SUVs - Whats the point?
Discussion
Couple of reasons why I have one
It can swallow 2 small kids and all their junk, plus a weekly shop.
Big boot hatch with no lip is far better for loading things in and out
Its more comfy than any hatch or estate I have previously owned, great on long distances
I have sensible wheels on my kuga (18's) so despite going up and down numerous kerbs and the delights of parking, along with the danger of letting the wife loose with it, not a scratch on the alloys themselves.
Entirely selfish but should I have a crash I think an suv will fair better than a smaller car.
It is a million times better on our crappy roads, nice chunky tyres soak up the worst of potholes.
On the odd occasion I find myself "off road" the increased ride height is handy.
And as for all the plastics and fake off reader looks argument, I would say there is a similar argument for making a 1.8l german hatchback look like a touring car with all the styling crap, all those vents, exhausts, diffusers, spoilers and 20 inch wheels to make it look "sphorty" when in reality it's got as much power as a hairdryer.
It can swallow 2 small kids and all their junk, plus a weekly shop.
Big boot hatch with no lip is far better for loading things in and out
Its more comfy than any hatch or estate I have previously owned, great on long distances
I have sensible wheels on my kuga (18's) so despite going up and down numerous kerbs and the delights of parking, along with the danger of letting the wife loose with it, not a scratch on the alloys themselves.
Entirely selfish but should I have a crash I think an suv will fair better than a smaller car.
It is a million times better on our crappy roads, nice chunky tyres soak up the worst of potholes.
On the odd occasion I find myself "off road" the increased ride height is handy.
And as for all the plastics and fake off reader looks argument, I would say there is a similar argument for making a 1.8l german hatchback look like a touring car with all the styling crap, all those vents, exhausts, diffusers, spoilers and 20 inch wheels to make it look "sphorty" when in reality it's got as much power as a hairdryer.
Edited by dazwalsh on Monday 12th June 18:52
I hate pseudo 4x4's. But people buy them because they like sitting up high, comfortable when every Council decides to plaster crappy speed hump everywhere. Potholed, rutted and damaged roads are the norm.. Most importantly is image. It's the prison trainer of clothing, it shouts "maybe I do go offroad and wrestle bears", most of all it's a uniform to be accepted by others and a lot of people need validation in their life.
Sure the odd person like Carter in outer Scotlandshire goes off road in his but that is the exception to the norm. I absolutely defend your right to buy a psuedo 4x4 and hope you enjoy it, just as it's my right not to like them.
Sure the odd person like Carter in outer Scotlandshire goes off road in his but that is the exception to the norm. I absolutely defend your right to buy a psuedo 4x4 and hope you enjoy it, just as it's my right not to like them.
Willy Nilly said:
My favourite subject.
I was brought up on a dairy farm., so dad had a herd of cows and we lived down an unclassified road. We didn't have a 4 wheel drive anything.
I've worked on farms all of my life and you couldn't give me an SUV. When I worked in the US we were sometimes 35 miles away from a tarmac road and the company pickups were all 2wd. 4wd was too expensive to run and if it was so wet we needed 4wd, it was too wet to work. We 2 feet of snow over night on 2 occasions while I worked there and you would have been insane to take to the roads during that. We saw a bloke in a 4wd F150 try to tackle the snow drifts. He dug himself out eventually.
I went skiing to France a few years ago and the only SUVs in the car parks had UK plates on them. As it happens I've just come back from Austria riding around mountain passes and closed ski resorts and didn't see many SUV's at all, everyone had hatchbacks with winter tyres. A bigger heavier car is worse in snow an ice than a lighter car.
I've just driven back to HQ through the village on my tractors. As tractors go, it's not that big, but still a big 'ole lump and my feet are about the same height as a Range Rover drivers shoulder. I can see a bit further down the road, but the sheer size of the vehicle negates it all because the vegetation makes the road narrower. In a crash it would be ok as long as what ever I hit was smaller, otherwise, I'd rather crash my car.
I drove a current model Cayenne for a few ours late last year. It's a comfy cruiser, but I cannot see the appeal at all. My Jazz is a little car, but has an incredibly packaged interior so it has an unfeasible amount of interior space. The Cayenne on the other hand is a very big car with and unfeasibly small amount of interior space relative to its size. As for the handling
. Jesus Christ 
. Yes it's got way more poke than mine, but ask it to change direction and it's height and weight make themselves abundantly clear and there's no amount of German electricery that can hide it.
The loading thing always makes me chuckle too. I have never found lifting up something higher to be easier than lifting up something lower. We have an LWB Transit dropside pickup. Chuffin' brilliant it is, but she's a big (not very) old bus and pain in the sack to park even in industrial estates and loading it by hand means lifting what ever yo want in it to chest height.Chucking things in the back of a Connect would be much easier. I cannot for one minute imagine that loading kids in a parking space into an XC90 would be easier than into my Jazz parked in the same space. Bosses daughter had a D4 now a D5 and a too well bred dog. Said dog can't get in to the Disco's without being lifted up, A) because the dog is useless and B) because the car is too high. My Jack Russell never had an issue getting into my MKII Golf.
They are currently the cars to have, but way to many compromises have to be made for me.
Few points:I was brought up on a dairy farm., so dad had a herd of cows and we lived down an unclassified road. We didn't have a 4 wheel drive anything.
I've worked on farms all of my life and you couldn't give me an SUV. When I worked in the US we were sometimes 35 miles away from a tarmac road and the company pickups were all 2wd. 4wd was too expensive to run and if it was so wet we needed 4wd, it was too wet to work. We 2 feet of snow over night on 2 occasions while I worked there and you would have been insane to take to the roads during that. We saw a bloke in a 4wd F150 try to tackle the snow drifts. He dug himself out eventually.
I went skiing to France a few years ago and the only SUVs in the car parks had UK plates on them. As it happens I've just come back from Austria riding around mountain passes and closed ski resorts and didn't see many SUV's at all, everyone had hatchbacks with winter tyres. A bigger heavier car is worse in snow an ice than a lighter car.
I've just driven back to HQ through the village on my tractors. As tractors go, it's not that big, but still a big 'ole lump and my feet are about the same height as a Range Rover drivers shoulder. I can see a bit further down the road, but the sheer size of the vehicle negates it all because the vegetation makes the road narrower. In a crash it would be ok as long as what ever I hit was smaller, otherwise, I'd rather crash my car.
I drove a current model Cayenne for a few ours late last year. It's a comfy cruiser, but I cannot see the appeal at all. My Jazz is a little car, but has an incredibly packaged interior so it has an unfeasible amount of interior space. The Cayenne on the other hand is a very big car with and unfeasibly small amount of interior space relative to its size. As for the handling
. Jesus Christ . Yes it's got way more poke than mine, but ask it to change direction and it's height and weight make themselves abundantly clear and there's no amount of German electricery that can hide it. The loading thing always makes me chuckle too. I have never found lifting up something higher to be easier than lifting up something lower. We have an LWB Transit dropside pickup. Chuffin' brilliant it is, but she's a big (not very) old bus and pain in the sack to park even in industrial estates and loading it by hand means lifting what ever yo want in it to chest height.Chucking things in the back of a Connect would be much easier. I cannot for one minute imagine that loading kids in a parking space into an XC90 would be easier than into my Jazz parked in the same space. Bosses daughter had a D4 now a D5 and a too well bred dog. Said dog can't get in to the Disco's without being lifted up, A) because the dog is useless and B) because the car is too high. My Jack Russell never had an issue getting into my MKII Golf.
They are currently the cars to have, but way to many compromises have to be made for me.
- Winter tyres trump anything....in snow. We don't get snow in 90% of the UK...ergo, no-one buys cars based on their use in snow.
- Look at farmers in the UK. They have Defenders. It's a UK Law. If you turn up to a cattle market in a Jazz you will end up being inserted up a cow's jacksee.
- One level more extreme. The Military. They tend to favour Defenders and other '4x4's. I've not seen many military liveried Jazz cars, regardless of how capacious their Tardis-like interiors are.
- People don't tend to have Transits Dropsides/Connects/etc laying around, let alone a tractor. We tend to have one car. If we have a second, it's smaller, less practical and way more fun.
-When carrying anything remotely cumbersome, or a child. They tend to be in your arms, above waist height. When loading a child, a bike, a box of crap for the tip, etc, it will tend to be sat at elbow height (carrying said item with forearms horizontal)....which is the same as the floor in an SUV's boot, which you gain access to with a bigger opening, and without banging your head on the tailgate. Ditto putting a child into a car. Carry your 5 year old out of the house and into the car, he/she will be in your arms. They will be at SUV rear seat height. To put them into a normal car means bending over and lowering them down. I know, I don't have an SUV, haven't done for 5 years, and have a 7yr old.
Enjoy your go-anywhere Jazz!
To the posters on the first pages telling us about how great the CRV is. Pulling an x5 up a hill etc... Is this the same CRV that doesn't even have real 4wd. Where Honda released an official statement to that effect. If a CRV pulled an X5 up a hill then it was purely down to the X5 having bald tyres and being goosed, or the CRV having an awesome set of shoes on
https://www.carthrottle.com/post/attention-all-hon...
https://www.carthrottle.com/post/attention-all-hon...
Ares said:
Few points:
- Winter tyres trump anything....in snow. We don't get snow in 90% of the UK...ergo, no-one buys cars based on their use in snow.
- Look at farmers in the UK. They have Defenders. It's a UK Law. If you turn up to a cattle market in a Jazz you will end up being inserted up a cow's jacksee.
- One level more extreme. The Military. They tend to favour Defenders and other '4x4's. I've not seen many military liveried Jazz cars, regardless of how capacious their Tardis-like interiors are.
- People don't tend to have Transits Dropsides/Connects/etc laying around, let alone a tractor. We tend to have one car. If we have a second, it's smaller, less practical and way more fun.
-When carrying anything remotely cumbersome, or a child. They tend to be in your arms, above waist height. When loading a child, a bike, a box of crap for the tip, etc, it will tend to be sat at elbow height (carrying said item with forearms horizontal)....which is the same as the floor in an SUV's boot, which you gain access to with a bigger opening, and without banging your head on the tailgate. Ditto putting a child into a car. Carry your 5 year old out of the house and into the car, he/she will be in your arms. They will be at SUV rear seat height. To put them into a normal car means bending over and lowering them down. I know, I don't have an SUV, haven't done for 5 years, and have a 7yr old.
Enjoy your go-anywhere Jazz!
Farmers don't have Defenders anymore because they are expensive, unreliable, uncomfortable pieces of s- Winter tyres trump anything....in snow. We don't get snow in 90% of the UK...ergo, no-one buys cars based on their use in snow.
- Look at farmers in the UK. They have Defenders. It's a UK Law. If you turn up to a cattle market in a Jazz you will end up being inserted up a cow's jacksee.
- One level more extreme. The Military. They tend to favour Defenders and other '4x4's. I've not seen many military liveried Jazz cars, regardless of how capacious their Tardis-like interiors are.
- People don't tend to have Transits Dropsides/Connects/etc laying around, let alone a tractor. We tend to have one car. If we have a second, it's smaller, less practical and way more fun.
-When carrying anything remotely cumbersome, or a child. They tend to be in your arms, above waist height. When loading a child, a bike, a box of crap for the tip, etc, it will tend to be sat at elbow height (carrying said item with forearms horizontal)....which is the same as the floor in an SUV's boot, which you gain access to with a bigger opening, and without banging your head on the tailgate. Ditto putting a child into a car. Carry your 5 year old out of the house and into the car, he/she will be in your arms. They will be at SUV rear seat height. To put them into a normal car means bending over and lowering them down. I know, I don't have an SUV, haven't done for 5 years, and have a 7yr old.
Enjoy your go-anywhere Jazz!
t. Dad dad a succession of Skoda Estelles, Favorits, Felicias and now Fabias along with 2 Skoda Pickups.The point I was trying to make with the Transit, that its size, while being a bloody brilliant utility vehicle and bob on for the job it does, makes it difficult to park and load and I'd rather load anything by hand into a Connect/Berlingo etc.
Same with the tractor reference. It's very high which gives a good view, but the size of the machine negates this advantage.
Willy Nilly said:
Ares said:
Few points:
- Winter tyres trump anything....in snow. We don't get snow in 90% of the UK...ergo, no-one buys cars based on their use in snow.
- Look at farmers in the UK. They have Defenders. It's a UK Law. If you turn up to a cattle market in a Jazz you will end up being inserted up a cow's jacksee.
- One level more extreme. The Military. They tend to favour Defenders and other '4x4's. I've not seen many military liveried Jazz cars, regardless of how capacious their Tardis-like interiors are.
- People don't tend to have Transits Dropsides/Connects/etc laying around, let alone a tractor. We tend to have one car. If we have a second, it's smaller, less practical and way more fun.
-When carrying anything remotely cumbersome, or a child. They tend to be in your arms, above waist height. When loading a child, a bike, a box of crap for the tip, etc, it will tend to be sat at elbow height (carrying said item with forearms horizontal)....which is the same as the floor in an SUV's boot, which you gain access to with a bigger opening, and without banging your head on the tailgate. Ditto putting a child into a car. Carry your 5 year old out of the house and into the car, he/she will be in your arms. They will be at SUV rear seat height. To put them into a normal car means bending over and lowering them down. I know, I don't have an SUV, haven't done for 5 years, and have a 7yr old.
Enjoy your go-anywhere Jazz!
Farmers don't have Defenders anymore because they are expensive, unreliable, uncomfortable pieces of s- Winter tyres trump anything....in snow. We don't get snow in 90% of the UK...ergo, no-one buys cars based on their use in snow.
- Look at farmers in the UK. They have Defenders. It's a UK Law. If you turn up to a cattle market in a Jazz you will end up being inserted up a cow's jacksee.
- One level more extreme. The Military. They tend to favour Defenders and other '4x4's. I've not seen many military liveried Jazz cars, regardless of how capacious their Tardis-like interiors are.
- People don't tend to have Transits Dropsides/Connects/etc laying around, let alone a tractor. We tend to have one car. If we have a second, it's smaller, less practical and way more fun.
-When carrying anything remotely cumbersome, or a child. They tend to be in your arms, above waist height. When loading a child, a bike, a box of crap for the tip, etc, it will tend to be sat at elbow height (carrying said item with forearms horizontal)....which is the same as the floor in an SUV's boot, which you gain access to with a bigger opening, and without banging your head on the tailgate. Ditto putting a child into a car. Carry your 5 year old out of the house and into the car, he/she will be in your arms. They will be at SUV rear seat height. To put them into a normal car means bending over and lowering them down. I know, I don't have an SUV, haven't done for 5 years, and have a 7yr old.
Enjoy your go-anywhere Jazz!
t. Dad dad a succession of Skoda Estelles, Favorits, Felicias and now Fabias along with 2 Skoda Pickups.The point I was trying to make with the Transit, that its size, while being a bloody brilliant utility vehicle and bob on for the job it does, makes it difficult to park and load and I'd rather load anything by hand into a Connect/Berlingo etc.
Same with the tractor reference. It's very high which gives a good view, but the size of the machine negates this advantage.
I take your point regarding a Transit, but equally few of us have a Connect/Berlingo lying around either, nor are we likely to buy one just for the few times we need to carry a van load of crap. Especially when an SUV is 99% has good for the normal person for load carrying...and a damned sight better the rest of the time.
Thanks for the tip on the Tractor. I was just about to cancel my order for a Quadrifoglio for one, but if it's too big I'll stick with the Alfa!
This site is just full of handy tips!
MorganP104 said:
Retrieving your car once conditions have changed.
Picture the scene. Your son is taking part in a rugby tournament. You arrive, and park in a field (with hundreds of other cars). It absolutely chucks it down with rain. Tournament over, you now need to get out of said field, which has a slightly uphill exit. It is at this point you nod sagely at your inspired decision to buy a large SUV. This happens to me more often than I would like.
So a large non 4x4 suv ok will be ok then? Picture the scene. Your son is taking part in a rugby tournament. You arrive, and park in a field (with hundreds of other cars). It absolutely chucks it down with rain. Tournament over, you now need to get out of said field, which has a slightly uphill exit. It is at this point you nod sagely at your inspired decision to buy a large SUV. This happens to me more often than I would like.
And no other non-suv 4x4 will possibly be good enough?
Funny how the mini-coaches that take the kids to the match always get back fine.
Edited by hyphen on Monday 12th June 15:43
It rained.
All the coaches and mini buses were stranded full of cold wet muddy kids and parents, while the 4x4s alll exited left.
Cue the Dad's trying to all manner of leaves branches etc under the coaches wheels trying to get traction.
I was in a Golf 4 motion which was fine and the only normal looking car that was in the field at day.
I totally get SUVs but for me I place more importance on traction so the 4x4 ability is more important to me no matter the shape or size of the car.
Ares said:
OK. I know around 20 farmers. They all have Defenders. Most of them are in Cheshire though. I don't know a single one with a Skoda. I do know of one with a Peugeot 505 estate though.
I take your point regarding a Transit, but equally few of us have a Connect/Berlingo lying around either, nor are we likely to buy one just for the few times we need to carry a van load of crap. Especially when an SUV is 99% has good for the normal person for load carrying...and a damned sight better the rest of the time.
Thanks for the tip on the Tractor. I was just about to cancel my order for a Quadrifoglio for one, but if it's too big I'll stick with the Alfa!
This site is just full of handy tips!
What you keep struggling to grasp is that someone says how they must have an SUV because they are easier to load. The reference I make regarding the Transit, is that it's a big vehicle which makes parking it more difficult and as it's higher, it's more difficult to load by hand. I can park my little car just about anywhere and because it's small, the doors can be opened wider (they will open to about 90 degrees) making loading much easier than a car that takes up more room in the space and then has a door card thats getting on for a foot thick, the case of a Cayenne. I take your point regarding a Transit, but equally few of us have a Connect/Berlingo lying around either, nor are we likely to buy one just for the few times we need to carry a van load of crap. Especially when an SUV is 99% has good for the normal person for load carrying...and a damned sight better the rest of the time.
Thanks for the tip on the Tractor. I was just about to cancel my order for a Quadrifoglio for one, but if it's too big I'll stick with the Alfa!
This site is just full of handy tips!
Again, people say how the commanding view of their big, rugged off roader allows them to see over the hedges. My point is that my tractor is head and shoulders higher than even an L405 RR and while I can see over most hedges, the size of the vehicle negates any advantages the height advantage gives me because I'm constantly having to look for gaps to let incompetently driven SUV's past.
The bosses other daughter has a Discover Sport and was complaining over winter how it was sliding everywhere, obviously my car was fine in the snow, but the low profile, performance road tyres fitted to the car designed, or at least marketed, to ford every river and climb every mountain, weren't offering much grip....
I know 3 people that run D4 Commercials. One does silly miles, up to 60k/yr and the other 2 about 25k. So these vehicles are working for a living, full of tools and and work stuff and pulling fuel bowers and light plant. But JLR are now going down the Ponce Rover market and leaving these customers high and dry with no replacement.
Personally I think it has a lot to do with the perception of image.
They are also practical, easy to in and out of, easy to see out of and see over hedges etc.
Probably perceived as being safer
They are also very popular, which I suppose makes them more popular.
When my time in the 640d is over, I'll be heading to an X5 or RRS
They are also practical, easy to in and out of, easy to see out of and see over hedges etc.
Probably perceived as being safer
They are also very popular, which I suppose makes them more popular.
When my time in the 640d is over, I'll be heading to an X5 or RRS
ferrariF50lover said:
I'd probably have a Q7 or a Range Rover if a well specced, sensibly priced example caught my eye at the right time
I suspect you're talking about second-hand, but if I was in the market for a new well-specced Rangie (particularly an aftermarket job like Kahn, Revere or Overfinch) my non-existent money would be going on a Roller or a Bentley. Granfondo said:
nickfrog said:
Wild Rumpus said:
A big, comfortable SUV is ideal for towing your competition/trackday car
But if you have a low COG estate you can use that for track days or racing so you don't need the SUV at all.
I've got an xc90 as the family bus and I absolutely love it. When I change it will probably be for another big 4x4.
Why?
Massive space inside for prams,toys,holiday luggage, caravan stuff, tip runs
Great for towing caravan or occasionally horse box
7 seats so can take grandparents along on days out without having to take 2 cars
Well specced inside with loads of storage / power points
Copes well with the crappy roads
Good visibility and safety for the family
And mainly because I like the look of it and it suits my lifestyle
Why?
Massive space inside for prams,toys,holiday luggage, caravan stuff, tip runs
Great for towing caravan or occasionally horse box
7 seats so can take grandparents along on days out without having to take 2 cars
Well specced inside with loads of storage / power points
Copes well with the crappy roads
Good visibility and safety for the family
And mainly because I like the look of it and it suits my lifestyle
vikingaero said:
I hate pseudo 4x4's. But people buy them because they like sitting up high, comfortable when every Council decides to plaster crappy speed hump everywhere. Potholed, rutted and damaged roads are the norm.. Most importantly is image. It's the prison trainer of clothing, it shouts "maybe I do go offroad and wrestle bears", most of all it's a uniform to be accepted by others and a lot of people need validation in their life.
I think this says more about you than about pseudo-SUV buyers - or should they not buy one even if their main motivations are functional (and they happen to not like or care about image) so that a bloke on the internet doesn't moan about other people's (perceived) reasons to buy ?They really don't have a particularly positive image in reality, they are just mundane as they're everywhere - people essentially buy them because they're brilliant functionally.
Granfondo said:
You see lots of estates at track days all over the country!
I know you're taking the piss but my estate has been to a trackday and I've seen a few others. Various people took the piss after the sighting lap asking if it was the safety car but were quite complementary later. We had mpvs for family duties, they did the job very well, but the "airport taxi" isnt for everyone, a lot of it is aspirational and vain but why not ? Most car purchases have a degree of that.
You get the practicality, space, driving position and a lot are very upmarket, they are good for our crap roads.
I don't have much urge for one but can see why they are popular.
You get the practicality, space, driving position and a lot are very upmarket, they are good for our crap roads.
I don't have much urge for one but can see why they are popular.
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