RE: BMW M3 CS specs announced
Discussion
culpz said:
Raramuri said:
And if you map the 335d it will be faster than this M3 CS too. Bargain.
Diesel though?I know Steve Sutcliffe seemed to prefer the Alpina D4 to the BMW M4, in an Autocar review. Diesels really don't do much for me at all though. There's just no comparison to a petrol IMO, turbo or not.
Edited by culpz on Thursday 9th November 11:39
(plus put the power down better, M-Diiff, handling, noise etc... )
bilo999 said:
As said already - the Alfa is now the mark to hit, amazing that BMW have tried hard and not there. Of course, this car will sell, because whilst its nearly as good (maybe) as the Alfa, people will feel safer spending more on a BMW because of brand perception etc....and I feel ashamed to admit this as an Alfa person, I cant totally disagree. However things are changing, not the best place to post information like this and I do take some of these surveys with a pinch of salt - but I've never seen Alfa do so well in the attached reliability survey - i.e. they are now the most reliable European car !
https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey/
I just think the big thing Alfa need to sort are their patchy dealers service, and I think their biggest problem are the sales staff attitudes. There are some amazing dealers but too many who are better geared in selling higher volume low price, rather than low volume, higher price.
What would BMW do if Alfa started on a Giulia performance special !
Do you think they are the most reliable due to the fact that up until what, 2 years ago, the only cars they sold was the guilietta & mito in very small numbers compared to the rest. Let’s see how they do in 5 years time when they expand their range and sell more cars. https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey/
I just think the big thing Alfa need to sort are their patchy dealers service, and I think their biggest problem are the sales staff attitudes. There are some amazing dealers but too many who are better geared in selling higher volume low price, rather than low volume, higher price.
What would BMW do if Alfa started on a Giulia performance special !
Chestrockwell said:
bilo999 said:
As said already - the Alfa is now the mark to hit, amazing that BMW have tried hard and not there. Of course, this car will sell, because whilst its nearly as good (maybe) as the Alfa, people will feel safer spending more on a BMW because of brand perception etc....and I feel ashamed to admit this as an Alfa person, I cant totally disagree. However things are changing, not the best place to post information like this and I do take some of these surveys with a pinch of salt - but I've never seen Alfa do so well in the attached reliability survey - i.e. they are now the most reliable European car !
https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey/
I just think the big thing Alfa need to sort are their patchy dealers service, and I think their biggest problem are the sales staff attitudes. There are some amazing dealers but too many who are better geared in selling higher volume low price, rather than low volume, higher price.
What would BMW do if Alfa started on a Giulia performance special !
Do you think they are the most reliable due to the fact that up until what, 2 years ago, the only cars they sold was the guilietta & mito in very small numbers compared to the rest. Let’s see how they do in 5 years time when they expand their range and sell more cars. https://www.whatcar.com/news/reliability-survey/
I just think the big thing Alfa need to sort are their patchy dealers service, and I think their biggest problem are the sales staff attitudes. There are some amazing dealers but too many who are better geared in selling higher volume low price, rather than low volume, higher price.
What would BMW do if Alfa started on a Giulia performance special !
Ares said:
culpz said:
Ares said:
...driving great cars is never a waste of time 
Tell that to people on threads on here, about wasting salesmen's time, by testing cars that you have no intention of buying chedixon said:
culpz said:
Raramuri said:
And if you map the 335d it will be faster than this M3 CS too. Bargain.
Diesel though?I know Steve Sutcliffe seemed to prefer the Alpina D4 to the BMW M4, in an Autocar review. Diesels really don't do much for me at all though. There's just no comparison to a petrol IMO, turbo or not.
Edited by culpz on Thursday 9th November 11:39
(plus put the power down better, M-Diiff, handling, noise etc... )
Others issues to note; a 'mapped 335d is not quicker than an F80 M3 at all and no diesel BMW can be compared to a proper M car.
From experience (640d and f80 M3) the two engines are much different in their power delivery. If anyone thinks you can turn a 335d into an M3 you haven't driven the cars.
And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
Having had the F80 M3 (a car I really didn't get on with) & now with an Alpina D3 in the fleet I can honestly say that yes they compare BUT they get to the same point by very different means the M3 was fantastic when you got up on the wheel & drove it.
The rest of the time it was fidgety lacking in traction (I had an early non CP model) & the biggest crime for me was the exhaust note truly terrible.
The D3 is a weapon the M3 is still the better drivers car IMO but the D3 is close & on those days when your not on it, it's the much better car, how they get it to ride so well on 20's is amazing & the D3 is faster top end (not that I've had many chances to test this) I've seen a sat nav verified 170mph in Germany.
The real killer for the M3 is the B3 S (as good as the diesel is I bet the petrol is even better) good job Alpina only make 2600 cars a year.
I still like the fact that they make this CS it shows when they put there mind to it they can still make an Ultimate driving machine just a shame it cost so much.
The rest of the time it was fidgety lacking in traction (I had an early non CP model) & the biggest crime for me was the exhaust note truly terrible.
The D3 is a weapon the M3 is still the better drivers car IMO but the D3 is close & on those days when your not on it, it's the much better car, how they get it to ride so well on 20's is amazing & the D3 is faster top end (not that I've had many chances to test this) I've seen a sat nav verified 170mph in Germany.
The real killer for the M3 is the B3 S (as good as the diesel is I bet the petrol is even better) good job Alpina only make 2600 cars a year.
I still like the fact that they make this CS it shows when they put there mind to it they can still make an Ultimate driving machine just a shame it cost so much.
culpz said:
chedixon said:
culpz said:
Raramuri said:
And if you map the 335d it will be faster than this M3 CS too. Bargain.
Diesel though?I know Steve Sutcliffe seemed to prefer the Alpina D4 to the BMW M4, in an Autocar review. Diesels really don't do much for me at all though. There's just no comparison to a petrol IMO, turbo or not.
Edited by culpz on Thursday 9th November 11:39
(plus put the power down better, M-Diiff, handling, noise etc... )
Others issues to note; a 'mapped 335d is not quicker than an F80 M3 at all and no diesel BMW can be compared to a proper M car.
things gained from reading this thread.
1. BMW's are mechanically and electronically reliable so you should avoid buying Italian cars because they break. German build quality etc.
2. You should probably buy a diesel and re-map it as anything more is a waste of money, making the M3 irrelevant. In these halcyon days of reprogramming the ECU on your own car with a laptop on your driveway, will it break? of course not it is German! (see note 1 above for proof)
3. The driving experience of using said diesel on a daily basis will be so life affirming you will be wondering why BMW builds M performance cars with petrol engines
4. This M3 is an overpriced piece of nonsense, even though I have seen the pictures and have never driven it, I feel much better about myself because the pictures are nowhere near as good as the Alfa and hence, it is a waste of £20k extra.
Ares said:
Maldini35 said:
Crazy list prices just reflect how people are buying cars now I.e. on the never never.
It’s an easy way to increase profits without killing the market.
Until interest rates start to rise that is....
Not really on the never never. Just an easier, cheaper lower risk way to buy a car.It’s an easy way to increase profits without killing the market.
Until interest rates start to rise that is....
Carl_Manchester said:
things gained from reading this thread.
1. BMW's are mechanically and electronically reliable so you should avoid buying Italian cars because they break. German build quality etc.
2. You should probably buy a diesel and re-map it as anything more is a waste of money, making the M3 irrelevant. In these halcyon days of reprogramming the ECU on your own car with a laptop on your driveway, will it break? of course not it is German! (see note 1 above for proof)
3. The driving experience of using said diesel on a daily basis will be so life affirming you will be wondering why BMW builds M performance cars with petrol engines
4. This M3 is an overpriced piece of nonsense, even though I have seen the pictures and have never driven it, I feel much better about myself because the pictures are nowhere near as good as the Alfa and hence, it is a waste of £20k extra.
Bravo sir 1. BMW's are mechanically and electronically reliable so you should avoid buying Italian cars because they break. German build quality etc.
2. You should probably buy a diesel and re-map it as anything more is a waste of money, making the M3 irrelevant. In these halcyon days of reprogramming the ECU on your own car with a laptop on your driveway, will it break? of course not it is German! (see note 1 above for proof)
3. The driving experience of using said diesel on a daily basis will be so life affirming you will be wondering why BMW builds M performance cars with petrol engines
4. This M3 is an overpriced piece of nonsense, even though I have seen the pictures and have never driven it, I feel much better about myself because the pictures are nowhere near as good as the Alfa and hence, it is a waste of £20k extra.
you’ve summed it up rather brilliantly there.It’s such a shame that PH seems to have become little more than a place for people to slag off all cars bar their own choices and tell people “ you don’t want to do that” rather than celebrate the choices available to enthusiasts whilst we still have them
Ho Lee Kau said:
Ares said:
Maldini35 said:
Crazy list prices just reflect how people are buying cars now I.e. on the never never.
It’s an easy way to increase profits without killing the market.
Until interest rates start to rise that is....
Not really on the never never. Just an easier, cheaper lower risk way to buy a car.It’s an easy way to increase profits without killing the market.
Until interest rates start to rise that is....
Chemical Ali said:
From experience (640d and f80 M3) the two engines are much different in their power delivery. If anyone thinks you can turn a 335d into an M3 you haven't driven the cars.
And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
The M3 is an inline 6.And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
Firstly well done BMW for still making or trying to make exciting cars but where are the real drivers manual cars of old. Anyone can pull a paddle. The PlayStation generation are all over it. Something involving without all the silly safety aids and ‘luxuries’ now considered essential 🙄 )
It is a shame it is not fully stripped out like the GTS but with four seats (and two doors). Drivers cars don’t need HK (not Heckler & Koch 😏 ).
Pip
It is a shame it is not fully stripped out like the GTS but with four seats (and two doors). Drivers cars don’t need HK (not Heckler & Koch 😏 ).
Pip
Pip1968 said:
Firstly well done BMW for still making or trying to make exciting cars but where are the real drivers manual cars of old. Anyone can pull a paddle. The PlayStation generation are all over it. Something involving without all the silly safety aids and ‘luxuries’ now considered essential ?? )
It is a shame it is not fully stripped out like the GTS but with four seats (and two doors). Drivers cars don’t need HK (not Heckler & Koch ?? ).
Pip
The GTS has electric mirrors/windows, climate control, cup holders, garage door opener...it is not fully stripped out.It is a shame it is not fully stripped out like the GTS but with four seats (and two doors). Drivers cars don’t need HK (not Heckler & Koch ?? ).
Pip
Kawasicki said:
Chemical Ali said:
From experience (640d and f80 M3) the two engines are much different in their power delivery. If anyone thinks you can turn a 335d into an M3 you haven't driven the cars.
And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
The M3 is an inline 6.And if you are talking about the V8 M3s then they are even further apart. Sound alone creates a hugely different experience.
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