RE: Ford Mustang made (a bit) safer

[kambites]

Bladedancer said:

It used to be that skill and common sense were what you needed to drive.

Yes, and road fatality rates were many times higher than they are today despite there being far fewer cars and less distance driven.

I'm not a fan of the current OTT (to my mind) focus on crash safety, but there is no denying that the roads are getting safer and that that is in large part due to improvements in car design, including electronic safety nets and crash prevention systems.


I'm quite happy in my little plastic go-kart with no ABS or airbags let alone other systems, but that's not because I believe these systems don't work. I've just made a conscious decision that other factors are more important to me.

Edited by kambites on Monday 10th July 07:52

[Motormatt]

spikyone said:

I'll be honest, I'm not too bothered if my car has lane assist or auto-braking or pedestrian detection or is nice and squidgy for someone who wanders out in front of me. I'll give an extra star to anyone who doesn't put all that electronic garbage on it.

I'm with you on this, but then we appear to be in the dwindling minority who associate actually looking where we're going with safe driving.

However, when I'm the pedestrian and not the driver I consider this this kind of technology more important than ever. For millions of drivers, checking their social media status or sending an email is much, much more important than your life.
Next time I'm crossing the road and an approaching driver staring at their phone hasn't noticed me on the pedestrian crossing, I might be glad they weren't driving Mustang when the car intervenes on their behalf.

[Mr2Mike]

LuS1fer said:

My motto is "You die, you die".

So you are a fatalist i.e. if your time is up then it was meant to be and it's pointless trying to prevent it?

[croyde]

Speary8 said:

The biggest safety improvement they can make to the current Mustang would be NOT to fit Prielli P Zero tyres that dont work under about 11 degC.
Shame the salesman didn't warn me about this before I put it sideways on a country road.

Absolutely.

Does make me laugh, all this stuff about lack of this and lack of that, yet they fit the car with fuggin lethal tyres.

I changed mine for Michelin MPSS. Night and Day difference. I can actually drive it in the wet now.

[foxbody-87]

Safety ratings aren't something that petrolheads seem to care about.
I can get that people choose family cars based on NCAP results, can't see the majority of Mustang drivers caring much.
I've owned my '87 fox body for 4 years now, no airbag, no ABS, no crumple zones, no traction control, and I don't think I've ever considered that it probably isn't the safest of cars to drive compared to modern stuff, because it sounds nice and I like driving it.

[Bladedancer]

kambites said:

Yes, and road fatality rates were many times higher than they are today despite there being far fewer cars and less distance driven.

So you point is what? That electronics can replace common sense and skill? Because if it is, then I'm sorry to tell you you're 100% wrong at this point. We're years if not decades away from sci-fi style self driving cars.

kambites said:

I'm not a fan of the current OTT (to my mind) focus on crash safety, but there is no denying that the roads are getting safer and that that is in large part due to improvements in car design, including electronic safety nets and crash prevention systems.

I'm quite happy in my little plastic go-kart with no ABS or airbags let alone other systems, but that's not because I believe these systems don't work. I've just made a conscious decision that other factors are more important to me.

You have 100% missed the point. You either haven't read what I wrote of just plain ignored it.
I don't mind safety systems. But there is a point where they are no longer safety systems but gizmos.
And I hate to see people rely on them to save them instead of using their brains and driving with common sense.

But then again these days common sense ins't exactly common.

[kambites]

Bladedancer said:

You have 100% missed the point. You either haven't read what I wrote of just plain ignored it.
I don't mind safety systems. But there is a point where they are no longer safety systems but gizmos.
And I hate to see people rely on them to save them instead of using their brains and driving with common sense.

But then again these days common sense ins't exactly common.

I understand what you said, and my point is that it's nothing new - but people said much the same about ABS and traction control and even seat-belts in a way - that as soon as you install them people will rely on them to keep them out of trouble and/or will drive less carefully because they'll feel safer.

I'm absolute convinced that things like lane departure systems will, with time, be proven to cause a net improvement to road safety just as all the other systems which have enough statistical data for.


I don't think electronic gizmos can replace driving skill (at least until vehicles go fully autonomous), but I do think it has been proven time and time again that they can supplement it. People make mistakes, people have always made mistakes, and these systems can mitigate them to a degree. I'd be delighted if the standard of driving was high enough that these systems weren't of benefit, but that isn't the case and never has been.

ETA: For what it's worth, I'm firmly in the "if you want to be safer on the roads, you're better off spending money on driving training than on safety equipment" camp, but sadly it's pretty clear that people who are happy to spend thousands on a newer "safer" car will not spend hundreds on learning to be better drivers.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 11th July 08:23

[croyde]

ABS is one that I personally cannot trust.

They even have it on motorbikes now but there is no way that I am slamming on the anchors in the wet with gay abandon and hoping that it will all work.

One must get used to it and then get taken completely by surprise the day something fails.

If safety aids were 100% reliable, then fair enough, but they are not.

Better training is what is needed and judging by the driving I see on the roads these days, I suspect that the test is far too lenient and letting all sorts of numpties out with a ton and a half of barely controlled metal.

The aids make a lot of people complacent and then driving ability suffers.

Go back to having the big spike on the steering wheel, aimed directly at the driver's heart. That's when the accident rate will tumble.

[saaby93]

kambites said:

I'm not a fan of the current OTT (to my mind) focus on crash safety, but there is no denying that the roads are getting safer and that that is in large part due to improvements in car design, including electronic safety nets and crash prevention systems.

The last road casualty report said that over the past few years safety has stayed about the same
That's despite all these so called safety improvements being brought in.
Best guess is some of them are leading to improvement, while others are subject to laws of forseeable unforseeable consequences or risk compensation.
Treat people like numpties and they'll behave like numpties

[Mr2Mike]

croyde said:

The aids make a lot of people complacent and then driving ability suffers.

Only a problem for the kind of numpties who's driving/riding is so poor that they rely on aids to save their arse on a regular basis. Most people do not use driver aids as a crutch.

[croyde]

kambites said:

I'm not a fan of the current OTT (to my mind) focus on crash safety, but there is no denying that the roads are getting safer and that that is in large part due to improvements in car design, including electronic safety nets and crash prevention systems.

Edited by kambites on Monday 10th July 07:52

I think people are crashing as much as they ever did, in fact more so as the roads are more crowded, it's just that people are managing to walk away from accidents that would have put them in hospital or worse a few years ago.