RE: A birthday wish for Lancia

[rastapasta]

chelme said:

rastapasta said:

Simca, Talbot, SAAB. wa wa wa. Lancia are dead . If they are to develop a new (for example) Delta Integrale, how many of us would actually buy it??? The people who reminisce about the 'glory days' of the WRC would not be the aimed demographic for such a car anymore as they are probably pushing 60 years old now. People move on and the 30-40 year old age group demographic would sooner have a Golf GTI or an M3 or a Focus on steriods!! why?? because Lancia means very little to people nowadays. Subaru have learned this with the last few itinerations of the Impreza STI. The people are not there anymore to buy these cars. It would take a massive marketing campaign and a shedload of money to put such a car on the buying publics radar. Maybe re entering rallying would work ala subaru and McCrae. But the cash isnt there. And wont be.

Marchionnes job is to please the shareholders and make FCA as profitable as possible. A new Lancia Delta wont do that for sure, the last one didnt. And an Integrale sure as hell wont. We need to get over Lancia.

They were fking rustbuckets anyway.

One could have reasonably said the same about Alfa Romeo too, however, where there is vision and determination, as much as the likes of the Giulia can be produced to seriously question the wisdom of settling with the status quo (i.e. buying an M3), which I applaud, so can something special be produced with a Lancia badge.

I am 37. I bought my first Lancia at the age of 34. Reason? I was old enough to appreciate the successes achieved by this legendary brand. Every time, I mean EVERY TIME, I take the EVO 2 out, it gets thumbs up and people come over to chat about the car, and interestingly, I find a lot of these individuals who approach me, are in their early to mid twenties.

Some do not know what it is, granted, however an overwhelming majority of this age bracket do know what the car represents. Perhaps this is to do a lot with the PS3/XBox Gaming mediums which more or less educate car enthusiasts of the glory days of the WRC. I am not sure, however I see a lot of you tube posts of the Group B and Group A era Lancias too, uploaded by (presumably) the younger generation. I may be wrong.

What I am confident about is that the brand still lives on in thew hearts of many enthusiasts, the world over and this to a degree explains why the value of these vehicles are appreciating.

Legends never die. This applies to legendary cars too, which is why I too, would want to see the FCA reintroduce the brand. If they could come up with an M3 beating Giulia within 18 months, they too, could engineer a very special Lancia (with the help of Ferrari of course).

It is shame that the WRC has lost its cachet among motorsport enthusiasts, but whilst Lancia was to WRC what the M3 was to Touring Cars, with some ingenuity, the brand can bounce back!

I say bring it on!

As I mentioned in my last, you need an outstanding product which is eminently saleable and alot of cash to do a relaunch. FCA have neither. Oddly enough I actually love Lancia, my aunt had an old Delta but it was leant out to people as a spare car from her garage and was ruined before I had the finances to buy it and restore it. Ruined by people who didnt appreciate it. So while I might come across as a pragmatic miserable old killjoy, or a marketing analyst (by another poster) I actually have a bit of love for the brand. I appreciate their rallying heritage. I am the same age as you and can 'barely' remember seeing the Delta Integrale in action in the forests in the late 80's/early 90's. I loved the paint jobs and the sheer performance of the car. As an aside: My current role lead me to Monaco ten years ago when starting out to be trained in my an Italian with alot of enthusiasm for the marque who remembered the rallying heritage alot better than I (he came from between San Remo and Genoa). He arranged for a friend of his to take me around the GP circuit in an Evo 2 early one sunday morning. An unbelievable experience. So much so that when the 'Nuovo Delta' was launched I actually test drove one for a weekend. But alas it didnt have the room for my bikes and in reality was a fiat brava (despite being very well appointed inside - it was a 'momo' special edition). So I bought a Subaru Legacy 2.5i GT, part of practicality reasons, and part for the reason that when I became aware of rallying Richard Burns was tearing through the stages in one.

[r11co]

Import a 300C and put the proper badges on it....



Certainly more legitimate than Bentley badges.

What has done it for Lancia is that it was seen in its home market as a luxury brand (which is what it was - expensive and bespoke cars for the wealthy). The Ypsilon is effectively the FIAT 500 equivalent of the Mini Mayfair.

FCA already has two sporting brands in the middle-to-upper marketplace (Alfa and Maserati) and the last thing they need is to be marketing a third one that will compete with those two.

Instead they tried to re-establish the brand as affordable luxury with the 300C thing. Cue a massive annual tax hike in Italy on cars over 265BHP and the writing was on the wall.

[M666 EVO]

rastapasta said:

They were fking rustbuckets anyway.

Well that's bks, my Delta is 22 years old and has zero rust.

[M666 EVO]

Ninja59 said:

Still have much want though for one. Even if I know parts supply would be an absolute pig.

You'd be surprised to know parts are not an absolute pig. I have a Delta and many parts are shared with Fiat, so I managed to get discs and pads (Brembo) for £100 and a full exhaust for £220 (OEM). The only drag about that was I had to wait 7 days for the exhaust to come from Italy.

Reality is that parts are only a pig if you use a garage that are clueless and use the "exclusivity" of the brand to charge you triple. I was quoted £1000 for an exhaust from an Alfa garage down in Kent!!

The internet is a wonderful thing.

[rastapasta]

M666 EVO said:

rastapasta said:

They were fking rustbuckets anyway.

Well that's bks, my Delta is 22 years old and has zero rust.

It probably does in fairness.

[kazrich2]

rastapasta said:

. And, aside from perhaps the Integrale, it was never that good anyway.

Would you kindly expand on that extraordinary statement ?

[rastapasta]

kazrich2 said:

rastapasta said:

. And, aside from perhaps the Integrale, it was never that good anyway.

Would you kindly expand on that extraordinary statement ?

Yes, for a start its subjective. I remember the 80's models, the Thema, Dedra etc, and on those Ill pass. They were too much like badge engineered Fiats (which is what they were in my opinion). Although the Ferrari engined one was an interesting gimmick.

The Integrale was an epic car, and not just on the rally stages. So much so that I gave serious thought to buying a new delta back in 2012. But didnt for practicality reasons. But again this was just another badge engineered Fiat in reality anyway.

All this said I am also do not have very much regard for other 80's 'icons' such as the 205 GTI et al. To me they are just shopping trolleys with big engines so feel free to hang me on that also.

[DeejRC]

So you have completely ignored all the marque's history prior to the 80s due to your own ignorance?

Well that's ok then.
Don't worry, you didn't miss anything important...

[rastapasta]

DeejRC said:

So you have completely ignored all the marque's history prior to the 80s due to your own ignorance?

Well that's ok then.
Don't worry, you didn't miss anything important...

I guess this is aimed at me?? I was born in th 80's so can only comment reliably on what I remember or have experienced. Im sure they made fantastic cars in the 1970's or when they were not under Fiats influence. As perhaps my desktop calender on my desk or the pricetag of the Stratos Stradale in the garage up the road would attest to. But the closest Ill ever come to one is walking by it at a show or cycling by the garage so if you have or had one from the 70's or even earlier I will bow to your wisdom on them. Meantime, heres a couple I took at the zurich motor show in addition to my desktop calender and the one for sale up the street. Guess I am a bit of a fanboy....

[viggyp]

Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:

Thurbs said:

Top Gear's Lancia tribute from S14.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1RKpdFjE4I

...and...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBKBrC9Zv44

As others have said, if Skoda can be revived, so can Lancia. I am old enough to remember Skoda in the pre-VW era, the rubbish they built and how they were the butt of all jokes, even more so than Lada. It just needs the will and money to do it.

As for concepts... one of these please.



https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/lancia/strato...

I rarely like retro, but love these. Weren't they a Ferrari F430 underpinning, and made in small numbers - for stupid £, like £500k?

I don't know where Autocar got the £600k price tag but it was closer to £1mil or £2mil due to it being commissioned as a one off by a German Millionaire (possibly Billionaire) who has a fleet of original Stratos' from road to rally spec. You are correct in saying it is based on a Ferrari F430. I even have a 1/43 scale model of this one off

Edited by viggyp on Friday 1st December 14:44

[Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah]

viggyp said:

I don't know where Autocar got the £600k price tag but it was closer to £1mil or £2mil due to it being commissioned as a one off by a German Millionaire (possibly Billionaire) who has a fleet of original Stratos' from road to rally spec. You are correct in saying it is based on a Ferrari F430. I even have a 1/43 scale model of this one off

Edited by viggyp on Friday 1st December 14:44

Ah, I didn't see the Autocar link!

[viggyp]

Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:

viggyp said:

I don't know where Autocar got the £600k price tag but it was closer to £1mil or £2mil due to it being commissioned as a one off by a German Millionaire (possibly Billionaire) who has a fleet of original Stratos' from road to rally spec. You are correct in saying it is based on a Ferrari F430. I even have a 1/43 scale model of this one off

Edited by viggyp on Friday 1st December 14:44

Ah, I didn't see the Autocar link!

Hehehe. No problem

Had to go back and read the article. I absolutely love that car and do wish that they had made a few hundred. Saying that, I do seem to recall that he may have had another one made with motorsport livery but not 100% sure.

[kazrich2]

Battista Pininfarina was, by many, considered to be the single most influential car designer of all time.
When asked, which of his creations was his favourite car, replied
" When I die, I shall drive to heaven in my Lancia Flaminia "

Enzo Ferrari

" The Lancia Flaminia Zagato Sport is one of the best handling cars ever built "

[PaulG65]

What did Fangio (Arguably the best ever GP driver) favour as his daily runabout even when he drove for other teams- Why a Lancia Aurelia B20GT of course.

So did a lot of other 50's & 60's GP drivers.

[Zam1]

rastapasta said:

Simca, Talbot, SAAB. wa wa wa. Lancia are dead . If they are to develop a new (for example) Delta Integrale, how many of us would actually buy it??? The people who reminisce about the 'glory days' of the WRC would not be the aimed demographic for such a car anymore as they are probably pushing 60 years old now. People move on and the 30-40 year old age group demographic would sooner have a Golf GTI or an M3 or a Focus on steriods!! why?? because Lancia means very little to people nowadays. Subaru have learned this with the last few itinerations of the Impreza STI. The people are not there anymore to buy these cars. It would take a massive marketing campaign and a shedload of money to put such a car on the buying publics radar. Maybe re entering rallying would work ala subaru and McCrae. But the cash isnt there. And wont be.

Marchionnes job is to please the shareholders and make FCA as profitable as possible. A new Lancia Delta wont do that for sure, the last one didnt. And an Integrale sure as hell wont. We need to get over Lancia.

They were fking rustbuckets anyway.

Ahh.... the usual ignorant sweeping statements from the uninformed. How tedious.

[Pereldh]

A RWD Fulvia?
Think again.

[Lagerlout]

Fun video for the Lancisti on here. 037 and Delta works cars.

http://girardo.com/video-details/delivering-at-chr...

[ess]

Lagerlout said:

Fun video for the Lancisti on here. 037 and Delta works cars.

http://girardo.com/video-details/delivering-at-chr...

Outstanding ! Superbly put together.
Thanks for sharing.
Merry Christmas to you sir.

S