RE: BMW M5 (F90): Driven
Discussion
Ares said:
Willy Nilly said:
Too much power is just about enough aside, how do you even scratch at the surface of a 600hp saloon car on the road? I know you can do track days in it, but why would you choose a car like this for track days? I'm glad it exists, but is it more about bragging rights?
The notion that you can't use 600bhp on the road is crap. Unless you are an idiot, in which case 200bhp is too much.When I ran my E92 M3(Granted not that quick with only 414bhp and piss all torque), it still annoyed/frustrated me because I just couldn't use it's performance on my commute.
Don't get me wrong on deserted back lanes you could stretch it's legs...if you stuck two fingers up to the national speed limit, obviously I don't know what 600bhp feels like but on my commute it would be a complete waste, I suppose it depends where you live/how much you can use it though.
beanoir said:
There are plenty of people are fans of the latest incarnations of the M5 and it's often because they aren't highly strung and flash looking.
The F10 for me is an improvement over the old V10 engine cars. The new cars are great at what they do now, fast, more fuel efficient and comfortable. The perfect daily driver companion to the weekend car. If I wanted a jack of all trades I'd probably be looking at the M4.
So my point being, the new M5 is perfect for what quite a few customers (like me) wanted.
The F10 for me is an improvement over the old V10 engine cars. The new cars are great at what they do now, fast, more fuel efficient and comfortable. The perfect daily driver companion to the weekend car. If I wanted a jack of all trades I'd probably be looking at the M4.
So my point being, the new M5 is perfect for what quite a few customers (like me) wanted.
Oh I agree, they'll have definitely gained more customers then they lost by making them a bit softer, a bit more efficient and a bit more rounded, the BMW accountants aren't stupid after all. It's only old BMW fans like me that will complain at the direction they seem to be going now.
They may well be the "perfect daily driver" now but I just expect a little bit more than that from an M car. The bit I think they now miss is the excitement some of the previous iterations used to generate when you occasionally got the chance to stop using it as the daily driver, pointed it down a nice road and had some fun and again that mostly comes back to that engine. Impeccable at anything up to 7/10 th's but just lacks that certain something to make it stand out and really thrill.
cerb4.5lee said:
Ares said:
Willy Nilly said:
Too much power is just about enough aside, how do you even scratch at the surface of a 600hp saloon car on the road? I know you can do track days in it, but why would you choose a car like this for track days? I'm glad it exists, but is it more about bragging rights?
The notion that you can't use 600bhp on the road is crap. Unless you are an idiot, in which case 200bhp is too much.When I ran my E92 M3(Granted not that quick with only 414bhp and piss all torque), it still annoyed/frustrated me because I just couldn't use it's performance on my commute.
Don't get me wrong on deserted back lanes you could stretch it's legs...if you stuck two fingers up to the national speed limit, obviously I don't know what 600bhp feels like but on my commute it would be a complete waste, I suppose it depends where you live/how much you can use it though.
(*much)
anonymous said:
[redacted]
There's the rub, it isn't marginal. Given the V10 thirst and small tank, a range between fills of 200-ish compared with getting on double that for the turbo V8s - F10M had a 10 litre larger tank than all other F10s to help address this concern, a feature I presume carried over to F90 as the next petrol down has little over half the power and a *mere* 3.0 six cyl. 8-18mpg plays 16-32, fairly significant gain in %age terms when it comes to things like total running cost as well as convenience.
Willy Nilly said:
Too much power is just about enough aside, how do you even scratch at the surface of a 600hp saloon car on the road? I know you can do track days in it, but why would you choose a car like this for track days? I'm glad it exists, but is it more about bragging rights?
My experience is that you can't really - motorway sliproads are absolutely hilarious, but the rest of the time you are seriously holding back. I guess it's the same for every car with over 300bhp, just increasing in intensity as you head up towards supercars.Ares said:
It depends what your benchmark is for the M3.
To say it is 'about as joyless and unengaging as you can imagine' is a daft thing to say. And to say you would never take it out for the thrill of driving is equally daft.
I'd agree the hyperbole is stretching it a little. An M4 certainly isn't the worse car I've driven, however seeing as it was meant to be a better replacement to the previous iteration I'm not sure it fulfilled that brief entirely. Sure in many ways it was better, mostly in the ease of use stakes but in terms of thrills and enjoyment I'd rate the previous gen E9x generation over the current one.To say it is 'about as joyless and unengaging as you can imagine' is a daft thing to say. And to say you would never take it out for the thrill of driving is equally daft.
Similarly the E60 M5 was flawed as a daily in many ways but that V10 when on song provided a thrill that the engine in the new one can never hope to match.
M cars have always been about balancing daily practicality with the thrill of driving, I just think the new ones have swung too far in the wrong direction.
Edited by Guvernator on Monday 4th December 17:30
I would like it more if:
-rear Wheel drive
-manual gearbox
-it didnt play engine noise through hifi
-it was smaller
-it was lighter
-had natrually aspirated engine
-fewer driver modes
etc
etc
If it was just an E39 M5 !!!
If I wanted something really fast with limited driver involvement that could play engine noises through the hifi I would buy a Tesla.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Blimey and I thought I could be hard to please at times 
I'm guessing you prefer light cars and you're a big fan of N/A engines then? BMW's do suffer a tad from feeling heavy and have mountains of sound deadening to detach you from the driving experience I agree, however I'd be well happy in a current M3/M4 though, but I hated the previous generation M3 sadly.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
OK, I'll repeat in full. 
To say it is 'about as joyless and unengaging as you can imagine for a 400-odd hp saloon' is a daft thing to say.
And once again, It depends what your benchmark is for the M3.
Any similar powered Audi, any AMG saloon.... in fact, I'm struggling to think of a more joy-filled and engaging 400-odd hp saloon, with the exception of the Alfa QV, than the M3?
If you don't find it in any way thrilling, you have set your own bar unrealistically high for a saloon car drive.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
You are wasting your time. The "C" Moose is always right and will just keep arguing his point until his mum calls him for his tea. He hates anything that is turbocharged, but strangely ends up in any thread discussing a car he already knows not his cup of tea. peteA said:
The M5 isn’t like this - it’s meant to be a thinking mans super saloon,
Isn't it meant to be a sports car in a saloon body? For the businessman that also liked the odd spirited drive? That was the original design brief IIRC. Anyway fake noise, too many gadgets and unattractive design ruin the package...but a very powerful engine in any car is always good.popeyewhite said:
peteA said:
The M5 isn’t like this - it’s meant to be a thinking mans super saloon,
Isn't it meant to be a sports car in a saloon body? For the businessman that also liked the odd spirited drive? That was the original design brief IIRC. Anyway fake noise, too many gadgets and unattractive design ruin the package...but a very powerful engine in any car is always good.HeMightBeBanned said:
I can't decide if it's being damned by faint praise.
I am inclined to think it is when the article says 'That 4.4-litre V8 is a curious thing'. Compare it to what they say about the Merc V8...I'd much rather they said something like 'that engine is a peach', or 'what an awesome soundtrack from that amazing V8' or something.
But to describe an M5 engine as 'curious', really?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Because it is a positive of the car...it’s a ‘nice to have’, a bonus, call it what you will. I never said I didn’t care about it either.
I like my M5 and the fact it goes bonkers fast, does 21mpg average and gets my family in it and room for more crap. It puts a smile on my face every time I plant the loud pedal still, it drives like an angel when you want and complete hooligan when you shouldn’t. It got me to Norway in amazing comfort, got me around Norway with a lot of smiles and home again.
It’s filling a large hole right now where the Cayman was (temporary) and at first I was gutted that I was left with ‘just the M5’ - but you know what, it’s doing bloody well to keep me satisfied.
I tell you what I don’t like, it rattles too much for such an expensive car, it’s too heavy on downhill mountain roads...and that’s about it!
E65Ross said:
popeyewhite said:
peteA said:
The M5 isn’t like this - it’s meant to be a thinking mans super saloon,
Isn't it meant to be a sports car in a saloon body? For the businessman that also liked the odd spirited drive? That was the original design brief IIRC. Anyway fake noise, too many gadgets and unattractive design ruin the package...but a very powerful engine in any car is always good.popeyewhite said:
peteA said:
The M5 isn’t like this - it’s meant to be a thinking mans super saloon,
Isn't it meant to be a sports car in a saloon body? For the businessman that also liked the odd spirited drive? That was the original design brief IIRC. Anyway fake noise, too many gadgets and unattractive design ruin the package...but a very powerful engine in any car is always good.On the others whinges
Fake Noise. Contentious issue. In practice, you can't tell. The alternative is either always noisy and being undesirably anti-social, or being too quiet.
Too many gadgets? Such as...? What could/should they remove from std equipment?
Unattractive design? I think it's just right.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff