RE: PH Bloodline: Aussie tribute
Discussion
unsprung said:
That's a good petrolhead movie, should strike a chord with many true PH'ers
Fetchez la vache said:
article said:
why are the electric window switches left in the middle of the car and not on any of the doors?
Sounds good from a long term / buying used point of view. Window electrics and locking are renowned to not to work in older cars as the wires need to continually bend whenever the door opens, overtime these break. Unless you can re-wire it yourself you're talking £250 a door, which is often more than the car is worth.I think my old Saab 95 had them in the middle too. Wish they all did it that way tbh.
Spanglepants said:
Dad, who emigrated to Oz, had a Chrysler Charger Hemi.
We visited in 2006/7 and to be honest what was noticeable was the lack of variety of car makes. It seemed all you saw driving around was Ford or Holden.
Gee, where did you visit? Alice Springs? There is huge diversity in Aus roads....part of the reason Holden/Ford shutdown. Nobody was buying them.We visited in 2006/7 and to be honest what was noticeable was the lack of variety of car makes. It seemed all you saw driving around was Ford or Holden.
RBH58 said:
Gee, where did you visit? Alice Springs? There is huge diversity in Aus roads....part of the reason Holden/Ford shutdown. Nobody was buying them.
Quite. My neighbours:
Land Rover Freelander II, 1970s Ford F100 ute and a Ford Ranger 4WD Ute
Toyota Rav 4 and a VW Golf Mk VII
Mazda CX5 and a Pug 3008
2 x Nissan Patrols (serious off road machines) and a Ford Focus
Saab 9-5 wagon and a similar vintage Ford Falcon wagon.
My Skoda Octavia.
There's a couple of Commodore utes further up the road, and one Toyota Camry sedan which is a company car, but it's pretty diverse and this is in a suburb of a regional centre 2 hrs from Sydney.
Colonial said:
RBH58 said:
Gee, where did you visit? Alice Springs? There is huge diversity in Aus roads....part of the reason Holden/Ford shutdown. Nobody was buying them.
Quite. My neighbours:
Land Rover Freelander II, 1970s Ford F100 ute and a Ford Ranger 4WD Ute
Toyota Rav 4 and a VW Golf Mk VII
Mazda CX5 and a Pug 3008
2 x Nissan Patrols (serious off road machines) and a Ford Focus
Saab 9-5 wagon and a similar vintage Ford Falcon wagon.
My Skoda Octavia.
There's a couple of Commodore utes further up the road, and one Toyota Camry sedan which is a company car, but it's pretty diverse and this is in a suburb of a regional centre 2 hrs from Sydney.
Edited by RBH58 on Wednesday 25th October 11:32
Colonial said:
RBH58 said:
Gee, where did you visit? Alice Springs? There is huge diversity in Aus roads....part of the reason Holden/Ford shutdown. Nobody was buying them.
Quite. My neighbours:
Land Rover Freelander II, 1970s Ford F100 ute and a Ford Ranger 4WD Ute
Toyota Rav 4 and a VW Golf Mk VII
Mazda CX5 and a Pug 3008
2 x Nissan Patrols (serious off road machines) and a Ford Focus
Saab 9-5 wagon and a similar vintage Ford Falcon wagon.
My Skoda Octavia.
There's a couple of Commodore utes further up the road, and one Toyota Camry sedan which is a company car, but it's pretty diverse and this is in a suburb of a regional centre 2 hrs from Sydney.
Edited by RBH58 on Wednesday 25th October 11:33
Fetchez la vache said:
Sounds good from a long term / buying used point of view. Window electrics and locking are renowned to not to work in older cars as the wires need to continually bend whenever the door opens, overtime these break. Unless you can re-wire it yourself you're talking £250 a door, which is often more than the car is worth.
I think my old Saab 95 had them in the middle too. Wish they all did it that way tbh.
Uhmm, you realise that there will still need to be wires into the doors, regardless of where the switch is, right??I think my old Saab 95 had them in the middle too. Wish they all did it that way tbh.
That Sandman is ace.....the lovely lady passenger in the back is....we'll never mind. I think I should emigrate to OZ straight away!
The thing is, OZ has fantastic weather, great roads, lovely V8s, and gorgeous women!
I've just Driven back to Teeside today........it does not appear to be like OZ.
The thing is, OZ has fantastic weather, great roads, lovely V8s, and gorgeous women!
I've just Driven back to Teeside today........it does not appear to be like OZ.
Couple of points that need corrected.
The window switches are in the middle of the Commodore so they only need one switch block to do RHD and LHD. Why is it odd for Holden to do that when Merc W123, W124, w202, w210 (and no doubt lots more) all have their window switches on the centre console?
As for the Corolla, it was never built at Toyota's plant in Port Melbourne mainly because Toyota don't have a plant in Port Melbourne. Their plant is in Altona. Holden's engine plant was, and HQ is, in Port Melbourne, as is Toyota's HQ.
During the 90s there was weird crossbreeding program where United Australian Automobile Industries (which was a JV between Toyota and Holden) produced the Toyota Camry / Holden Apollo, Toyota Corolla / Holden Nova and the Toyota Lexcen / Holden Commodore. There were also weird alliances between Ford and Nissan. Those were all in an effort to get economies of scale by part sharing but ultimately didn't work. AFAIK the Corolla / Nova was built in Dandenong (a delightful suburb of Melbourne) in a Holden factory (which is now the national parts warehouse).
It is sad it has all ended, but it was never going to keep going for long, even if the Government had been sensible and stumped up the small amount needed each year (which was far less per capita than any other government globally subsidises their car industry by btw). The RWD Commodore was already dead - the replacement, had it been built locally, would have been off a global FWD platform, but tbh I doubt anything would have been viable after that (especially given what GM have just done to Opel).
The reality is that the market in Aus is very, very fragmented - at the time the closure was announced there were 63 brands in the market, all vying for a slice of 1,000,000 sales a year. It is far and away the most contested market in the world for some reason. I really can't understand why some companies even bother to sell here. For example Citroen sold 965 cars. Not per month, not per quarter, in the whole entire year! Jaguar only did 3,008 (Porsche did 4,434) and FIAT did 2,414. Admittedly the smaller guys use importers who manage multiple brands but I still don't see how it is worth the effort to engineer in ADR compliance for such low volumes.
The fragmentation is demonstrated by the fact that Holden have gone from making and selling well over 100,000 Commodores per year 20 years ago to doing 94,308 total sales last year across around 8 or 9 carlines.
That is globalisation for you.
The window switches are in the middle of the Commodore so they only need one switch block to do RHD and LHD. Why is it odd for Holden to do that when Merc W123, W124, w202, w210 (and no doubt lots more) all have their window switches on the centre console?
As for the Corolla, it was never built at Toyota's plant in Port Melbourne mainly because Toyota don't have a plant in Port Melbourne. Their plant is in Altona. Holden's engine plant was, and HQ is, in Port Melbourne, as is Toyota's HQ.
During the 90s there was weird crossbreeding program where United Australian Automobile Industries (which was a JV between Toyota and Holden) produced the Toyota Camry / Holden Apollo, Toyota Corolla / Holden Nova and the Toyota Lexcen / Holden Commodore. There were also weird alliances between Ford and Nissan. Those were all in an effort to get economies of scale by part sharing but ultimately didn't work. AFAIK the Corolla / Nova was built in Dandenong (a delightful suburb of Melbourne) in a Holden factory (which is now the national parts warehouse).
It is sad it has all ended, but it was never going to keep going for long, even if the Government had been sensible and stumped up the small amount needed each year (which was far less per capita than any other government globally subsidises their car industry by btw). The RWD Commodore was already dead - the replacement, had it been built locally, would have been off a global FWD platform, but tbh I doubt anything would have been viable after that (especially given what GM have just done to Opel).
The reality is that the market in Aus is very, very fragmented - at the time the closure was announced there were 63 brands in the market, all vying for a slice of 1,000,000 sales a year. It is far and away the most contested market in the world for some reason. I really can't understand why some companies even bother to sell here. For example Citroen sold 965 cars. Not per month, not per quarter, in the whole entire year! Jaguar only did 3,008 (Porsche did 4,434) and FIAT did 2,414. Admittedly the smaller guys use importers who manage multiple brands but I still don't see how it is worth the effort to engineer in ADR compliance for such low volumes.
The fragmentation is demonstrated by the fact that Holden have gone from making and selling well over 100,000 Commodores per year 20 years ago to doing 94,308 total sales last year across around 8 or 9 carlines.
That is globalisation for you.
Jader1973 said:
The reality is that the market in Aus is very, very fragmented - at the time the closure was announced there were 63 brands in the market, all vying for a slice of 1,000,000 sales a year. It is far and away the most contested market in the world for some reason. I really can't understand why some companies even bother to sell here. For example Citroen sold 965 cars. Not per month, not per quarter, in the whole entire year! Jaguar only did 3,008 (Porsche did 4,434) and FIAT did 2,414. Admittedly the smaller guys use importers who manage multiple brands but I still don't see how it is worth the effort to engineer in ADR compliance for such low volumes.
Margins. The Aus market does get gouged. You’ll notice that most of the cars imported into Aus are highly spec’d. And we have a thing for performance cars even though you can’t use them here. Australia sells the highest number of AMG & M cars as a percentage of total MB & BMW sales in the world. We are the No5 market in the world for AMG. We are Renaultsport’s 2nd largest market. We are the 3rd largest market in the world for the 86/BRZ. 2nd largest market in the world for the Mustang. 8th largest market for Lamborghini. Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can. They wouldn’t all be here if they weren’t making a buck.Edited by RBH58 on Thursday 26th October 11:02
Edited by RBH58 on Thursday 26th October 11:08
Jader1973 said:
The reality is that the market in Aus is very, very fragmented - at the time the closure was announced there were 63 brands in the market, all vying for a slice of 1,000,000 sales a year. It is far and away the most contested market in the world for some reason. I really can't understand why some companies even bother to sell here. For example Citroen sold 965 cars. Not per month, not per quarter, in the whole entire year! Jaguar only did 3,008 (Porsche did 4,434) and FIAT did 2,414. Admittedly the smaller guys use importers who manage multiple brands but I still don't see how it is worth the effort to engineer in ADR compliance for such low volumes.
Margins. The Aus market does get gouged. You’ll notice that most of the cars imported into Aus are highly spec’d. And we have a thing for performance cars even though you can’t use them here. Australia sells the highest number of AMG & M cars as a percentage of total MB & BMW sales in the world. We are the No5 market in the world for AMG. We are Renaultsport’s 2nd largest market. We are the 3rd largest market in the world for the 86/BRZ. 2nd largest market in the world for the Mustang. 8th largest market for Lamborghini. Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can. They wouldn’t all be here if they weren’t making a buck.Edited by RBH58 on Thursday 26th October 11:10
Edited by RBH58 on Thursday 26th October 11:10
RBH58 said:
Margins. The Aus market does get gouged.
Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can.
Is there new legislation that will allow Australians to arrange parallel imports from the UK and Japan -- so as to take advantage of lower cost? Will this help to bring down retail prices in Oz or not?Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can.
Also... Will the notorious Luxury Car Tax remain as is?
Toowoomba and surrounding area.
I must be lying, my eyes deceived me for the two weeks I was there.
Etc etc
My neighbours:
Land Rover Freelander II, 1970s Ford F100 ute and a Ford Ranger 4WD Ute
Toyota Rav 4 and a VW Golf Mk VII
Mazda CX5 and a Pug 3008
2 x Nissan Patrols (serious off road machines) and a Ford Focus
Saab 9-5 wagon and a similar vintage Ford Falcon wagon.
My Skoda Octavia.
There's a couple of Commodore utes further up the road, and one Toyota Camry sedan which is a company car, but it's pretty diverse and this is in a suburb of a regional centre 2 hrs from Sydney.Yep. My (Melbourne) neighbours. Toyota Kluger & a Mitsubishi Lancer. Lotus Europa S2 & a Megane RS225 Cup. Toyota Camry & a Kia Rio. MB 450SL & a Ford XB GT351 coupe (just like Eric Bana’s...lives under a car cover, gets driven once a month). Toyota Hilux & a Mini Cooper S.
I must be lying, my eyes deceived me for the two weeks I was there.
Etc etc
RBH58 said:
Colonial said:
RBH58 said:
Gee, where did you visit? Alice Springs? There is huge diversity in Aus roads....part of the reason Holden/Ford shutdown. Nobody was buying them.
Quite. My neighbours:
Land Rover Freelander II, 1970s Ford F100 ute and a Ford Ranger 4WD Ute
Toyota Rav 4 and a VW Golf Mk VII
Mazda CX5 and a Pug 3008
2 x Nissan Patrols (serious off road machines) and a Ford Focus
Saab 9-5 wagon and a similar vintage Ford Falcon wagon.
My Skoda Octavia.
There's a couple of Commodore utes further up the road, and one Toyota Camry sedan which is a company car, but it's pretty diverse and this is in a suburb of a regional centre 2 hrs from Sydney.
Edited by RBH58 on Wednesday 25th October 11:32
unsprung said:
RBH58 said:
Margins. The Aus market does get gouged.
Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can.
Is there new legislation that will allow Australians to arrange parallel imports from the UK and Japan -- so as to take advantage of lower cost? Will this help to bring down retail prices in Oz or not?Porsche make a fortune here charging prices that they’d laugh at in the UK....because they can.
Also... Will the notorious Luxury Car Tax remain as is?
Yep, the LCT remains but it doesn’t explain Porsche prices here. For example, in the UK an entry level Cayman is around the same money as an Alfa 4C (which is similarly priced in Aus as in the UK). But in Aus a base model Cayman is 50% more expensive than a 4C. Porsche are doing very nicely here.
RBH58 said:
That private import legislation was quietly dropped. Although if you did the math, it wasn’t going to save the consumer anything on mainstream models. It would have simply made it easier to get hold of stuff like Ariel Atoms.
Yep, the LCT remains but it doesn’t explain Porsche prices here. For example, in the UK an entry level Cayman is around the same money as an Alfa 4C (which is similarly priced in Aus as in the UK). But in Aus a base model Cayman is 50% more expensive than a 4C. Porsche are doing very nicely here.
All very interesting. Thank you.Yep, the LCT remains but it doesn’t explain Porsche prices here. For example, in the UK an entry level Cayman is around the same money as an Alfa 4C (which is similarly priced in Aus as in the UK). But in Aus a base model Cayman is 50% more expensive than a 4C. Porsche are doing very nicely here.
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