RE: Out of touch: Speed Matters

[ukaskew]

I bought a brand new Renault Clio in 2003 with loads of 'tech' and clever stuff, automatic wipers, automatic lights etc. Hated it. Avoided tech ever since, simply not needed for my 60 minutes per day in the car. I had a hire car with a touch screen a while back and it genuinely blew my mind that there is such an outcry over mobile phone use yet seemingly every new car comes with a touch screen.

A few hours in a car with well laid out physical buttons and you can control everything without ever taking your eyes off the road. Touch screens make that completely impossible.

That was enough to turn me off for good, and why my daily is a Skoda Citigo S (that's the absolute base spec).

[Itsallicanafford]

Ha! Bet none of your systems are controlled by a mouse! There is a reason for that of course, it's totally useless...it's quite a marvel how my Lexus IS hybrid can ghost along silently at 50mph with the electric motors doing there thing while inside it had all the class of a posh calculator. The nav system really is a decade behind the times...

[Mike335i]

I confess to not having read the whole thread, so someone has probably beaten me to it.

Was not impressed with the touch pad or the gesture system on the new bmw Idrive as found on the 5 series and really couldn't not get on with the touch screen in the latest Corsa, even thought the Android Auto was actually pretty good.

I have not tried the Mercedes or Audi systems, but the iDrive rotary controller (gen 2 onwards) is about as good as it gets in my book as I can use it without averting my eyes from the road too much. Why on earth BMW have now added a touch screen is beyond me.

The worst has to be the 'Blue and me' in the alfa. Complicated menu structure, odd button layout and a very small screen in the instrument cluster. Very distracting when it works, dangerous when it doesn't, which is most of the time.

[TheDrBrian]

Mr-B said:

I quite like the system in my MK4 MX5, quite basic but intuitive and at least there are a few physical knobs scattered around for all the things you want to be able to just reach out and turn/push to get what you want just using muscle memory and not having to look at a screen menu.

And the voice interface is alright too. So long as you don't try anything too clever(play Metallica - for whom the bell tolls , from the S&M album) and stick with find directions to or turn up the volume it just works.

EDIT: and the screen works fine with polarised sunglasses

[simonrockman]

The manufacturer which gets this really right is Volvo. Particularly with the lower end systems. I drove a V60 Polestar and I think it had the best uesr interface of any car I've driven.

The Tesla system is distracting and over the top.

The Ferrari system of doing everything on the wheel has merit, but then they ruin it by having carplay which is just a remote control for the iPhone. When I wanted to test it I bought an iPhone on-line, used it for the test and returned it in the 14 day remote-selling grace period. Don't like iPhones.

I went to a Jaguar event where it demoed a system which watched your finger approach the touch screen, determined where you were about to press and triggered the event before you pressed. It also showed some ultra sonic technology which, with lots of tiny speakers gave the feel of a shape in mid-air.

One of the great advantages of soft systems is that you can have text instead of icons. Text works much better. ISTR being surprised at how well labelled the buttons were in a Lexus LFA.

Manufacturers like icons because they don't have to do different language versions for different territories. One size fits all, but lots of icons are unfathomable. If you go from an E-type to an XJS they moved from text to icons and it's a definite downgrade.

[interloper]

T1berious said:

Cotic said:

Cold said:

"You must think in Russian".

Errrr.... Firefox?

Yup

That was a terrible film! Thought operated controls, its an interesting idea unless the car starts picking up your passengers thoughts or your dogs in which case things could get problematic.

Knobs and switches and an old stereo with an aux socket for me. I don't like screens in cars (unless its the windscreen) and even the term "infotainment" makes my skin crawl!

[anonymous-user]

Recently rented a c class and there was what looked like a cheap chinese ipad ripoff attached awkwardly to the dash. Not only did it look cr@p but it was seriously distracting and you have to use a crappy mouse contraption to do everything from a/c to music. Completely ruined an otherwise really nice car.

[anonymous-user]

interloper said:

I don't like screens in cars (unless its the windscreen) and even the term "infotainment" makes my skin crawl!

Likewise! IMO you should be able to use all the controls in a car intuitively without taking your eyes off the road.

[Mr-B]

TheDrBrian said:

And the voice interface is alright too. So long as you don't try anything too clever(play Metallica - for whom the bell tolls , from the S&M album) and stick with find directions to or turn up the volume it just works.

EDIT: and the screen works fine with polarised sunglasses

Must confess I haven't tried the voice control yet, will give it a go.

[bearman68]

MartinT1991 said:

My 2013 Megane has navigation built in and it's good but deliberately hard to use whilst driving I think personally cars should have a cut off feature for when the car is moving just like in built DVD players at the front used to have and only allow basic changes like change your music or heating if they must be touchscreen, in my car you cannot adjust settings whilst it's moving and all cars should be like this in my view full touch screens should be banned they are a danger bring back very basic cars

Not sure about basic cars, but bringing back basic punctuation would be a good start.

[Tuna]

This subject came up in the Tesla thread. It definitely splits opinion - some see touch as the way forward, and some see it as a distraction.

Outside of PH, I'm not sure which side has the most support.

[keith jecks]

The system in my Merc SL works really well. And being German, polarised sunglasses do not affect what you see. For me that is a real issue as my sunglasses are prescription glasses and I can't just take them off. That is an issue in some Ferraris and it sounds like Alfa (and to my surprise McLaren) have the same problem

[EDLT]

My car is an ancient nine years old, so it doesn't have a touchscreen or any menus. What's actually in there?

[ukaskew]

Tuna said:

Outside of PH, I'm not sure which side has the most support.

Im certain it's a selling point for the majority of new car buyers/leaders. Whether it's a particularly safe concept is another matter.

[robm3]

TNH said:

BMW iDrive is definitely the best I have come across.

Touchscreens are a bloody nightmare on the move.

Another vote for BMW here. Very easy to use plus a depth of information you can access if you wish including split screen for things like trip computer and sat Nav at same time. My JLR products aren't too bad but do feel like a step backwards in comparison. I never warmed to the merc system and despise the Audi and Ford set ups.

[chrispmartha]

Now i'm one for embracing new tech and really like some of the integrated systems in modern cars, the iDrive in the BMW is probably the best out there IMO, I especially like having a decent in built Sat Nav, although a little toy like in its interface the uconnect system in the Abarth is actually turning out to be wuite well thought out and easy to use. But tge screen thing can go too far, my wife nearly got a new Citroen C3 (really like what theyve done with that car!) but everything is controlled by touch screen, she hated that snd couldnt live with it day to day, stuff like heater controls are surely far safer and easier to use when not buried in the entertainment/sat nav screen!

[Wynn Duffy]

Another vote for the BMW iDrive, The wife's 2012 5 Series is a dream to use, sadly the same cannot be said for the Navigation on my old Mercedes Comand CD system, the Phone, Radio etc work great though, easy and no touch screen.

My 1988 Boeing 737-300 (well not really mine, but i have been the lead pilot on it for 7 years now!) has two screens for each pilot, that and the thick flight deck windows mean Polarised sunglasses are no good for me, they have a tendency to black out the graphics on the screens.
And don't get me started on ergonomics, there are far too many switches and dials!!!

[TomScrut]

I like the systems without touchscreen.

Audi MMI and BMW iDrive spring to mind. Haven't used a recent iDrive but the latest version of MMI is great.

Audi also have the balance of what is controlled by the system and what is controlled by a button nailed. Heated seats, heater etc are all on buttons so you don't have to look at the screen to activate while the interior still looks clean and tidy. Only criticism I have on the A4/A5 is that with VC fitted the fixed centre screen seems redundant a lot of the time so should be foldable. But at least the screen looks like it's meant to be there unlike the Mercs where it looks like an iPad stuck in a stalk.

[Mike335i]

TomScrut said:

Audi also have the balance of what is controlled by the system and what is controlled by a button nailed. Heated seats, heater etc are all on buttons so you don't have to look at the screen to activate while the interior still looks clean and tidy.

This is where the better car manufacturers get it right and so many seem to go wrong. All driving related controls or those used frequently should be usable without looking at them. I really don't understand the derision of physical buttons on a dash, or on the steering wheel for that matter.

As long as they are logically laid out and not overdone, then it's surely much better to keep the physical buttons.

[swisstoni]

People seem to be looking out of the front window less and less with modern cars.

Ergonomics (a word you could not escape for many years) is now a dead art it would seem, killed off by the 'Wow - a touch screen!' crew.