RE: Jaguar XE SV Project 8 - official!

[8bit]

MustardCutter said:

Jag would do a lot better with 30 somethings like myself if they actually offered a manual gearbox mated to their petrol engines...

Nonsense. That would appeal more to 40-something's who simply can't accept that an auto box can be any fun at all, most 30-somethings these days are driving DSG equipped German tat and thinking they're the st. Have you actually driven one with a recent ZF 8 or 6 speed unit?

[Amanitin]

TooMany2cvs said:

If it wasn't for those collectors and speculators, would these cars even be built in the first place?

No they wouldn't. That's the point. Jaguar could (should) focus on their regular cars instead. Last I checked the interior of the XE could absorb some attention. Replacement for the 5.0 engine (e.g. a twin turbo or S/C 4.0 so that they sell in China). Sportsbreak XE. New XJ. Hybrid or electric powertrain.

[kambites]

As long as these things make a profit in the small numbers they can sell to investors/speculators, I don't see why their production is really taking anything away from the other projects.

I would imagine the XE will ultimately get the new inline six when it finally appears.

[MustardCutter]

8bit said:

MustardCutter said:

Jag would do a lot better with 30 somethings like myself if they actually offered a manual gearbox mated to their petrol engines...

Nonsense. That would appeal more to 40-something's who simply can't accept that an auto box can be any fun at all, most 30-somethings these days are driving DSG equipped German tat and thinking they're the st. Have you actually driven one with a recent ZF 8 or 6 speed unit?

Nonsense? I can assure you I am a 30 something and want a manual gearbox with a petrol engine. The clue is in the 'like myself' part. The last auto I drove was a C class that I had for about a month. I don't know what box it had but we didn't get on at all.

Edited by MustardCutter on Thursday 29th June 16:19

[8bit]

MustardCutter said:

8bit said:

MustardCutter said:

Jag would do a lot better with 30 somethings like myself if they actually offered a manual gearbox mated to their petrol engines...

Nonsense. That would appeal more to 40-something's who simply can't accept that an auto box can be any fun at all, most 30-somethings these days are driving DSG equipped German tat and thinking they're the st. Have you actually driven one with a recent ZF 8 or 6 speed unit?

Nonsense? I can assure you I am a 30 something and want a manual gearbox with a petrol engine. The clue is in the 'like myself' part. The last auto I drove was a C class that I had for about a month. I don't know what box it had but we didn't get on at all.

Edited by MustardCutter on Thursday 29th June 16:19

Sure, but you miss my point. I'm guessing that since you post here, you're probably not representative of the vast majority of 30 somethings in the context of cars. They couldn't give a toss about the merits of traditional manual transmissions over autos, they just want to appear like they've "made it" to their neighbours. You'd be more likely to find a 40-something that would actually care that there's a choice of manual over auto in a potential new car purchase than a 30-something.

Merc autos are a far, far cry from the likes of the ZF units in Jag (and some Audi, BMW etc.). We drove a number of C class cars before settling on a M class SUV, all were autos, all were horrible to use. I still have the 7G tronic in the M class, it's so dim-witted it's not true. Really, do try a car with a well-implemented ZF unit before writing them off. I love the six speed in my XKR. Of course, if you really just don't like automatic transmissions then fine, it probably won't change your mind but each to their own and all that.

[Kenny Powers]

I still fail to understand this fascination and paranoia over perceived status and image. You know, some people just like nice stuff and have the money to acquire it. It's that simple.

Chips. Shoulders. Everywhere!

[RobGT81]

At that price you don't even get a dual clutch auto, just the same old box on the same old engine. I've no idea how they can justify that price compared to an R8+.

[TdM-GTV]

ali_XFR said:

I for one commend the combination of lunacy and attention to detail involved in producing a 200mph XE. It sounds absolutely ridiculous- in a good way. If it furthers the name of SVO and jaguar then as others have said purely as a halo/ PR exercise it's a job well done.
I suspect there will be at least 300 well heeled enthusiastic amateur Racers who want something different to the usual track day special suspects who will pony up for one.
I'm not the target market for the car at all. But just to offer a counter balance to the "jags are for old duffers" line propagated earlier in the thread I'm 36 and have a 6 year old XFR. It's a brilliant combo of exec saloon and mentalist hot rod but it's getting long in the tooth and I really do hope they hurry up and bring out a next gen XF with a V8. If this car keeps the beards at SVO in work and pays enough bills to get them onto the next few projects then it's a thumbs up from me.

35 with an SV8 here. Great car, quick, handles well and does everything well in general. It's also heavy but rarely feels it and has a very active rear end. I think Jag are much more viable for younger people these days just need some R variants that are affordable. 150k is a little steep but then I'm not the target audience here.

[Ares]

RobGT81 said:

At that price you don't even get a dual clutch auto, just the same old box on the same old engine. I've no idea how they can justify that price compared to an R8+.

+1

The defence of its lardy-arse weight above was it's 'proper' supercharged V8 rather than the modern Blown V6s....but it's heavy because of bloody old, and for a uber-special car, to be powered by a 20yr old blown that is only just breaking 100bhp/litre is behind the curve.

Their competitors have moved on three or four times and have mainstream cars kicking out well over 100bhp/litre, some getting damned close to 200bhp/litre.

The 'shove a massive capacity engine in a small car' is very last century.

[groomi]

griffsomething said:

Awesome.

One question though, what were Projects 1-6 if the F-Type was number 7 and this is number 8??

It's a good question and I don't have a difinitive answer, however the Project 7 and 8 are creations of the Special Vehicle Operations (SVO) department (formerly the Saturday Club), whose previous creations include:

XJ220


XK180


Both of which were fully engineered prototypes with the XJ220 going on to be developed into a production car. I assume these cars are counted as two of the Projects 1-6, the others perhaps are more recent prototypes which may or may not have been fully developed. Possibly the C-X75 counts as one, although I think there was a lot of industry collaboration with that, so it perhaps doesn't fall under the SVO.

Anyway, if anyone knows the answer in full it would be great to know!

[AshBurrows]

"Project 7 was inspired by our proud racing past. Its name is derived from the seven times Jaguar has won the famous Le Mans 24-hour race. Three of those historic wins came in our iconic 1950s D-type, which recently celebrated its 60th anniversary. The brief to our designers was to conceive a modern day D-type. F-TYPE Project 7 is the exhilarating result."

Project 8 means nothing really other than it came after this.

[V8A*ndy]

The LHD only is irksome,

however there was only 30 LHD XKR-S GTs to be made but Jaguar ended up making some RHD items (anyone know the final number?).

So perhaps if there was demand????

[JonnyVTEC]

Ares said:

+1

The defence of its lardy-arse weight above was it's 'proper' supercharged V8 rather than the modern Blown V6s....but it's heavy because of bloody old, and for a uber-special car, to be powered by a 20yr old blown that is only just breaking 100bhp/litre is behind the curve.

Their competitors have moved on three or four times and have mainstream cars kicking out well over 100bhp/litre, some getting damned close to 200bhp/litre.

The 'shove a massive capacity engine in a small car' is very last century.

It's a 2010 engine isn't it?

The 2018 engine updates do actually include a 150bhp/litre petrol aswell.

[Willy Nilly]

I don't want this car, but sometime tomorrow I'll be going to my local Jaguar dealer and will be wanting to place an order for a 5 litre, supercharged Jag with full Waft-o-Matic of either XF or XJ flavour with this evenings lottery winnings and don't want to be disappointed.

[RacerMike]

JonnyVTEC said:

Ares said:

+1

The defence of its lardy-arse weight above was it's 'proper' supercharged V8 rather than the modern Blown V6s....but it's heavy because of bloody old, and for a uber-special car, to be powered by a 20yr old blown that is only just breaking 100bhp/litre is behind the curve.

Their competitors have moved on three or four times and have mainstream cars kicking out well over 100bhp/litre, some getting damned close to 200bhp/litre.

The 'shove a massive capacity engine in a small car' is very last century.

It's a 2010 engine isn't it?

The 2018 engine updates do actually include a 150bhp/litre petrol aswell.

Well. Given that the V8 is a 5.0, that’s 115bhp/litre.... it’s also not an old engine. It’s a ally block and head V8 with direct injection and a supercharger...

[BenjiS]

RacerMike said:

JonnyVTEC said:

Ares said:

+1

The defence of its lardy-arse weight above was it's 'proper' supercharged V8 rather than the modern Blown V6s....but it's heavy because of bloody old, and for a uber-special car, to be powered by a 20yr old blown that is only just breaking 100bhp/litre is behind the curve.

Their competitors have moved on three or four times and have mainstream cars kicking out well over 100bhp/litre, some getting damned close to 200bhp/litre.

The 'shove a massive capacity engine in a small car' is very last century.

It's a 2010 engine isn't it?

The 2018 engine updates do actually include a 150bhp/litre petrol aswell.

Well. Given that the V8 is a 5.0, that’s 115bhp/litre.... it’s also not an old engine. It’s a ally block and head V8 with direct injection and a supercharger...

The V8 is still the 'worst' of Jag's current engines.

The Ingeniums have 200, 250 and 300bhp variants of the 2l, so 100, 125, and 150bhp/litre.

The V6 supercharged runs at both 380 and 400bhp, so 126 and 133bhp/litre respectively. Used to be 340bhp in the XE, but it's been bumped up to 380 for MY18.

[smilo996]

Seeing it close up it looks really impressive.
Not one for weight weenies but lightness is not everything. Nodooubt 4wd addls quite lot of weight but advantages.
Rear doors for when you use the rear seats.

All credit to Jag for manking the XE look sexy and very fast.

[JonnyVTEC]

RacerMike said:

Well. Given that the V8 is a 5.0, that’s 115bhp/litre.... it’s also not an old engine. It’s a ally block and head V8 with direct injection and a supercharger...

Indeed. It's also lean burn capable if they fit the NOX trap system. My 150 reference was of course the 300bhp I4. Stock F type S is pushing 126bhp/litre, hence its name;)

[JonnyVTEC]

[quote=BenjiS]

The V8 is still the 'worst' of Jag's current engines.

The Ingeniums have 200, 250 and 300bhp variants of the 2l, so 100, 125, and 150bhp/litre.

The V6 supercharged runs at both 380 and 400bhp, so 126 and 133bhp/litre respectively. Used to be 340bhp in the XE, but it's been bumped up to 380 for MY18.[/quotes]

It's likely we both know that... months /years before the press release. Of course the V8 isn't a turbo anyway... it's proper power

[peter450]

BenjiS said:

RacerMike said:

JonnyVTEC said:

Ares said:

+1

The defence of its lardy-arse weight above was it's 'proper' supercharged V8 rather than the modern Blown V6s....but it's heavy because of bloody old, and for a uber-special car, to be powered by a 20yr old blown that is only just breaking 100bhp/litre is behind the curve.

Their competitors have moved on three or four times and have mainstream cars kicking out well over 100bhp/litre, some getting damned close to 200bhp/litre.

The 'shove a massive capacity engine in a small car' is very last century.

It's a 2010 engine isn't it?

The 2018 engine updates do actually include a 150bhp/litre petrol aswell.

Well. Given that the V8 is a 5.0, that’s 115bhp/litre.... it’s also not an old engine. It’s a ally block and head V8 with direct injection and a supercharger...

The V8 is still the 'worst' of Jag's current engines.

The Ingeniums have 200, 250 and 300bhp variants of the 2l, so 100, 125, and 150bhp/litre.

The V6 supercharged runs at both 380 and 400bhp, so 126 and 133bhp/litre respectively. Used to be 340bhp in the XE, but it's been bumped up to 380 for MY18.

This cars problem is not its engine, it's bhp per litre does not really matter in the grand scheme of things, It's a V8, it makes 600hp and a nice noise and that's what counts. I'd take the old and outdated V8 in this ove the newer V6 any day. In fact I'd take last gen AMG and M power engines over their current replacements as well. A big part of the apeal of these type of engines is theif character and sound. The engine is probably going to be the high point of this car, the problem in my view is the most standout out feature of this car seems to be it's very high price. Even the attention grabbing 600hp headline figure is pretty unremarkable these days.