RE: Toyota MR2: Catch it While You Can

RE: Toyota MR2: Catch it While You Can

Thursday 11th May 2017

Toyota MR2: Catch it While You Can

The sun's finally out, which means you'll be wanting a convertible. We've got just the thing



Look, we know that if you're shopping for a sporty little number with two seats and a soft top for anything less than £2,000 or so, the chances are you're probably going to end up with a Mazda MX-5. After all - altogether, now - Miata is always the answer.

Hello Mister Two!
Hello Mister Two!
Except that, sometimes, it isn't. Because right now, the answer should really be MR2. Mk3 MR2, to be specific; a car whose mid-engined layout, taut setup and fabulously revvy engine give it more than an edge over the MX-5 in terms of car enthusiast cred.

The Mk3 MR2 isn't for everyone, mind you. For starters, let's talk about its looks. Were someone to pitch to you the idea of a two-seat roadster with a Boxster-u-like nose and tail, the former of which brings to mind the expression a frog might take on were it to be surprised by another frog in a particular way, you probably wouldn't say 'Now I like the sound of that; when can we start building it?'

However, that's exactly what Toyota's bosses did. The result is a car that has to do without either the classic sports car proportions of the MX-5, or the lithe, taut athleticism of the Lotus Elise, but instead exudes a chunky charm that some will love, but others will loathe.

More than skin deep
But of course, there's more to the MR2 than its looks, and we picked the MX-5 and Elise for comparison for a reason - because the MR2 sits somewhere in the middle ground between the two cars. Tauter, stiffer and faster than the Mk2 MX-5 which was its contemporary rival, the MR2 is nevertheless more usable, more benign and (all things being equal) more reliable than an Elise. It's the best of both worlds, in other words - and no matter what you might think of its looks.

Post-2003 facelift worth seeking out
Post-2003 facelift worth seeking out
With all that in mind, you might expect the MR2 to fall somewhere between the two cars in terms of its value. And it does. However, at the moment, it's most certainly skewed toward the MX-5 end of the spectrum, which makes it feel like something of a bargain.

You can pick up a Mk3 MR2 these days for as little as £800 or so. We wouldn't recommend it, mind you, because at this price it'll almost certainly be a scabby old parper, with high mileage, several uncaring owners and perhaps even a Cat C or D marker against its registration.

However, you don't need to spend all that much more to get a shipshape example. We found a very tidy-looking pre-facelift with 95,000 miles on the clock, a long MOT, a full service history and even the optional hard-top going for just £1,640, and it was just one of several very tempting-looking examples offered between there and the £2,000 mark.

Frog's legs
If that's all you can stretch to, you'll have a fabulous little car in a pre-facelift MR2. But then again, if you can push your budget further, the post-facelift car is the one to have. That's because it came with a six-speed gearbox, instead of five, and got a series of suspension tweaks and wider rear wheels.

Pack light. Pack really, really light
Pack light. Pack really, really light
To say this transforms the MR2 is an overstatement, but there's certainly a noticeable difference in the way the two cars drive. The post-facelift car feels more honed, more edgy and more direct, with a gearbox better suited to cruising and and greater traction at the rear end.

There's another reason to choose the post-facelift car, too, which is that it seems these examples were far less likely to wreck their engines in sudden and spectacular fashion, an MR2 tendency which results from the pre-cats breaking down, and their ceramic shards being sucked back into the engine through the exhaust gas recirculation system.

There are ways and means to avoid this - for the sake of brevity, we won't go into too much detail here, but there's plenty of information on enthusiasts' forums - but anecdotal evidence suggests tweaks made to the engine by Toyota at facelift time solved the problem, and these cars have far fewer instances of failure.

Light, fun, cheap - go get one!
Light, fun, cheap - go get one!
How much for one of these, then? Well, again, prices start low - £1,300 or so for a daggy example - but you'll need to up that to £2,500 or so if you want a respectable example. At the other end of the scale, the very best - this 25,000-miler, for example, shouldn't cost you more than £6,000.

When Mk1 Elises are moving into double figures, that doesn't sound like too bad a deal. And while it'll be a while yet before numbers dwindle and the MR2 starts the inevitable, inexorable climb toward classic status, one day the true talents of this stocky little sports car will be better-known and more widely sought-after, so you'd best get into one while you still can. To correct the meme, then, Miata is sometimes the answer - but right now, MR2 is a better one.

Author
Discussion

Luke.

Original Poster:

11,002 posts

251 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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...and the rust.... MX5 must be one of the worst cars around for this.

james_gt3rs

4,816 posts

192 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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A lot of rubbish in this article... all the UK cars had an LSD, and the prefacelift is more pointy than post because the newer cars have bigger rear tyres...

TameRacingDriver

18,094 posts

273 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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I've had mine for 6 months now, and its a wonderful car to drive, probably one of, if not the most fun car to drive I've ever had. I've had a couple of Mk1 MX5s, including a rare RS Limited, which was tricked up to the eyeballs with performance enhancing goodies, but for me the MR2 is more fun to drive even than that was.

Few corrections though. Firstly, more usable than an Elise? Not likely, the roof is easier and better, and its easier to get in and out of, but it has virtually no luggage space whatsoever, even the Elise will best it. Secondly, they all had LSDs except for the imports. Third and finally, the post facelift ones still can and do suffer from pre-cat failure so its recommended to get those removed if you can do. Also a good idea to keep a close eye on oil consumption as some 1ZZs can use a lot (mine does).

These are so good out of the box, that honestly, the only mods I feel are truly essential are a decent exhaust (standard one far too muted), some good tyres and an alignment. I do have a chassis brace to fit which some say makes a good difference but honestly, I'm not sure its strictly necessary.

The looks of it have grown on me, but they ARE an acquired taste!

Honestly though, this has to be the best drivers car you can get for under £2k if you can live without almost any practicality and are not too fussed on straight line speed; its not slow, but its certainly not fast either, but it has a perfect blend of performance, handling and braking ability.

Dave Hedgehog

14,569 posts

205 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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OH had 2 of these, the last one she put 120k miles on it

a lot of fun, needs a decent vtec engine thou to really make it shine

rallycross

12,813 posts

238 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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These are a great little sports car, drive one and be impressed.
I've had Elise (in Vx220 shape) and the MR2 is about 100 times easier to live with day to day, its a proper car as well as being a great handling sports mid engined 2 seater (MR2)


StrokesUK

44 posts

94 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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The precat problems are generally caused by gummed up oil control rings causing oil to be burned. These are poorly designed and whilst improved for the facelift, do still get gummed up. Unfortunately at around 90k miles on the 1zz engine (depending on how its lived its life, obviously some can last much longer!) you will need to rebuild the engine to fix this (and do stem seals etc while you're there). Myself and a friend both with facelift cars both had exactly the same problem, and I even saw the evidence as it broke down the precat.
Its ugly, there is zero luggage space and the gearing is far too long (90 in third with 6 gears).
It also handles incredibly well, the roof is a superb design and will cruise all day long on the motorway without shattering your spine.

Buy one, drop a 2zz-ge in it.

Edit: oh, and while rust isn't generally a problem (all the panels are bolt on!) The rear subframes do rot badly, so budget £300 to replace it.

Edited by StrokesUK on Thursday 11th May 10:19

culpz

4,884 posts

113 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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I think i'd prefer one over the MX-5, although i think the Mazda does look better IMO, in any generation. That's not to say the Toyota looks bad. It probably looks more like a sports car and it does give the impression of the whole mini-Elise comments that are so commonly talked about.

The MX-5's are a it more practical but i always find that a bit of a silly comment. If you're considering something like this then you really need to be going in with your eyes wide open. I think the MR2's performance is much more like it, not that it's blisteringly quick, but it's nice to have a little bit more go to complement the handling.

Prices of the MR2's look like good value. However, opting for a facelift, that sorts out pretty much all of the main issues, do seem to command a premium and seem to be a bit more few and far between when i've looked. Saying that, i think i'd rather pay a bit more and not have to worry about catastrophic and terminal rust that comes with the MX-5.

RobM77

35,349 posts

235 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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Awesome cars smile I absolutely love them.

Blayney

2,948 posts

187 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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Stop it. I'm saving for one and everyone is talking about how wonderful they are!

jjpae86

3 posts

109 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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Does sound like a great bargain but one of the things that put me off was the engine...

Why didn't they put the 2zz in (as used in the Celica) instead of the gutless 1zz. Funnily enough I think this has been a popular engine swap for the MK3 MR2.

Personally though I think a late gen MK2 is the best of it's incarnations. My brother had one and there's nothing quite like hearing that induction roar so close behind your ears!!

TurboHatchback

4,162 posts

154 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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I've had my facelift car for 18 months now and it's brilliant, no plans at all to sell it which is unusual for me. The only problems I've had have been a broken rear caliper and a rotted sump. It's a fantastic thing to drive, what else offers mid engine balance and traction, a limited slip diff, a lovely manual box and blue sky overhead for less than £2k? The seats are decent, the steering is lovely and even at 6'4" I fit in it unlike the MX5 (albeit snugly).

Another advantage over the MX5 is the fuel consumption, they really don't use much at all. When I measured it I was having no trouble getting 40+ mpg out of mine on decent runs. All things considered I think they offer the best fun/£ of any car available on the road today.

Ekona

1,653 posts

203 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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All UK cars had an LSD, it was only in Japland (well, and the US but you don't see many left hookers over here!) that the LSD was an option. I've had four of the bloody things now, every time I sell one after either strapping a turbo to it or stripping it for trackwork (or both in the case of the last one), I always end up buying another one a year or so later. Very addictive little things.

There's an excellent guide written by a dashingly handsome chap over on MR2-ROC.org that covers off the pre-cat stuff nicely, too. wink

mikeyr

3,118 posts

194 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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This car is right up there on the 'things I'd like to buy' list, the dog would love riding in the passenger seat!

TurboHatchback

4,162 posts

154 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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jjpae86 said:
Does sound like a great bargain but one of the things that put me off was the engine...

Why didn't they put the 2zz in (as used in the Celica) instead of the gutless 1zz. Funnily enough I think this has been a popular engine swap for the MK3 MR2.
I disagree, I think the engine suits the car very well for road use. Gutless is the wrong word for it, if it lacks anything it's a screaming top end, it revs enthusiastically to the redline but it's not especially high and there's no variable timing 'kick'. It pulls really well from low revs and because the car is so light it feels fairly strong in the low to mid range. 170Nm might not be much in absolute terms but in a 975kg car it goes a long way.

I'm not saying the car would be worse for the fitting of a 2ZZ but I think it would only really bring benefits for track use not on the road as the extra power is so far up the rev range as to be somewhat unusable on the road. Personally I never do flat out 1st to 2nd changes so the extra power would only kick in when you're already doing at least 60mph at which point it's too late.

RobM77

35,349 posts

235 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
quotequote all
jjpae86 said:
Does sound like a great bargain but one of the things that put me off was the engine...

Why didn't they put the 2zz in (as used in the Celica) instead of the gutless 1zz. Funnily enough I think this has been a popular engine swap for the MK3 MR2.

Personally though I think a late gen MK2 is the best of it's incarnations. My brother had one and there's nothing quite like hearing that induction roar so close behind your ears!!
I'm assuming that would have lifted the price too close to other cars that would have been stiffer competition than those down at the MR2's actual selling price. At that point, suddenly things like the lack of boot would start to become a problem in the market. For example, an Elise has more storage space and at the time MR2s were about £18k new, the Elise was £25k new.

Amateurish

7,755 posts

223 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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I enjoyed mine until the engine ate itself. Buyer beware.

TameRacingDriver

18,094 posts

273 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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TurboHatchback said:
I disagree, I think the engine suits the car very well for road use. Gutless is the wrong word for it, if it lacks anything it's a screaming top end, it revs enthusiastically to the redline but it's not especially high and there's no variable timing 'kick'. It pulls really well from low revs and because the car is so light it feels fairly strong in the low to mid range. 170Nm might not be much in absolute terms but in a 975kg car it goes a long way.

I'm not saying the car would be worse for the fitting of a 2ZZ but I think it would only really bring benefits for track use not on the road as the extra power is so far up the rev range as to be somewhat unusable on the road. Personally I never do flat out 1st to 2nd changes so the extra power would only kick in when you're already doing at least 60mph at which point it's too late.
I agree with you. The 2ZZ is a nice engine, but the 1ZZ is just fine for road use, fast enough, still revs well, but no need to try and keep it on the boil to make fast progress. I'd even go so far as to say that I'd rather the 1ZZ in a road car simply because of its easier going nature. To really appreciate the difference between the two, you are going to have to drive flat out, which unfortunately these days isn't a good idea on most roads, if you want to keep your licence. The 1ZZ makes it easy to make rapid progress without trying to extract every last rev out of the engine. Of course, you could keep the 2ZZ below 6,000 but then you would be missing the main attraction of the engine.

For a track car I'd definitely go 2ZZ but for road use only, I'll stick with the 1ZZ until it dies.

TaylotS2K

1,964 posts

208 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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Never really saw the appeal of these, especially when they tried to make it look like a rubbish, less curvy Porsche Boxter.

DPSFleet

192 posts

162 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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got to be a real bargain, I have seen these so cheap, must be a catch?

MarshPhantom

9,658 posts

138 months

Thursday 11th May 2017
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Ours has been great, had it nearly two years.

Not sure why people don't like the looks either. "Boxster u like", far better looking and has aged well rather than badly.