Would you wait 45 minutes when filling up to get it free?

[TA14]

Coolbanana said:

So much of stupid by the Anti-EV Crowd it beggars belief!

1. You DO NOT have to own an EV car at the moment. So you can all stop losing sleep this week.
2. You DO NOT even have to own a Hybrid. Ditto above re the sleep.
3. The amount of investment into EV has increased hugely in the last 5 years and is increasing exponentially. Many Governments and Manufacturers have clearly decided EV is the next power-source for motor vehicles and are very actively working towards ditching ICE altogether.
4. The above DOES mean that anyone Anti-EV will have to one day accept that it is EV or nothing. So you can lose sleep over that if you must.
5. The dates we see bandied about are circa 2040 for EV being the predominant power-source but that doesn't mean to say existing ICE cars will need to be scrapped; they will simply be banned from certain Zones, much like we have already but far more wide-ranging I would expect. So lose sleep over that too if you must, but only from 2040-ish.
6. The whole 'How EV cars are to be charged' and 'Range' is a POINTLESS debate right now since the EV cars of 2040 will be somewhat more advanced than those we have today! Common-sense, people!
7. Anyone who tries to pick a fault with existing tech and 'oh, but EV hasn't progressed much in 70 years, it won't in the next 20' is being silly. The comparative investment in ICE vs EV in the last 70 years was very heavily pro-ICE. That is now very clearly changing. Multi-billion Pound companies DO NOT invest large-scale into something as significant as EV unless they are convinced of its success in the long term.
8. No-one will take your ICE weekend toy away from you in the Future, but you will be restricted as to where you can drive it.
9. If you live in a place with no parking several solutions will be available: rental, shared ownership, autonomous vehicles, in-road charging where you simply park OVER the charging device that wirelessly charges your car after recognising your Charging Account details.

Aaaaand finally, yes, one day folks, you WILL be forced into EV. Get used to it now, it'll be less painful for you when the time comes. But stop with the stupid comments relating to existing cars; they are only the early models compared to what is coming in the next 5, 10, 15 and 20 years.

If people all thought like many on PH in the past, we would never have had cars in the first place! "Oh, but we can't get one of THOSE contraptions, where are we going to park it! Getting fuel is so far away! Will it go as far as my horse? I can't see those selling well, too expensive, low range, slow..."

Clearly, there are a lot of 'Experts' on PH...expert at using Google only I suggest that until you prove yourselves in the same way as Elon Musk, you should really leave it to the actual Experts...

Neat summary. Do you dare post it on the EV thread?

[Mr2Mike]

RobDickinson said:

things like this
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/london-st...

and
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/tesla-urban-sup...

So it's solved for a specific situation rather than generally. Lamp posts are not spaced one or even two cars apart, so that gives an inherent limitation on charging points. Some streets have no lamp posts, and there are plenty of roads, even in the capital craphole, that don't even have a pavement next to parked cars.

The second link doesn't show any on-street charging, the chargers are all located in proper parking spaces e.g. in supermarkets etc.

Coolbanana said:

So much of stupid by the Anti-EV Crowd it beggars belief!

Your points are all reasonable, but why blame the Anti-EV crowd without so much of a mention of the Pro-EV people who are trying to deny any of the current problems exist?

Edited by Mr2Mike on Tuesday 19th September 10:21

[RobDickinson]

its a crying shame we dont have electricity on every street isnt it.

[siovey]

Ares said:

In which case, the savings are greater....?

True. Not much I can say against this logic. But my point is, I'd rather be doing something else rather than sitting around in my car for 45 mins to save 60 quid. Now, if I could sit my fat lazy ass on the sofa for the same deal....

[Mr2Mike]

RobDickinson said:

its a crying shame we dont have electricity on every street isnt it.

I wouldn't say it was a crying shame, but it will certain broaden the scope of the work that will need to be done.

[Toltec]

kambites said:

Mr2Mike said:

And what's the efficiency of the Qualcomm solution compared to using a cable? How much energy will be pissed away once the uptake of EV's is significant?

They claim the DC to DC efficiency of their stationary wireless systems is about 90%. I don't know how the ones designed to charge a vehicle when moving compare; probably a bit worse since putting the coil under a motorway surface will increase separation distance significantly.

Of course the energy cost (and indeed cost in other ways) of installing the things would be obscene.

Imagine what would happen if this was only fitted to the left hand lane of motorways

[Tuvra]

The Spruce goose said:

yes would work it around shopping or the gym. Seems fair to me, we get so upset waiting minutes for anything but 45 minutes once or even twice a week is no time at all.

This.

Or If the Petrol Station had a cafe/pub nearby, just chill out for an hour.

[FiF]

Mr2Mike said:

Shakermaker said:

Well we seem to have let a huge number of people into the thread who don't have access to off-road parking outside their house and have to leave their car "on the street" in such a manner that they won't possibly be able to ever charge an EV at home if they were to buy one.

Why do you think that is surprising? I think something like 40% of homes have no off-street parking.

I notice the OP still hasn't amended his post to say that joining this exclusive, low cost but long wait fuel club has a rather high entry fee.

Edited by Mr2Mike on Tuesday 19th September 09:08

I don't think less than 9k for a top spec 63 plate Leaf Tekna is a rather high entry fee tbh.

Quite amused at the term leg draggers applied to the anti EV faction.

[otolith]

RobDickinson said:

I've never driven either, I expect the M5 should be more fun, but even CH drove a P100D for top gear recently and was impressed.

https://www.topgear.com/videos/chris-harris-drives/chris-harris-drives-tesla-model-s-p100d

[otolith]

Mr2Mike said:

I notice the OP still hasn't amended his post to say that joining this exclusive, low cost but long wait fuel club has a rather high entry fee.

Don't worry, give it time and depreciation and they'll let the great unwashed in too.

[PixelpeepS3]

Results so far:

[Jinx]

Coolbanana said:

7. Anyone who tries to pick a fault with existing tech and 'oh, but EV hasn't progressed much in 70 years, it won't in the next 20' is being silly. The comparative investment in ICE vs EV in the last 70 years was very heavily pro-ICE. That is now very clearly changing. Multi-billion Pound companies DO NOT invest large-scale into something as significant as EV unless they are convinced of its success in the long term.

Cough - 133 years

The problem is battery tech is still low energy density compared with petrol and diesel (and this is where the real research money needs to be spent - not on "surveys" and "user stories"). The push for electric is based on bad science and political will and not in the interests of the consumer (much like DAB and smart meters) . There is a place for EVs but forcing them when they are not ready onto an unprepared consumer base will only create push back and resentment.

[treeroy]

Yes I would be happy to wait 45 minutes to fill up for a fiver. There's a petrol station near my work and I could leave it there and come back an hour later.

But I would NOT be happy if that was the ONLY way of filling up. That's the difference between this question and an electric car. There is no way of quickly refuelling an EV. Not yet at least.

More important is the lack of infrastructure, I can say I don't think I have ever seen a charging point at a petrol station.

[otolith]

Jinx said:

The push for electric is based on bad science

What do you have in mind?

[InitialDave]

FiF said:

I don't think less than 9k for a top spec 63 plate Leaf Tekna is a rather high entry fee tbh.

Quite amused at the term leg draggers applied to the anti EV faction.

It's not an unreasonable point, EVS are generally a fair bit more expensive new than the equivalent petrol car.

[DoubleD]

PixelpeepS3 said:

Results so far:

Apart from liking cheap fuel every now and then what does this actually prove?

[thegreenhell]

DoubleD said:

PixelpeepS3 said:

Results so far:

Apart from liking cheap fuel every now and then what does this actually prove?

That fewer than 300 people care enough to be bothered to vote?

[Coolbanana]

The Crack Fox said:

People have been saying that for decades already.

EV has never had the investment nor the attention that it is now getting - do you not see that? Governments did not push it very hard as a major power-source; as a replacement for ICE. Until recently.

How do you NOT see that things have changed???

The Experimental Phase is over. The 'Let's Dabble in EV A Bit' Phase has finally past. Only now, since Tesla really, have the major Manufacturers decided to take note of what has previously been a Novelty, a Sideshow.

Only now will EV really advance because only now has it gone from Sideshow to the Main Feature! The whole "people have been saying that for decades already" argument is truly daft. Sure, those with foresight have seen it coming and talked about it for decades. And yes, it has been a very slow burn in terms of actually getting the push it needed by the powers-that-be and the buy-in by the main Manufacturers. But it is now happening. Look around you.

Exponential growth is occurring.

Autonomous vehicles, EV...the future of ICE is not in cars anymore, things are changing.

[DoubleD]

And when electric cars become popular the government will tax them like crazy, then we will move onto something else.

[InitialDave]

thegreenhell said:

DoubleD said:

PixelpeepS3 said:

Results so far:

Apart from liking cheap fuel every now and then what does this actually prove?

That fewer than 300 people care enough to be bothered to vote?

Also I think a lot of people need the third option of "most of the time, yes, but that's going to be inconvenient sometimes"