RE: Out of touch: Speed Matters
Discussion
The MMI system in my old B8 A4 drove me nuts, principally because scrolling down a list of options required anticlockwise rotation of the controller, not the clockwise that logic (to me) would suggest. BMWs iDrive system works in the way I would expect.
I find iDrive 5 to be a pleasure to use, generally. Clear graphics, responsive controller, and very logical controls.
I find iDrive 5 to be a pleasure to use, generally. Clear graphics, responsive controller, and very logical controls.
SturdyHSV said:
Jex said:
I was driving along one evening and it was getting dark. I switched my lights on (not automatic - Mk2 Escort!) - a car pulled out of a drive just in front of me. I can only assume when he saw my lights come on that he thought I was flashing for him to come out. That is why I don't like automatic lights (as well as the fog thing)
You could assume that, or alternatively that you hadn't turned your lights on soon enough and the car pulled out because they hadn't noticed you?Automatic lights do tend to turn on well before they're needed, so they may have actually prevented that incident, just for the sake of argument
Mike335i said:
I quite liked the auto tailgate on the 5 series touring, press the button on the remote and the boot opens. Can't see why I would need it mind, but is was quite fun. No slower than manually doing it.
I quite like the auto tailgate on my E-class estate, handy if you've got your arms full of stuff you would otherwise have to put on the floor while you opened the boot. But I must admit, when I realised it had the feature. I thought "great, that's going to break expensively".This is a real challenge now... for a daily driver do you choose the car with modern and excellent infotainment (e.g. a recent BMW), or the car with the most charismatic driving experience?
As a Petrolhead I tell myself to go for the latter. But there's something inside me that keeps saying: "you cannot experience fun/fast cars in the South East, go for a safe BMW instead..." But if I do that, does this mean I'm formally giving up my PH badge?
As a Petrolhead I tell myself to go for the latter. But there's something inside me that keeps saying: "you cannot experience fun/fast cars in the South East, go for a safe BMW instead..." But if I do that, does this mean I'm formally giving up my PH badge?
Edited by peregrin99 on Wednesday 9th August 19:21
"Thankfully I've not had any issues with the PH 570GT long-termer and I appreciate the way the portrait-oriented screen is positioned just a hand-span away from the wheel, meaning you don't have to move your eyes or fingers too far from more important duties (y,know, like driving) to operate it. Better that than a steering wheel festooned with buttons too - a definite cheer for the McLaren approach here, the clear message being it is for steering the car. Not tuning the radio."
I find it hard to encourage any kind of overly complex, touchscreen, system in what purports to be a drivers car - or any car which isn't fully autonomous. You simply cannot operate them without looking at the screen. Frankly I'd prefer the steering wheel had some buttons you could operate from memory to change tracks or radio station, because you don't need to look at them.
To be honest I hate the onslaught of tech in most new cars now - I get in, switch everything off and concentrate on, you know, driving. That includes driving 7 hours across the country in a car with no radio - its amazing how much more you focus on what you and those around you are doing when devoid of distractions.
Passengering alongside someone scrolling through their 500 albums on the centre console, with the occasional cursory glance out the windscreen, is frankly terrifying and is in the same league as using your smartphone whilst driving IMO. Yet such systems now are considered utterly essential, and fantastic drivers cars get criticised for not having it by the very press that should be rallying against their inclusion.
I find it hard to encourage any kind of overly complex, touchscreen, system in what purports to be a drivers car - or any car which isn't fully autonomous. You simply cannot operate them without looking at the screen. Frankly I'd prefer the steering wheel had some buttons you could operate from memory to change tracks or radio station, because you don't need to look at them.
To be honest I hate the onslaught of tech in most new cars now - I get in, switch everything off and concentrate on, you know, driving. That includes driving 7 hours across the country in a car with no radio - its amazing how much more you focus on what you and those around you are doing when devoid of distractions.
Passengering alongside someone scrolling through their 500 albums on the centre console, with the occasional cursory glance out the windscreen, is frankly terrifying and is in the same league as using your smartphone whilst driving IMO. Yet such systems now are considered utterly essential, and fantastic drivers cars get criticised for not having it by the very press that should be rallying against their inclusion.
Edited by Thorburn on Thursday 10th August 16:23
Mark Benson said:
I have a 2017 Golf R estate with a touchscreen.
On the plus side, having the SatNav map in the instrument binnacle is excellent - well done the Engineer who thought of that, I no longer have to take my eyes off the road and down into the centre console to see where I need to be - it's even useful when not navigating as I can instantly see if there are other routes when I come across traffic.
However the touchscreen. Oh the touchscreen.
For instance the radio - I can have 6 presets on each of three screens. The screen is a decent size, but the icons are all arranged in a line across the screen, meaning they're only about 2cm square, if they'd laid them out in a grid they could have been double the size which in a car as firm as the Golf R would at least give me a 50% chance of hitting them on any road other than the motorway.
But that's not the worst - if I want to get to screen 2 of presets, I have to hit a bar that's less than 1cm in height and if I miss I end up going into the settings screen and having to hit a 1cm square button to go back.
And that's just the radio - if you want to change any settings on the move you're in for a real challenge.
It begs the question - when there is so much tech and configurability, the focus ought to be on driver usability - you encourage us to use the tech then make it almost impossible to do so safely. Has no-one at VW tried to use a touchscreen before they sign it off and thought "you know what, the buttons need to be bigger if we're going to do this". Anyone with a touchscreen knows how hard it is to hit an area with no physical 'edge' to it while trying to look at the road and without anything to lean their arm on - why don't the manufacturers?
I suspect they do and it's just about looking nice and impressing in the showroom though.
I do know it's going to be increasingly hard for me to choose my next car and avoid a touchscreen, but I'll damn well try.
I think all of this is being worked on...ie The Haptic feedback on touchscreens...so when you press into thin air you'll feel the same resistance as a button...On the plus side, having the SatNav map in the instrument binnacle is excellent - well done the Engineer who thought of that, I no longer have to take my eyes off the road and down into the centre console to see where I need to be - it's even useful when not navigating as I can instantly see if there are other routes when I come across traffic.
However the touchscreen. Oh the touchscreen.
For instance the radio - I can have 6 presets on each of three screens. The screen is a decent size, but the icons are all arranged in a line across the screen, meaning they're only about 2cm square, if they'd laid them out in a grid they could have been double the size which in a car as firm as the Golf R would at least give me a 50% chance of hitting them on any road other than the motorway.
But that's not the worst - if I want to get to screen 2 of presets, I have to hit a bar that's less than 1cm in height and if I miss I end up going into the settings screen and having to hit a 1cm square button to go back.
And that's just the radio - if you want to change any settings on the move you're in for a real challenge.
It begs the question - when there is so much tech and configurability, the focus ought to be on driver usability - you encourage us to use the tech then make it almost impossible to do so safely. Has no-one at VW tried to use a touchscreen before they sign it off and thought "you know what, the buttons need to be bigger if we're going to do this". Anyone with a touchscreen knows how hard it is to hit an area with no physical 'edge' to it while trying to look at the road and without anything to lean their arm on - why don't the manufacturers?
I suspect they do and it's just about looking nice and impressing in the showroom though.
I do know it's going to be increasingly hard for me to choose my next car and avoid a touchscreen, but I'll damn well try.
You should watch BBC click...about the future of car design, some interesting stuff coming down the line..and none it to do with driver engagement, which is a shame
aquarianone said:
I think all of this is being worked on...ie The Haptic feedback on touchscreens...so when you press into thin air you'll feel the same resistance as a button...
You should watch BBC click...about the future of car design, some interesting stuff coming down the line..and none it to do with driver engagement, which is a shame
Feedback isn't the issue, being able to feel were they are is. You should watch BBC click...about the future of car design, some interesting stuff coming down the line..and none it to do with driver engagement, which is a shame
Capacitive buttons are a right arse for that too. On the latest Vantage dash it is really easy brush over the screen demist button whilst turning the AC temperature down, so instead it whacks it up to 23c and full speed at the windscreen, ace. Wouldn't happen if it was just a normal bloody button!
Mr-B said:
fblm said:
Does anyone actually use OEM nav systems? Don't see the point personally.
I chose the non nav option when I bought the MX5 purely cos I'm a tight git! The option was going to cost £600 and they were only offering updates for three years and no indication of update costs after that. Seeing that you can get apps for free so easily or even a TomTom type box from Halfords with free lifetime updates for less than a ton it was an easy choice. Dunno if that will put off a future buyer not having a nav in the car??Mike335i said:
TheDrBrian said:
Pocket.
Uncomfortable. TrickyTrevM5 said:
The issue with German cars / touch screen functionality is probably also linked to the fact that their autobahns are smoother than silk so not such an issue. The rest of the world though... rhey will say the problem lies not in the engineering but in the deployment / road conditions of the end user market.
My old command system on the E55 was excellent once you were used to it, voice control in the range rover is good, and the idrive system on my 4 yr old M5 is okay..
cleary you never drive in germany or only on one tiny stretch. The autobhans are as smooth as my chiseled chinMy old command system on the E55 was excellent once you were used to it, voice control in the range rover is good, and the idrive system on my 4 yr old M5 is okay..
Had the classic today , pootling along in a 40mph limit village and up ahead a BMW on a crappy private pulls out travelling in the same direction , very slow acceleration after 3/4 mile still nowhere near the limit then into the 50 limit still dawdling along ,after 6 miles at a roundabout he gets in the left turn lane I pull alongside in the right turn lane look over and the driver is leaning left setting stuff with his left hand on the centre of the dash , he then turns right at the roundabout, still playing with the dash . Late model M3 tinted rear windows crappy plate muppet driver playing with the on board toys .
SturdyHSV said:
Automatic lights do tend to turn on well before they're needed, so they may have actually prevented that incident, just for the sake of argument
Except when the sun is very low so it's bright but it's also highly advisable to have lights on so people can see you given the potential for glare.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff