Do PHers still practice bangernomics?
Discussion
I wanted a convertible, always liked the old 'brick' Volvos, and bought a Mk1 C70 convertible from a local dealer for £1900.
Had it four months now and it's great! Apart from a POS Escort at age 19, and a VW Polo when I first left uni, it's the cheapest car I've ever bought and yet, oddly, it's probably the nicest car I've ever had.
I think, as somebody said earlier, it's a good car of getting a car you've always liked (providing you can find a good one of course).
Had it four months now and it's great! Apart from a POS Escort at age 19, and a VW Polo when I first left uni, it's the cheapest car I've ever bought and yet, oddly, it's probably the nicest car I've ever had.
I think, as somebody said earlier, it's a good car of getting a car you've always liked (providing you can find a good one of course).
To me, bangernomics is buying a very cheap (sub £1k?) car and then spending the minimum to keep it legal and running, never get attached to it and at the appropriate point scrap it (I think that is the definition many have implied above). Cheap motoring is the driving factor, a worthwhile aim that is too.
I am one who buys an older, nicer car than I could afford new, and maintains/repairs to keep it in full working order. Driving enjoyment and a love of well-engineered cars is the motivation. To me, this isn't bangernomics, but I wouldn't say I am driving a modern classic either.
What is the term for the latter approach, if there is one?
I am one who buys an older, nicer car than I could afford new, and maintains/repairs to keep it in full working order. Driving enjoyment and a love of well-engineered cars is the motivation. To me, this isn't bangernomics, but I wouldn't say I am driving a modern classic either.
What is the term for the latter approach, if there is one?
I would say generally I do, such as my rotten e46 330i Touring for £350, all in with a mot/fix things for it + tyres it’s cost me less than £1k in a year.
Had mk3 golf gti/e46 320ci/bmw 730i etc and other sub £1k junk I barely refuse to spend any real money on.
Never spent more than 5k on a car despite owning a few decent cars.
Had mk3 golf gti/e46 320ci/bmw 730i etc and other sub £1k junk I barely refuse to spend any real money on.
Never spent more than 5k on a car despite owning a few decent cars.
donkmeister said:
To me, bangernomics is buying a very cheap (sub £1k?) car and then spending the minimum to keep it legal and running, never get attached to it and at the appropriate point scrap it (I think that is the definition many have implied above). Cheap motoring is the driving factor, a worthwhile aim that is too.
I am one who buys an older, nicer car than I could afford new, and maintains/repairs to keep it in full working order. Driving enjoyment and a love of well-engineered cars is the motivation. To me, this isn't bangernomics, but I wouldn't say I am driving a modern classic either.
What is the term for the latter approach, if there is one?
bargain barger?I am one who buys an older, nicer car than I could afford new, and maintains/repairs to keep it in full working order. Driving enjoyment and a love of well-engineered cars is the motivation. To me, this isn't bangernomics, but I wouldn't say I am driving a modern classic either.
What is the term for the latter approach, if there is one?
shedding?
egor110 said:
In the past i've had
saab 9-5 2.3
saab 9-5 aero
citroen c5
nissan primera
bmw 325ci
ford puma
all for well under a grand most were around £500 with 6-12 months mot.
I had a c5 diesel bought from the old man for £1000. It only needed new tyres in 6 years and passed every MOT without work. Best thing was I got £4500 scrappage for it on a new car.saab 9-5 2.3
saab 9-5 aero
citroen c5
nissan primera
bmw 325ci
ford puma
all for well under a grand most were around £500 with 6-12 months mot.
donkmeister said:
To me, bangernomics is buying a very cheap (sub £1k?) car and then spending the minimum to keep it legal and running, never get attached to it and at the appropriate point scrap it (I think that is the definition many have implied above). Cheap motoring is the driving factor, a worthwhile aim that is too.
Yep. That's how I've run my sheds. Don't bother servicing it. As long as it passes the MOT, all is well. When it dies or is too uneconomical to repair, then bin it and get another.I have utilised bangernomics, but we now have 2x Nissan Leaf which using my man maths are about as cheap to run but (as white goods transportation) a much better experience all round than a cheap ICE.
250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
Edited by danp on Monday 18th December 11:02
danp said:
I have utilised bangernomics, but we now have 2x Nissan Leaf which using my man maths are about as cheap to run but (as white goods transportation) a much better experience all round than a cheap ICE.
250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
Can't compare the overall costs of EV to bangernomics. It would take me 10-15 years to break even with an EV vs bangernomics. It makes more sense for me to drive a 3 litre 4x4 banger like I stole it for about 10 years. I did the sums and decided that if I keep my car, I needn't worry about economy.250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
Edited by danp on Monday 18th December 11:02
danp said:
I have utilised bangernomics, but we now have 2x Nissan Leaf which using my man maths are about as cheap to run but (as white goods transportation) a much better experience all round than a cheap ICE.
250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
I can see you take your man maths seriously. Rule 1: Never, ever work out the length of time, or even the probability of breaking even after spending a lot of money on an expensive car (or two) bought with the stated aim of "saving money".250mpg equiv, no tax, very little to go wrong, a drivetrain more refined than any ICE, instantaneous torque. Brilliant for our usage. YMMV!
Edited by danp on Monday 18th December 11:02
Edited by Mr2Mike on Monday 18th December 14:40
I suppose my 9-5 2.3t falls into this category
Bought for £800 with 8 months MOT, FSH and knackered rear subframe bushes.
Replacement polyurethane bushes for £50 and half a days work and it's been faultless since. Even has a good amount of go with the remap taking it up to 230bhp and still returns 30mpg
Bought for £800 with 8 months MOT, FSH and knackered rear subframe bushes.
Replacement polyurethane bushes for £50 and half a days work and it's been faultless since. Even has a good amount of go with the remap taking it up to 230bhp and still returns 30mpg
As others have said, I'm not very good at living with obvious faults, so end up investing time and money that a more objective person would not.
A classic example was the mk1 Focus 2.0 Zetec I bought while I was waiting 5 months for my M140i to be built. A nice, tidy, two owner car with a full service history and a fresh MOT, it cost me the princely sum of £550. It drove faultlessly, apart from a clutch that bit right at the very top of the pedal travel. It didn't slip, it didn't cause any problems. But it annoyed the heck out of me.
So I spent £150 and a weekend changing the clutch, only to sell the car four months later. For pretty much the same £400 I'd have got for it with the clutch as it was.
I know someone who takes it to the other extreme. The most he's ever spent on a car in the 20 years I've known him is £500. Picks a random snotter with a year's MOT for £400-£500. And just drives it until it breaks, or fails an MOT expensively. Zero maintenance, cleaning, care etc. All noises, warning lights etc get completely ignored. A decision on whether to deal with an MOT or mechanical failure is based purely on the cost of rectification vs the cost of another MOT'd snotter. He is completely emotionally detached from the things. Properly insured and taxed, but otherwise zero fecks given.
He has a habit of getting 2-3 years out of a £400 car spending virtually nothing on it until something catastrophic fails (or MOT man condemns it), before picking up the next one and doing the same again.
It's a lifestyle choice for him. He could go and buy something nice new, or used, but cars are just not his thing. A tool for a job, like a lawnmower or a chop saw.
A classic example was the mk1 Focus 2.0 Zetec I bought while I was waiting 5 months for my M140i to be built. A nice, tidy, two owner car with a full service history and a fresh MOT, it cost me the princely sum of £550. It drove faultlessly, apart from a clutch that bit right at the very top of the pedal travel. It didn't slip, it didn't cause any problems. But it annoyed the heck out of me.
So I spent £150 and a weekend changing the clutch, only to sell the car four months later. For pretty much the same £400 I'd have got for it with the clutch as it was.
I know someone who takes it to the other extreme. The most he's ever spent on a car in the 20 years I've known him is £500. Picks a random snotter with a year's MOT for £400-£500. And just drives it until it breaks, or fails an MOT expensively. Zero maintenance, cleaning, care etc. All noises, warning lights etc get completely ignored. A decision on whether to deal with an MOT or mechanical failure is based purely on the cost of rectification vs the cost of another MOT'd snotter. He is completely emotionally detached from the things. Properly insured and taxed, but otherwise zero fecks given.
He has a habit of getting 2-3 years out of a £400 car spending virtually nothing on it until something catastrophic fails (or MOT man condemns it), before picking up the next one and doing the same again.
It's a lifestyle choice for him. He could go and buy something nice new, or used, but cars are just not his thing. A tool for a job, like a lawnmower or a chop saw.
Edited by Limpet on Monday 18th December 13:41
Mr2Mike said:
I can see you take your man maths seriously. Rule 1: Never, ever work out the length of time, or even the probability of breaking even after spending a lot of money on an expensive car (or two) bought with the stated aim of "saving money".
Actually for 10k p.a. I reckon a Leaf saves about £1800 a year in running costs over a mid size petrol banger - say an Astra G 1.6.Edited by Mr2Mike on Monday 18th December 14:40
Fuel of circa £1500 compared to £150 of electricity being the biggest factor.
Even once you factor in depreciation total costs are under HALF that of the bangernomic ICE.
Edited by danp on Tuesday 19th December 18:51
My last couple of cars have been Peugeot 306s. I bought an N-reg D Turbo for £400. Had it for nearly three years and put over 50k on it! I looked after it and serviced it regularly but it cost me very little to run (and did 57mpg).
I sold it earlier this year for slightly more than I paid for it and replaced it with a GTI-6. That cost me a grand but I had wanted one for a while and this one came up reasonably locally. Given how rare they are and how much good ones are making now I decided it was definitely the time to buy!
I use it daily and have put 11k on it since May. I intend to keep this one for a long time!
I sold it earlier this year for slightly more than I paid for it and replaced it with a GTI-6. That cost me a grand but I had wanted one for a while and this one came up reasonably locally. Given how rare they are and how much good ones are making now I decided it was definitely the time to buy!
I use it daily and have put 11k on it since May. I intend to keep this one for a long time!
I love a bit of bangernomics
Bought a 2002 volvo v40 for 100.. it needed an MOT £40.. cost me about £15 for ball joints for said MOT...
Ran it for about 12 months on engine oil and diesel mix.. then sold it for scrap for £150 ...
I have a small collection of cars now but the daily is a 2004 volvo v40 which is run on WEO occasionally. This volvo again only owes me £200 and is now on 196000 miles and has got heated leather seats etc...
Bought a 2002 volvo v40 for 100.. it needed an MOT £40.. cost me about £15 for ball joints for said MOT...
Ran it for about 12 months on engine oil and diesel mix.. then sold it for scrap for £150 ...
I have a small collection of cars now but the daily is a 2004 volvo v40 which is run on WEO occasionally. This volvo again only owes me £200 and is now on 196000 miles and has got heated leather seats etc...
danp said:
Mr2Mike said:
I can see you take your man maths seriously. Rule 1: Never, ever work out the length of time, or even the probability of breaking even after spending a lot of money on an expensive car (or two) bought with the stated aim of "saving money".
Actually for 10k p.a. I reckon a Leaf saves about £1800 a year in running costs over a mid size petrol banger - say an Astra G 1.6.Edited by Mr2Mike on Monday 18th December 14:40
Fuel of circa £1500 compared to £150 of electricity being the biggest factor.
Even once you factor in depreciation total costs are under HALF that of the bangernomic ICE.
Edited by danp on Tuesday 19th December 18:51
danp said:
Actually for 10k p.a. I reckon a Leaf saves about £1800 a year in running costs over a mid size petrol banger - say an Astra G 1.6.
Fuel of circa £1500 compared to £150 of electricity being the biggest factor.
Even once you factor in depreciation total costs are under HALF that of the bangernomic ICE.
How much did your Leaf cost compared a banger? The pay back time is going to be very lengthy, and that assumes nothing bad happens like needing a new battery.Fuel of circa £1500 compared to £150 of electricity being the biggest factor.
Even once you factor in depreciation total costs are under HALF that of the bangernomic ICE.
Picked up a 307 SW for £550, new battery, tyre swap, starter motor and a couple of other bits later and I'm at £850 all in for something that is comfy, carries all I need and looks smart enough.
It's also totally inoffensive and I don't have to care about whether it gets car park dings. Found it's best to buy cars with a new MOT (and no advisories) and then hope it doesn't need anything big the next year. Then it depends on how attached I am to it, I'll justify more expense if I like it!
Am wary of MOTs added by traders for really cheap cars, been surprised a year later by a sudden appearance of lots of issues that weren't even advisories the year before...
It's also totally inoffensive and I don't have to care about whether it gets car park dings. Found it's best to buy cars with a new MOT (and no advisories) and then hope it doesn't need anything big the next year. Then it depends on how attached I am to it, I'll justify more expense if I like it!
Am wary of MOTs added by traders for really cheap cars, been surprised a year later by a sudden appearance of lots of issues that weren't even advisories the year before...
Hoofy said:
Let's say the Leaf costs £10k and you got all your electricity free of charge. You'd break even after 5 years with a £500 shed assuming neither required any fixing. And if the shed required fixing, you'd bin it and buy another £500 shed. Still not seeing a Leaf as being the best choice vs a shed.
But with your example after 5 years you’d have a Leaf worth say 5k compared to a shed worth not a lot.You mention free electricity, came across this yesterday - I’ll have to look into it further.
https://ebico.org.uk/ebico-news/we-have-launched-s...
Mr2Mike said:
How much did your Leaf cost compared a banger? The pay back time is going to be very lengthy, and that assumes nothing bad happens like needing a new battery.
Leaf1 was 8k, Leaf2 5.5k.Both via Nissan Approved and have 0% finance, warranty, free servicing (FWIW!) etc
Ref the battery - they consist of 96 pairs of cells, so even if you get weak ones you don’t have to bin it all - there are specialists that can sort them.
In practise you’d be unlucky/unlikely to do so - certainly in the UK which is a good climate for batteries (not too hot or cold).
I’d wager that a 12k mile, 3.5 year old Leaf is going to cost rather less to maintain than a shed, even if it didn’t have a warranty.
danp said:
Hoofy said:
Let's say the Leaf costs £10k and you got all your electricity free of charge. You'd break even after 5 years with a £500 shed assuming neither required any fixing. And if the shed required fixing, you'd bin it and buy another £500 shed. Still not seeing a Leaf as being the best choice vs a shed.
But with your example after 5 years you’d have a Leaf worth say 5k compared to a shed worth not a lot.You mention free electricity, came across this yesterday - I’ll have to look into it further.
https://ebico.org.uk/ebico-news/we-have-launched-s...
Meanwhile, you've lost £1k a year.You have to remember that a shed is essentially a free car when it's worth £500. Even my not-so-shed 4x4 (which has more space than a Leaf) cost £1700 two years ago and models are still going on Autotrader for over £1600, meaning I've lost about £100 in depreciation. (No servicing or fixing costs because I only get stuff sorted if it fails the MOT, which it hasn't!)
So the reality is that I've lost nothing in depreciation over two years whereas you're down £2k.
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