Electric cars, does everyone really think they are amazing.
Discussion
SimonYorkshire said:
His usual load of utter b
ks.
Simon, You claim 101 and 104 are the same (the 2 range figures for 65mph) - with maths skills like that you could give Dianne Abbott a run for her money..ks.No one disputes an EV or ICE is less economical at higher speeds. Only in your fume addled mind do you appear to see this as a negative for EVs but not for ICE.
If only manufacturers offered long warranties on EV powertrains to assuage any concerns about replacement costs...
TooLateForAName said:
jesus wept.
Most (all current?) EVs have heat exchangers, they provide instant heat - yes faster than a petrol car - are efficient and great. Lots of evs have heated seats/steering wheels.
running costs? If I needed to I can have my battery refurbed for about £2.5K. Sure its a lot of money, but then DPF/EGR/DMF/etc aren't cheap. Running costs on our leaf are tiny compared to the costs of a petrol/diesel. servicing at the main dealer is £100 a go. fuel costs for us save £1500/year compared to the diesel it replaced.
Theres a floor to values because all that battery/motor/dc-dc converter/charger stuff is quite valueable second hand even for non-vehicle applications.
Heat exchangers in EVs are no more efficient that electric heaters at home and no more powerful than an electric heater at home. In comparison the heater in an ice kicks out many times more heat, granted once the engine has warmed up a little but the engine doesn't have to have run for more than around a minute before the ice heater will be capable of kicking out more heat than an EV heater can on full. It would be easily be possible for anyone to preheat an ice with an electric heater if anyone could be bothered. We have posts on this thread from EV owners who have said their EVs were the coldest car they ever owned. Most (all current?) EVs have heat exchangers, they provide instant heat - yes faster than a petrol car - are efficient and great. Lots of evs have heated seats/steering wheels.
running costs? If I needed to I can have my battery refurbed for about £2.5K. Sure its a lot of money, but then DPF/EGR/DMF/etc aren't cheap. Running costs on our leaf are tiny compared to the costs of a petrol/diesel. servicing at the main dealer is £100 a go. fuel costs for us save £1500/year compared to the diesel it replaced.
Theres a floor to values because all that battery/motor/dc-dc converter/charger stuff is quite valueable second hand even for non-vehicle applications.
Coolbanana said:
I haven't looked in here in a while but see Yorkshire's Finest Simon is still trying desperately to win a cause that was lost before this Thread even started! lol
Fact: The Powers-that-be in both Government and Manufacturing have long since decided that EV's are their propulsion method of choice and that they will phase these in with Hybrids so that the necessary infrastructure can be put into place.
It's all going to happen! There is a Bill in Parliament now to force Fuel Stations to all provide charging points. Just one step in many that is currently taking place.
No matter whether to you like it or not, whether you are a Genius who can prove another system is better or not, EV vehicles ARE happening and they ARE the Future! First Diesels and then Petrol-only engines will be phased out. Eventually, you will only be able to buy EV. There is no further debate. It happened and the outcome is currently being implemented. Get used to it!
The argument that is happening here re a minority fringe tech called LPG is utterly irrelevant and pointless; it is already consigned to the History Channel.
But those who took notice of government disadvantaged themselves. Government are not banning diesel and petrol cars, nothing to stop people enjoying petrol and diesel cars for the foreseeable future, just that if we look far enough ahead in the future they won't be able to buy a pure diesel or petrol car but will be able to buy a hybrid petrol / EV. And still some will run pure petrol cars. Can't wait for the future when people are queing to get on a charger before their own hours charge even begins, I'll be laughing as I drive past them in a car that still costs less to run than theirs do.
I don't think you can even buy a decent timing belt for £150. The one on My S-type was £500+ fitted (on special offer, it's a 4.5 hour job) and they recommend the fuel pump belt at the same time ( another 1.5 hours) i declined.
The leaf heater was 1kw I think, I'd worked out you could run it flat out for 24 hours before flattening the battery.
and yes, they gear ICE cars to the torque of the engine, EV's only have 1 gear (+reverse) less to go wrong, less power train losses.
Ignoring your range argument (which I discounted as it wasn't a problem remember?) there isn't a single issue with using an EV on a day to day basis for the majority of the car owning population.
in terms of energy use, an ICE car is the equivalent of lighting a bloody big bonfire in the middle of your house it heat it. Thankfully we moved on from the stone-age now. Lets revisit this thread in 1,3,5 and 10 years time.
The leaf heater was 1kw I think, I'd worked out you could run it flat out for 24 hours before flattening the battery.
and yes, they gear ICE cars to the torque of the engine, EV's only have 1 gear (+reverse) less to go wrong, less power train losses.
Ignoring your range argument (which I discounted as it wasn't a problem remember?) there isn't a single issue with using an EV on a day to day basis for the majority of the car owning population.
in terms of energy use, an ICE car is the equivalent of lighting a bloody big bonfire in the middle of your house it heat it. Thankfully we moved on from the stone-age now. Lets revisit this thread in 1,3,5 and 10 years time.
pherlopolus said:
I don't think you can even buy a decent timing belt for £150. The one on My S-type was £500+ fitted (on special offer, it's a 4.5 hour job) and they recommend the fuel pump belt at the same time ( another 1.5 hours) i declined.
The leaf heater was 1kw I think, I'd worked out you could run it flat out for 24 hours before flattening the battery.
and yes, they gear ICE cars to the torque of the engine, EV's only have 1 gear (+reverse) less to go wrong, less power train losses.
Ignoring your range argument (which I discounted as it wasn't a problem remember?) there isn't a single issue with using an EV on a day to day basis for the majority of the car owning population.
in terms of energy use, an ICE car is the equivalent of lighting a bloody big bonfire in the middle of your house it heat it. Thankfully we moved on from the stone-age now. Lets revisit this thread in 1,3,5 and 10 years time.
£500 isn't too bad.. a colleague has an S4 - that needs the timing chains replaced, which requires removal of the engine. Cheapest quote so far was £1,200 . He's hoping it'll keep going for long enough for him to get a Model 3. Similar straight line performance and way better economy on his 30 mile commute.The leaf heater was 1kw I think, I'd worked out you could run it flat out for 24 hours before flattening the battery.
and yes, they gear ICE cars to the torque of the engine, EV's only have 1 gear (+reverse) less to go wrong, less power train losses.
Ignoring your range argument (which I discounted as it wasn't a problem remember?) there isn't a single issue with using an EV on a day to day basis for the majority of the car owning population.
in terms of energy use, an ICE car is the equivalent of lighting a bloody big bonfire in the middle of your house it heat it. Thankfully we moved on from the stone-age now. Lets revisit this thread in 1,3,5 and 10 years time.
rscott said:
£500 isn't too bad.. a colleague has an S4 - that needs the timing chains replaced, which requires removal of the engine. Cheapest quote so far was £1,200 . He's hoping it'll keep going for long enough for him to get a Model 3. Similar straight line performance and way better economy on his 30 mile commute.
I know, but when you add in the gearbox service (with unicorn piss if you go by the price) and the other crap I had to get done at the same time I was looking at the thick end of £1500, even at mates rates.I'm really looking forward to having an EV. to the extent that I would buy rather than lease.
electric, battery powered tractor http://www.fendt.com/us/fendt-e100-vario.html
Electric, battery powered articulated loader http://www.kramer-online.com/en/discover-kramer/ze...
Electric, battery powered forklifts https://www.toyotaforklift.com/families/electric-m...
Yes, electric stuff is st and no good for hard work.
Electric, battery powered articulated loader http://www.kramer-online.com/en/discover-kramer/ze...
Electric, battery powered forklifts https://www.toyotaforklift.com/families/electric-m...
Yes, electric stuff is s
t and no good for hard work. Coolbanana said:
I haven't looked in here in a while but see Yorkshire's Finest Simon is still trying desperately to win a cause that was lost before this Thread even started! lol
Fact: The Powers-that-be in both Government and Manufacturing have long since decided that EV's are their propulsion method of choice and that they will phase these in with Hybrids so that the necessary infrastructure can be put into place.
It's all going to happen! There is a Bill in Parliament now to force Fuel Stations to all provide charging points. Just one step in many that is currently taking place.
No matter whether to you like it or not, whether you are a Genius who can prove another system is better or not, EV vehicles ARE happening and they ARE the Future! First Diesels and then Petrol-only engines will be phased out. Eventually, you will only be able to buy EV. There is no further debate. It happened and the outcome is currently being implemented. Get used to it!
The argument that is happening here re a minority fringe tech called LPG is utterly irrelevant and pointless; it is already consigned to the History Channel.
I know what a heat pump is and unless the low pressure rad is connected to a source of heat there's no point because if you're powering the pump via electricity you might just as well run a direct electrical resistance based heater because it will be just as efficient. There are no hot springs to tap into when you're driving down a road.
Now why don't you explain where the low pressure rad of the heat pump is in any warmer position than ambient air temperature? Without even checking I'll say it is far more likely that the EV heater actually does imply the aircon compressor running in reverse - No climate control for EVers, you can either have aircon or heat but you can't have both at the same time, no wonder you think pre-warming is such a benefit, you'll need to pre-warm to demist your windows if you had the aircon on last time you used the car pmsl. No chance of luke warm but dry air on an autumn evening,,, too bad, but of course this would involve sapping too much range from your already tiny range.
Now why don't you explain where the low pressure rad of the heat pump is in any warmer position than ambient air temperature? Without even checking I'll say it is far more likely that the EV heater actually does imply the aircon compressor running in reverse - No climate control for EVers, you can either have aircon or heat but you can't have both at the same time, no wonder you think pre-warming is such a benefit, you'll need to pre-warm to demist your windows if you had the aircon on last time you used the car pmsl. No chance of luke warm but dry air on an autumn evening,,, too bad, but of course this would involve sapping too much range from your already tiny range.
TooLateForAName said:
I really don't understand why the trolls have such hate for EVs. Those of us with an EV know that they work for us. They keep working for us every day. quoting made up stats isn't going to stop them working for us.
I think in the first, generally because they are thick, and second it is a certain human condition to be afraid of change to point of trying to resist it.You will find it actually doesn't matter what facts or figures are presented to people with this condition, because the objection is emotional and not based on rationality.
babatunde said:
I actually think Simon is doing more to convert people to EVs than the opposite, I'm sure there are people who have never considered an EV who follow the thread thinking he has a rational counter argument and in discovering he doesn't are exposed to EVs in a way they weren't before.
If people read my posts about how EV range is effected by speed, probably not though eh! Perhaps I'll post a reminder about the things I said on those posts sometime soon. After all, there were no sensible replies to those posts and there has been nothing but thread padding since those posts, thread padding by pro EVers who know my points in those posts are true, who recognise that even EV manufacturers claims linked to in those posts back up my points, who recognise that laws of physics back up my points. Or at least the pro EVers with a hint of tech knowledge know, the rest of you just kid yourselves, strange that on the EV forum I linked to where EVers are just chatting between themselves all of the points I made regards EV range being affected by speed are recognised as true but then again they're not trying to defend EVs against all the odds, they're just chatting between themselves.
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