RE: McLaren 720S: Driven

[NJJ]

The 720S for me is a bit like the supercar version of the Porsche 911 Turbo S, except with different engine placement and with a proper supercar looks. However, they both share the same similar clinical approach to outright silly performance, both have high quality interiors and are largely well built, leaving aside some McLaren issues on that front. However, for noise and sheer pull-at-the-heart strings drama, they are both strangely lacking. I am sure the 745LT(?) will be a riot though.

[D200]

Streetrod said:

Sorry to be pedantic but the 720s is substantially quicker than the 488, you can find the evidence everywhere, but as you say speed is not everything.

At the end its down to what pushes your buttons, I am just glad that we currently have such varied choices.

Your GTR example I am afraid is a red herring as virtually any car could be made to go faster with the right tuning. We are talking about factory standard cars here

You are not being pedantic, more like subjective beyond belief.

What is your definition of ‘substantially quicker’?

Looking up at the times for a 488 and 720

0-60 is 2.8 vs 2.9 - is that ‘SUBSTANTIALLY’ quicker?

0-124 is 7.8 vs 8.3 - is that ‘SUBSTANTIALLY’ quicker?

They have extremely similar performance, to say otherwise is simply wrong.

If you drove a 488 found far too slow, felt the car needed to be approximately 0.5 second quicker when accelering from 0-124 mph [as this is obviously the first thing you do every time you take the car out – launch control and max acceleration to 200mph+] then I don’t know, I think you would be talking utter nonsense

Also, my other question very simple – nothing to do with tuned cars vs standard - simply if car A is a tiny bit faster than car B does that make it a better car?

[Draexin]

ocrx8 said:

Another day another McLaren article. In recent weeks we’ve had:

720S
Brutal P15
Delivery miles F1
MSO special edition (yet another)
F1 owners tour
P1 revisited
BP23

Edited by ocrx8 on Friday 20th October 08:14

Did you know that in the past 2 weeks there have been an equal amount of articles about Mazda's as there have been about McLarens?
To be honest, I know what I'd rather be reading about.

Anyway, amazing looking car, especially in a darker colour. Hides away the huge openings around the front lights a bit, which was the only thing I wasn't sure about design wise.

[Onehp]

D200 said:

You are not being pedantic, more like subjective beyond belief.
What is your definition of ‘substantially quicker’?
Looking up at the times for a 488 and 720

There is your fall. A F12 TdF is substantially quicker than both on paper, but in the first real life rolling pulls, the 720s leaves the TdF standing.
According to drag times, it exits 1/2 mile faster than a 918

D200 said:

Also, my other question very simple – nothing to do with tuned cars vs standard - simply if car A is a tiny bit faster than car B does that make it a better car?

No. Not even if it is significantly faster. I have not much experience with this category cars, just a proper blast in a 458. But despite the noise and pace, I wasn't very impressed because I had expected that the suspension, the steering and the brakes would be a lot better than they actually were...

[anonymous-user]

GranCab said:

I had a test drive in a 720S ( and a 570 Spider ) a couple of weeks ago.

The 570's brakes were useless on the road at normal speeds and there's not enough room for a tall driver to get comfortable and the interior is a bit dull, it drives and steers well but sounds crap. Not a car to fall in love with. 7/10

The 720's brakes felt far more 'normal' at road speeds - far easier to modulate, again it rode and steered nicely but ... the road noise from the rear - due to the open deck - was irritating to the point of being a deal breaker, again an uninspiring noise from the powerplant.
This particular car was full of warning lights for engine management, tyre pressures etc. - despite being shipped directly from McLaren for the occasion. 6.5/10

Interestingly I also drove both cars and absolutely loved the 570 Spider!

[Streetrod]

D200 said:

Streetrod said:

Sorry to be pedantic but the 720s is substantially quicker than the 488, you can find the evidence everywhere, but as you say speed is not everything.

At the end its down to what pushes your buttons, I am just glad that we currently have such varied choices.

Your GTR example I am afraid is a red herring as virtually any car could be made to go faster with the right tuning. We are talking about factory standard cars here

You are not being pedantic, more like subjective beyond belief.

What is your definition of ‘substantially quicker’?

Looking up at the times for a 488 and 720

0-60 is 2.8 vs 2.9 - is that ‘SUBSTANTIALLY’ quicker?

0-124 is 7.8 vs 8.3 - is that ‘SUBSTANTIALLY’ quicker?

They have extremely similar performance, to say otherwise is simply wrong.

If you drove a 488 found far too slow, felt the car needed to be approximately 0.5 second quicker when accelering from 0-124 mph [as this is obviously the first thing you do every time you take the car out – launch control and max acceleration to 200mph+] then I don’t know, I think you would be talking utter nonsense

Also, my other question very simple – nothing to do with tuned cars vs standard - simply if car A is a tiny bit faster than car B does that make it a better car?

Mate, I am not trying to argumentative but your are quoting factory figures. Check out the real numbers people are geting with the cars on the track, this is just one example, others are available if you care to look, go to 10 mins to see the VBOX data

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eawOtLnMgo8

The 720s reaches 60mph in 2.54 seconds which in terms of percentages is substantially quicker than the 488, does it really matter on the street? well of course not. I am just talking about raw straight line performance here. And when you look at the real test data at various speed point the story is pretty much the same.

Now does that make it a better car? Overall, not nessasarly, but on this one metric, then yes it does.

At the end of the day, you buy the car that appeals to you as a road car, in this case its the 720s for me and that decision is based on a huge range of factors, others will make different choices. Only If you were going to race the car regularly do these numbers become increasing important, but they do make for a good talking point

[LotusOmega375D]

It's a couple of steps out of my league price-wise, but I think it seems cheap! I would have one over a common-or-garden Aventador or Aventador S any day and I believe that this is less expensive and quicker. It only looks good in black though.

[br d]

Tuvra said:

Visually it just doesn't excite me. I'd have one of these over it every day of the week:-

A gorgeous looking car no doubt but for the wing, I know it's integral to the clever aero but it does have the "bolted on" look about it.

[unpc]

I'm glad they liked the interior. Was my baby)

[Streetrod]

unpc said:

I'm glad they liked the interior. Was my baby)

Thats interesting, can you tell us more?

[jcl]

Nice. I'll have a 911 GT3, a Radical, and a mint S2 106 Rallye instead please.

And a massive train set, a boxed AT-AT and Millennium Falcon.

[macky17]

It's getting to the point with these major manufacturer super/hyper cars that you just know they aren't going to be particularly inspiring to drive. They are so, so, very fast that any unpredictability, playfulness or interesting behaviour has to be engineered out just so ordinary punters don't kill themselves and everyone around them. I wish I could afford one... so I could use the money to buy something else. The F12 may be an exception as I understand those are a little lairy, hence that's where I'd look first. Koenigsegg have the right idea I think; raw brutal and if you die, it's a hell of a way to go.

[The Vambo]

macky17 said:

It's getting to the point with these major manufacturer super/hyper cars that you just know they aren't going to be particularly inspiring to drive. They are so, so, very fast that any unpredictability, playfulness or interesting behaviour has to be engineered out just so ordinary punters don't kill themselves and everyone around them. I wish I could afford one... so I could use the money to buy something else. The F12 may be an exception as I understand those are a little lairy, hence that's where I'd look first. Koenigsegg have the right idea I think; raw brutal and if you die, it's a hell of a way to go.

Maybe one day you might even get a chance to drive one of those cars that you have already decided are boring.

[Blayney]

If I could afford 265k i think I'd stretch my budget to the 420k for a Ford GT. Now that looks like a supercar

Edited by Blayney on Friday 20th October 19:08

[anonymous-user]

The Vambo said:

macky17 said:

It's getting to the point with these major manufacturer super/hyper cars that you just know they aren't going to be particularly inspiring to drive. They are so, so, very fast that any unpredictability, playfulness or interesting behaviour has to be engineered out just so ordinary punters don't kill themselves and everyone around them. I wish I could afford one... so I could use the money to buy something else. The F12 may be an exception as I understand those are a little lairy, hence that's where I'd look first. Koenigsegg have the right idea I think; raw brutal and if you die, it's a hell of a way to go.

Maybe one day you might even get a chance to drive one of those cars that you have already decided are boring.

Interestingly though ...: I was fortunate to have an hour with a 570 Spider and then a 720S a few weeks back.

The 720 sacred the bejeezus out of me it was so fast. The 570 though, with its conventional suspension was very fast but also gave huge feedback through the steering and felt so much more playful and 'alive'.

I'm a very average driver though so maybe it's just me

[mr shoddy]

With regards to driving them on British roads, my issue with the 720 (and the Ferrari 458/488) is that they just seem to big.
I saw a 720s on the motorway and it seemed to fill the whole lane it was so wide.
Maybe the styling makes these super cars seem wider than they are but i can't help thinking that threading them down some of the narrow roads in say, North Wales or the Lake District would be a nightmare,

[Maldini35]

Blayney said:

If I could afford 265k i think I'd stretch my budget to the 420k for a Ford GT. Now that looks like I supercar

You can get in a 720S for £220k so £420k is a serious ‘stretch’ at nearly double the price.
I agree the Ford looks stunning but the 720S also looks 100% a proper supercar whether you like the design or not.
It’s certainly not bland.
And those doors...

[isaldiri]

Streetrod said:

I do find it odd when people continue to compare this to a 675, its a replacement for the 650s, its not a limited run car its the ordinary one. Which makes its capabilities all the more extraordinary.

The 675 replacement will be along in a few year times, at that point you should compare it to the 675.

And I find it odd that people fail to see that the point being made is that Mclaren clearly understand how to engineer an exciting feeling car. the 675 very clearly shows this and to a lesser extent the 570 but have consciously made a decision not to dial that into the car but instead have chosen to make it easy to get to and drive at mental speeds. I'm really not asking for the 720 to feel exactly like a 675 in case that isn't clear to you - merely as I stated something of the 675's character with more smoothed out edges instead of throwing even more speed and power at the P14. That would have made it, for me a considerably better sports car as at the moment it feels far too much like a hyperspeed GT car, even compared to the 12c/650.

That said, Mclaren might well have correctly judged the target market of buyers of their £250k cars simply want more performance rather than the more subjective 'feel' and I'm very much in the minority.

Desert Dragon said:

Is it true its nearer 800 PS? Also whilst the design is very clever not having conventional side scoops like 488 could perhaps cause issues with cooling , IATs etc. I'm getting super close to maybe buying an McLaren one day.

I'm definitely clueless but will attempt an answer to this anyway Couldn't say if it really was 800PS but tbh I very much doubt it. Mclaren are not exactly famous for giving stuff away for free, if it was truly 800PS I'm dead certain they would say so and charge for it. The car though is definitely stunningly quick but I think it's more a combination of the hydraulic suspension putting down power incredibly well (I can for example almost (if not quite) stamp on the throttle out of a corner like a rear engine 911 on track in the 12c and that's a full generation ago) and Mclaren moving the torque curve around to deliver more power earlier as they did in the 570. I don't exactly have another 800PS car lying around to compare as well to be fair though! I couldn't answer the issues about cooling although a friend was on a Mclaren trackday at Portimao earlier in the summer in near 40 celcius and he didn't have issues which is quite remarkable as I can guarantee the 650/12c would definitely have had to take a fair few breaks due to overheating.

[Blayney]

Maldini35 said:

You can get in a 720S for £220k so £420k is a serious ‘stretch’ at nearly double the price.
I agree the Ford looks stunning but the 720S also looks 100% a proper supercar whether you like the design or not.
It’s certainly not bland.
And those doors...

If you have enough to justify that on a 720 I'd wager most people buying them could also afford a gt though. It's not like stretching to a 2010 Passat when toy can only affors a 2008 fiesta...

Also anything you can do I can do better

[anonymous-user]

mr shoddy said:

With regards to driving them on British roads, my issue with the 720 (and the Ferrari 458/488) is that they just seem to big.
I saw a 720s on the motorway and it seemed to fill the whole lane it was so wide.
Maybe the styling makes these super cars seem wider than they are but i can't help thinking that threading them down some of the narrow roads in say, North Wales or the Lake District would be a nightmare,

The 720 feels very compact when you're driving it. Maybe it's all the glass giving such great visibility.