No-one makes a proper basic rough and ready 4x4
Discussion
Willy Nilly said:
Personally I think the current crop of pickups are crap. They're too high to make putting things in the back easy ... I constantly baffles me that no body has jumped into the market that the Defender left.
I've just noticed this bit...Now, Defenders are known for a lot of things, but low loading height? Nah.
The SsangYong Rexton has a separate chassis, low range, 7 seats, and a manual or automatic gearbox and starts at £22,995 with a 5 year warranty. If you can get past the image and are going to keep it until it dies then I think it is a good option.
Mitsubishi are currently homologating the new shogun sport for sale in the UK from January next year. Separate chassis (based on the L200 pick-up) but 7 seats, low range, centre differential lock, can run in 4WD on sealed surfaces, and has a rear differential lock as well. Ticks all the boxes for what the OP is looking for. I think it retains the pick-up's live rear axle.
The little Suzuki Jimny is now in its 19th year and continues to sells well. live axles
Mitsubishi are currently homologating the new shogun sport for sale in the UK from January next year. Separate chassis (based on the L200 pick-up) but 7 seats, low range, centre differential lock, can run in 4WD on sealed surfaces, and has a rear differential lock as well. Ticks all the boxes for what the OP is looking for. I think it retains the pick-up's live rear axle.
The little Suzuki Jimny is now in its 19th year and continues to sells well. live axles
There's the...erm..G-Class(Wagen)?
May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
Kierkegaard said:
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
Profit is generally regarded as a useful knock-on from sales volume, so I think they're fairly happy with the decision to put the Def out of its misery.All the emissions and airbag excuses were simply excuses. The Defender just wasn't profitable, so it got taken on a one-way trip to the vet.
Ecosseven said:
The SsangYong Rexton has a separate chassis, low range, 7 seats, and a manual or automatic gearbox and starts at £22,995 with a 5 year warranty. If you can get past the image and are going to keep it until it dies then I think it is a good option.
Mitsubishi are currently homologating the new shogun sport for sale in the UK from January next year. Separate chassis (based on the L200 pick-up) but 7 seats, low range, centre differential lock, can run in 4WD on sealed surfaces, and has a rear differential lock as well. Ticks all the boxes for what the OP is looking for. I think it retains the pick-up's live rear axle.
The little Suzuki Jimny is now in its 19th year and continues to sells well. live axles
Oh wow, I never realised Mitsubishi was bringing back the Shogun Sport. Thats awesome.Mitsubishi are currently homologating the new shogun sport for sale in the UK from January next year. Separate chassis (based on the L200 pick-up) but 7 seats, low range, centre differential lock, can run in 4WD on sealed surfaces, and has a rear differential lock as well. Ticks all the boxes for what the OP is looking for. I think it retains the pick-up's live rear axle.
The little Suzuki Jimny is now in its 19th year and continues to sells well. live axles
The Rexton however: "It is based on the Mercedes-Benz M-Class (W 163) platform." albeit a car based on a 20 year old Mercedes design is likely to be pretty reliable in the rough stuff (as opposed to 2 year old Mercedes designs, which appear to be rolling tech demos). However in its day the W163 was never really known for its off road ability, in fact that Mercedes alongside the E53 X5 I believe where heralded as the 1st iteration of the now popular 'soft roader'. Would probably make a good towing slag though for those opposed to pickups.
Jimny's are great. Which is in my totally not bias, Jimny owners opinion. But just don't have the engine for towing, I've chucked a 1500kg dual axle on mine, the chassis is suprisingly stable, you get the seesaw motion you get on the Defender 90 at 2.5-3.5ton, however that is likely to be easily fixable with some tougher springs (just as it is on the 90). But the engine, a revvy 1.3 DOHC petrol... it has the power to shift the weight, but that power is a way up at 5krpm, meaning you need rev the absolute tits off of it to get it rolling, a small ~100bhp, ~250ftIb would be amazing in that chassis.
Kierkegaard said:
There's the...erm..G-Class(Wagen)?
May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
Can you still get the Push version of the G-Wagen (I guess not in RHD, think they wer only available in Switzerland, Austria and eastern bloc)- the very basic, rough and ready version?May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
Whitean3 said:
Can you still get the Push version of the G-Wagen (I guess not in RHD, think they wer only available in Switzerland, Austria and eastern bloc)- the very basic, rough and ready version?
Steyr-Puch always built the G-wagen, but some countries got their badge, too. Peugeot badged 'em for the French army, too... Utility versions were available with Merc badges, but even they've gone upmarket now. And they're not available in the UK, but are in some other countries.https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/mercedes-benz/veh...
Kierkegaard said:
There's the...erm..G-Class(Wagen)?
May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
Don't know what your budget is, but maybe a well preserved, mature G Wagen and fettle it up a bit?May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
55palfers said:
Kierkegaard said:
There's the...erm..G-Class(Wagen)?
May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
Don't know what your budget is, but maybe a well preserved, mature G Wagen and fettle it up a bit?May not be basic but you can watch TV in leather-trimmed comfort...
I think Land Rover should bring back the Defender - or rather an all new model that looks like a defender but has up to date stuff but still basic. LR is too far into pushing upmarket it's missing an easy market it used to sell well in IMO.
The problem is that when you drive one you suddenly appreciate what a genuinely terrible road car they are. They're awful.
Without the massive V8 that makes them hilarious and wonderful it really is hard to justify them over almost any other option.
Mound Dawg said:
You can still buy a Jeep Wrangler.
I'm not suggesting you should though.
But have you seen the price of them these days. UK at least. And they have a deliberately lowered tow rating. Despite being physically capable. I'm not suggesting you should though.
But the Jeep, as in the CJ diverted from utility vehicle to recreation vehicle as far back as the 1960's or earlier.
Tannedbaldhead said:
I work in construction and over the years there have always been rufty tufty basic competent 4/5 seat 4x4s that could bounce about rough sites pulling a little piling rig for soil investigation work or a water bowser for decontaminating plant then when finished be used by the operative as a company car.
Over the years there have been plenty of vehicles up for the task: Daihatsu Fourtracks, Isuzu Troopers, Hyundai Terracans, Mitsubishi Shogun Sports, Land Rover Defenders and Nissan Pathfinders all did the job well and none broke the bank. There are no doubt quite a few that also fit the same bill that have been around over the years.
Now? Not one vehicle is around that fits this bill. Not one. If you don't want to drive a pick-up nothing is available.
Surely to God there is a market for a cheap, basic, off-road capable 4x4 that can tow a reasonable weight.
+1Over the years there have been plenty of vehicles up for the task: Daihatsu Fourtracks, Isuzu Troopers, Hyundai Terracans, Mitsubishi Shogun Sports, Land Rover Defenders and Nissan Pathfinders all did the job well and none broke the bank. There are no doubt quite a few that also fit the same bill that have been around over the years.
Now? Not one vehicle is around that fits this bill. Not one. If you don't want to drive a pick-up nothing is available.
Surely to God there is a market for a cheap, basic, off-road capable 4x4 that can tow a reasonable weight.
Just got back from touring Wales for a few days. And it's staggering how many working Land Rovers there are there still. Mostly pickups with Ifor Williams tops but a few hard tops too. And all 90's pretty much, not 110's (people don't want a big long vehicle for this sort of use).
Sure there are plenty of Jap pickups too these days. But observationally there were far more Land Rovers in service than all of the Jap pickups combined.
It beggars belief that
a) Land Rover seem to have no interest in this market
b) no other major makers seem to have noticed it either
cptsideways said:
kbf1981 said:
Jeep Wrangler! Very good cars and great off road.
You have to special order one with HD axles to be able to tow anything decent. Otherwise tow limit is pants as standard.When the JK was first launched in the U.K. It had a 3500kg tow rating in published documentation. I have an early brochure from 2007. At the time the US model was rated at 3500lbs. I think someone just changed the letters. Latter Wranglers in the U.K. We're downgraded.
I however believe the Wrangler is artificially limited. All of the parts are capable of towing 3500kg+ but in the US home market, if you want to tow they want you to buy a Dodge Ram. The Wrangler is positioned as a Recreation Vehcile. Not a Utility Vehcile.
h0b0 said:
OP says "No-One makes a proper basic rough and ready 4x4" and then excludes the vehicles specifically made for his requirement. I'm in the US. And the definition of rough and tough is the pick up truck. OK you can't feasibly drive an F150 in the U.K. But, the OP said about samples. Are they going in the boot? Oh, a pickup has a space for that.
My next thread will be "I want a vehicle that is exciting, seat of the pants, approximately 750cc and made by Yamaha but absolutely no motor bikes"
I think I know what the op means. And a pickup, even a U.K. Sized one, which is much smaller than something like an F150 are still too big. My next thread will be "I want a vehicle that is exciting, seat of the pants, approximately 750cc and made by Yamaha but absolutely no motor bikes"
Way too long and often too wide. And today most are all blinded up trying to me more car like.
It's not that they can't be used. But they don't always do the job you want. My Uncle uses a Defender 90 on his farm still, as do most of the farms in our area. Because they are better sized for their intended use.
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