergiant said:
If the Morgan hadn't pulled out without looking into oncoming traffic, .
Its not clear he didnt lookbut equally if someone does pull out in front of you, youve no automatic right to crash into them
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/gener...
HC said:
The rules in The Highway Code do not give you the right of way in any circumstance, but they advise you when you should give way to others. Always give way if it can help to avoid an incident.
as long as the Peugeot tried to do the always theyre okTimbergiant said:
If the Morgan hadn't pulled out without looking into oncoming traffic, the accident wouldn't have happened, it was entirely his fault, trying to blame the Peugeot is like blaming Morgan for not making cars good enough to perform dangerous manoeuvres in complete safety.
I don't think a single person has tried to blame the Pug driver. Almost all posts have concurred that the Morgan driver was 100% at fault. What is actually taking place is a wholly separate discussion around why the Pug driver was fanning about with a horn, whether they could have steered away or were they braking hard enough.
People have gone to great lengths to attempt to explain this separate discussion has noting to do with who is at fault.
V8Matthew said:
The Peugeot driver's reactions and the road layout may have been factors in the accident. The root cause was the Morgan driver's actions.
which from the looks of things may also have been influenced by the road layoutRarely are these things 100% one way - there'll be things that may have led up to something happening in the way it did.
It's doubtful the Morgan driver intention was for that to happen, so why did it? Add up all the things already listed
V8Matthew said:
The Peugeot driver's reactions and the road layout may have been factors in the accident. The root cause was the Morgan driver's actions.
Like most of us, I don't think the Morgan driver is an idiot, I think for reasons unbeknown to us keyboard warriors the driver just didn't see the pug. No one in their right mind would pull out in front of a car, and if he had seen it he would almost certainly have assessed its speed.The fact he pulled straight over the junction and turned right indicates to me he just didn't clock the pug coming.
But of course I could be totally wrong.
I live local to this and drove past the aftermath of it, I have had to do similar to the peugeot on several occasions over the years, especially when I worked in amazingstoke the layout isn't great tbh but the Morgan obviously wasn't looking quite hard enough and in my opinion the Morgan driver is still to blame regardless of the poor layout he didn't look hard enough and pulled out, there is also a hill you descend down to that turning which is still dual carriageway and everyone and there aunty will burn down in the outside lane at 85 odd and throw it across at the last minute and cut everyone else up just as it goes to 1 lane, should of left it all dual carriage as it still is on google earth
Edited by loose cannon on Thursday 20th April 19:14
saaby93 said:
What is interesting is that the road layout has been amended to that seen on Google maps - previously it was a dual carriageway at that point with only arrows to show that the road is about to narrow down to single carriageway, rather than any hatched area. Also, the speed limit (on Google Maps) shows National Speed Limit from Hartley Wintney, rather than anything lower - not sure if that is still the case now. At least suggests that there has been some recognition at some point that the road was too dangerous as is was and needed to be changed.Slammed on my brakes and swerved around the transit flatbed thankfully,
I've also had to avoid a 4 seater black Sofa at about 3 in the morning laying across both lanes going the same way ,
There has been countless cars crash there over the years in various different forms I've seen cars resting on top of the bridge wall, more than once and seen them in the stream also seen them crashed into the old pub/ antiques building
I've also had to avoid a 4 seater black Sofa at about 3 in the morning laying across both lanes going the same way ,
There has been countless cars crash there over the years in various different forms I've seen cars resting on top of the bridge wall, more than once and seen them in the stream also seen them crashed into the old pub/ antiques building
Edited by loose cannon on Thursday 20th April 19:38
Edited by loose cannon on Thursday 20th April 19:39
Mad March Taffy said:
What is interesting is that the road layout has been amended to that seen on Google maps - previously it was a dual carriageway at that point with only arrows to show that the road is about to narrow down to single carriageway, rather than any hatched area. Also, the speed limit (on Google Maps) shows National Speed Limit from Hartley Wintney, rather than anything lower - not sure if that is still the case now. At least suggests that there has been some recognition at some point that the road was too dangerous as is was and needed to be changed.
Has anyone suggested that whats been put in place has made it safer?loose cannon said:
Slammed on my brakes and swerved around the transit flatbed thankfully,
I've also had to avoid a 4 seater black Sofa at about 3 in the morning laying across both lanes going the same way ,
There has been countless cars crash there over the years in various different forms I've seen cars resting on top of the bridge wall, more than once and seen them in the stream also seen them crashed into the old pub/ antiques building
at least you did the avoiding thing I've also had to avoid a 4 seater black Sofa at about 3 in the morning laying across both lanes going the same way ,
There has been countless cars crash there over the years in various different forms I've seen cars resting on top of the bridge wall, more than once and seen them in the stream also seen them crashed into the old pub/ antiques building
so why there - what makes this particular junction iffy?
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