RE: HPI's top 10 future classics
Discussion
Notanotherturbo said:
Have to disagree I'm afraid - RX7 would be the only car worse on petrol but you can forgive it that for its looks and performance. A couple of friends I know have had them and they are ruinous on petrol, and they were coming from other high performance cars. They are also extremely gutless, no torque whatsoever. I've had a few on road duals with them over the years and they never seemed quick at all. Even took one comfortably in my girlfriend of the times Hyundai V6 Coupe and that wasn't exactly rapid. Not disputing they drive and handle well but for me that is their ownly plus point. RX7 is one of my favourite cars and when the RX8 replaced it was I was staggered how they could replace it with something so inferior.
I suspect you went against a 192. I have an R3 and with 5.9s 0-60 (for a car that is hard to launch) that is very good going. Please do tell me the real mpg those cars in the list get when driven hard. I bet most are around 10mpg, the v8 probably less. The RX8 also beat the RX7 around a track. Sure it won’t beat the top end Japanese imported version of the FD in a straight line but it is quicker than the rest of the 7 range. Torque at the wheels is what counts and that is very high.Edited by delta0 on Saturday 23 December 12:43
If electric cars become mainstream in the next 15 years, and a cheap petrol substitute that can be made at home on cheap equipment does not come along I expect the market for anything classic will vanish on all but the most expensive exotics.
We're on the verge of a big change in the automotive landscape and if it goes electric (as is looking increasingly likely) the market could change for good. Most people buy classics to use (even if sparingly) if you can't use them, or continuing to use them becomes a major hassle or very expensive, I can't really see the appeal in owning a car that just sits in a garage. If the market survives it will I expect became a preserve of the very rich who can afford expensive fuel deliveries.
We're on the verge of a big change in the automotive landscape and if it goes electric (as is looking increasingly likely) the market could change for good. Most people buy classics to use (even if sparingly) if you can't use them, or continuing to use them becomes a major hassle or very expensive, I can't really see the appeal in owning a car that just sits in a garage. If the market survives it will I expect became a preserve of the very rich who can afford expensive fuel deliveries.
I suspect that in some of the 'on road duels' with RX8s mentioned earlier the Mazda drivers' were probably unaware there was a 'race' on.... I hate to be the fanboy, but a healthy RX8 231 screwed all the way to 9000rpm is a rapid car, but it needs to be driven as such or it does indeed feel gutless. Engine, ignition, plugs, leads, cat all need to be in top nick or it won't go. The chassis is excellent; I do a few sprints/hillclimbs using my VX220 as a competition car, but after tracking the RX8 will enter some events in it next year as I reckon it'll be competitive out of the box in-class. I agree with posts above though, I don't think it'll become a future classic. It'll forever be that quirky coupe with an engine that does 17mpg before blowing-up that isn't an RX7 FD.
I, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
I, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
speedtwelve said:
I suspect that in some of the 'on road duels' with RX8s mentioned earlier the Mazda drivers' were probably unaware there was a 'race' on.... I hate to be the fanboy, but a healthy RX8 231 screwed all the way to 9000rpm is a rapid car, but it needs to be driven as such or it does indeed feel gutless. Engine, ignition, plugs, leads, cat all need to be in top nick or it won't go. The chassis is excellent; I do a few sprints/hillclimbs using my VX220 as a competition car, but after tracking the RX8 will enter some events in it next year as I reckon it'll be competitive out of the box in-class. I agree with posts above though, I don't think it'll become a future classic. It'll forever be that quirky coupe with an engine that does 17mpg before blowing-up that isn't an RX7 FD.
I, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
You have something different, I always respect the guy who buys something different. Plus, the VX220 looks better than an S1 Elise, IMO anywayI, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
J4CKO said:
I paid just over two and have put £900 or so into it getting it reliable, upgrading to a Bluetooth stereo and ix niggles, previous owner spent like two grand and I can see more needing spending but a couple of dampers here and a remap there, I could be paying £300 a month to lease something.
I think there are just too many TT's still about though they are getting broken, will be a case of people thinking there will always be that two grand example but they will dry upI did consider the V6 but too risky and a £300 remap, like you say makes the 225 faster anyway, if without the soundtrack but I also quite like the Hoover thats sicked up Lego and isnt happy about it noises the Turbo makes, plus it doesnt have all that weight over the front wheels.
People talk about understeer on these, was throwing it about last night and didnt experience any, how fast do they go on the road ?
I always felt that at sensible speed it was great to chuck about, gripped well and I never experienced any understeer. At speeds of 90+ I always thought it felt a bit flaky and not particularly planted, I do find the suspension is pretty hard on these and pretty crashy. Could have just been my car though tbfI think there are just too many TT's still about though they are getting broken, will be a case of people thinking there will always be that two grand example but they will dry upI did consider the V6 but too risky and a £300 remap, like you say makes the 225 faster anyway, if without the soundtrack but I also quite like the Hoover thats sicked up Lego and isnt happy about it noises the Turbo makes, plus it doesnt have all that weight over the front wheels.
People talk about understeer on these, was throwing it about last night and didnt experience any, how fast do they go on the road ?
delta0 said:
Notanotherturbo said:
Have to disagree I'm afraid - RX7 would be the only car worse on petrol but you can forgive it that for its looks and performance. A couple of friends I know have had them and they are ruinous on petrol, and they were coming from other high performance cars. They are also extremely gutless, no torque whatsoever. I've had a few on road duals with them over the years and they never seemed quick at all. Even took one comfortably in my girlfriend of the times Hyundai V6 Coupe and that wasn't exactly rapid. Not disputing they drive and handle well but for me that is their ownly plus point. RX7 is one of my favourite cars and when the RX8 replaced it was I was staggered how they could replace it with something so inferior.
I suspect you went against a 192. I have an R3 and with 5.9s 0-60 (for a car that is hard to launch) that is very good going. Please do tell me the real mpg those cars in the list get when driven hard. I bet most are around 10mpg, the v8 probably less. The RX8 also beat the RX7 around a track. Sure it won’t beat the top end Japanese imported version of the FD in a straight line but it is quicker than the rest of the 7 range. Torque at the wheels is what counts and that is very high.Edited by delta0 on Saturday 23 December 12:43
speedtwelve said:
I suspect that in some of the 'on road duels' with RX8s mentioned earlier the Mazda drivers' were probably unaware there was a 'race' on.... I hate to be the fanboy, but a healthy RX8 231 screwed all the way to 9000rpm is a rapid car, but it needs to be driven as such or it does indeed feel gutless. Engine, ignition, plugs, leads, cat all need to be in top nick or it won't go. The chassis is excellent; I do a few sprints/hillclimbs using my VX220 as a competition car, but after tracking the RX8 will enter some events in it next year as I reckon it'll be competitive out of the box in-class. I agree with posts above though, I don't think it'll become a future classic. It'll forever be that quirky coupe with an engine that does 17mpg before blowing-up that isn't an RX7 FD.
I, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
Well it certainly sounded like he was thrashing the ass out of it, I felt embarrassed for him , I couldn't even here the engine in the car I was driving over it. :0).I, too, reckon the S2000 should be on the list. A fun car I wish I'd held on to a tad longer, but the lure of TVR was too great. Strato redline N/A two-seat screamer with a fantastic gearshift & LSD. Prices already on the up.
When I bought my VX220 I also considered Elise S1 & S2. There wasn't a lot between them price-wise a year or two ago, but Elises have shot up in that time. People do comment on how rare the VX seems to be; I reckon the badge may have an effect on price/desirability despite the car being built at Hethel.
oceanview said:
RX8 and TT too common- would be many, many years before they move upwards.
Z4 coupes (especially M) have had strong prices for years and will move upwards, especially as not many around.
The attrition rate for RX8s is huge though so numbers might be close in a few years.Z4 coupes (especially M) have had strong prices for years and will move upwards, especially as not many around.
oceanview said:
RX8 and TT too common- would be many, many years before they move upwards.
Z4 coupes (especially M) have had strong prices for years and will move upwards, especially as not many around.
I agree with respect to the TT. Why are MGBs still so relatively cheap? There are loads of them. Z4 coupes (especially M) have had strong prices for years and will move upwards, especially as not many around.
My wife wanted a fun car this year and having owned a z3 and z4 in the past, all she wanted was the z3. She wouldn't look at a boxter or s2000. I found a 3.0L one and it's a great little car. Going to enjoy it, but won't be expecting it to go up hugely in value.
Notanotherturbo said:
Well it certainly sounded like he was thrashing the ass out of it, I felt embarrassed for him , I couldn't even here the engine in the car I was driving over it. :0).
O/T that's an epic current fleet you have in your profile. Nice. Incidentally the RX8 replaced my 6.0 Monaro VXR 
swisstoni said:
I wouldn’t want to be depending on any of those listed to make me any money.
I think the same thing except perhaps the rover mini though they are changing hands for silly money now anyway. I know of one late car which sold at our work with sub 30k miles for £10k+. I also know the whereabouts of one of the last 10 cars built. He bought it for his wife, she did 200 miles in it and decided she didn't like it. It has been park up in a garage and hasn't moved since. I dread to think what that car is worth.Notanotherturbo said:
Yes but you always have to work an RX8 hard because of its lack of torque, the Monaro will tickle along at 70 at 2000 rpm returning high 20s in the process. And all the other cars bar the Rx7 would be similar. And 156 ft/lbs at 5500 rpm is extremely torque light whichever way you cut it 112 ft/lbs per ton, hardly the stuff of dreams :0). Oh and a few hundred quid spent on a 7 and it will be much much quicker than an 8.
I push 30mpg (just!) when cruising at a steady 70mph. That’s not the point of these cars. The fun is winding the engines up and feeling like you are in a race car. The mpg doesn’t drop off much when ragging them unlike the ones in your list especially the V8 which will be single figures if it was anything like my experience with V8s.Torque to the wheels is what counts. With such a large rpm range to play with and the gear ratios are much shorter which gives it a lot of acceleration. At 5500rpm you have another 4000rpm to go and really increases the power.
It’s one of those cars that suits people that like racing car style of power delivery and excellent handling. If you like lazier power delivery then that is a completely different experience. This engine is designed to be driven like this which is why it revs so high, plus they put a low ratio gearbox on and coupled it with an incredibly stiff chassis in this car.
Edited by delta0 on Sunday 24th December 00:00
What about the Impreza 2000 Turbo? Well actually an GC8 Turbo. Already rising, this would've been £2k this time last year.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
peter450 said:
If electric cars become mainstream in the next 15 years, and a cheap petrol substitute that can be made at home on cheap equipment does not come along I expect the market for anything classic will vanish on all but the most expensive exotics.
We're on the verge of a big change in the automotive landscape and if it goes electric (as is looking increasingly likely) the market could change for good. Most people buy classics to use (even if sparingly) if you can't use them, or continuing to use them becomes a major hassle or very expensive, I can't really see the appeal in owning a car that just sits in a garage. If the market survives it will I expect became a preserve of the very rich who can afford expensive fuel deliveries.
I wonder if this is the most prescient post on this thread? I know people say horses are still around even after the introduction of the motor car but horse feed is/will always be available. I don't think the same can be said for petrol, unfortunately; are we all deluding ourselves on here?We're on the verge of a big change in the automotive landscape and if it goes electric (as is looking increasingly likely) the market could change for good. Most people buy classics to use (even if sparingly) if you can't use them, or continuing to use them becomes a major hassle or very expensive, I can't really see the appeal in owning a car that just sits in a garage. If the market survives it will I expect became a preserve of the very rich who can afford expensive fuel deliveries.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff