RE: Renault Clio 182 Trophy: PH Hero
Discussion
It’s tragic in some ways that many cars that offer genuine driving reward end up in an investors garage. Surely better that they end up in the hands drivers of more merge financial means but whose intent is to truly enjoy their performance.
So, to those looking only for financial gain or miserly hoard.
‘The Renault Clio Trophy is a truly awful car - so whynot spend your money elsewhere and allow those less fortunate than you to bask in their awfulness.’.
So, to those looking only for financial gain or miserly hoard.
‘The Renault Clio Trophy is a truly awful car - so whynot spend your money elsewhere and allow those less fortunate than you to bask in their awfulness.’.
cib24 said:
Cool car, but what was a better car to own and drive?
Clio 172 and 182 vs. EK9 Civic Type R or Integra Type R DC2
Clio 197/200 vs. Integra Type R DC5 or Civic Type R FD2
I wish there was an online review comparing these cars as they seem like the most obvious comparables.
I had a Trophy for a while and have had an Integra DC2 for 5 years. A Trophy is a 8/10 car, the Integra a 9/10.Clio 172 and 182 vs. EK9 Civic Type R or Integra Type R DC2
Clio 197/200 vs. Integra Type R DC5 or Civic Type R FD2
I wish there was an online review comparing these cars as they seem like the most obvious comparables.
I believe the real "special" 1*2 is the 172 Cup, which actually lapped evo's benchmark circuit quicker than the Trophy.
The Trophy is great fun and makes the most of its assets - a ballsy, naturally aspirated engine matched to a tiny body (the old big engine small car thing) and drives as though there's a nail driven down its middle - great fun. Good steering, brakes and fun handling. The seating position isn't great (nor is the dinner plate angled steering wheel) and the gearchange isn't particularly memorable.
I can't help but feel, amongst owners in particular, the numbered plaque on the seat is a key reason for the Trophy's "specialness" - which is to be expected I guess.
The Integra's a more special car - perfect seating position, much better seats, proper steering wheel position, gearchange and that engine. The LSD adds a dimension too.
You sit much lower and I think it is a better driver's car - the highs are higher in the Integra because you're a cog in the machine.
Then there's the engineering details - the additional body stiffening, spot welds, the forged wheels (weighing 5.5KG each), fat tyres, double wishbone suspension etc.
I find the overhangs a real drawback and it's not much fun in traffic, built up areas.
The Integra was a fair bit more expensive though.
is1 said:
cib24 said:
Cool car, but what was a better car to own and drive?
Clio 172 and 182 vs. EK9 Civic Type R or Integra Type R DC2
Clio 197/200 vs. Integra Type R DC5 or Civic Type R FD2
I wish there was an online review comparing these cars as they seem like the most obvious comparables.
I had a Trophy for a while and have had an Integra DC2 for 5 years. A Trophy is a 8/10 car, the Integra a 9/10.Clio 172 and 182 vs. EK9 Civic Type R or Integra Type R DC2
Clio 197/200 vs. Integra Type R DC5 or Civic Type R FD2
I wish there was an online review comparing these cars as they seem like the most obvious comparables.
I believe the real "special" 1*2 is the 172 Cup, which actually lapped evo's benchmark circuit quicker than the Trophy.
The Trophy is great fun and makes the most of its assets - a ballsy, naturally aspirated engine matched to a tiny body (the old big engine small car thing) and drives as though there's a nail driven down its middle - great fun. Good steering, brakes and fun handling. The seating position isn't great (nor is the dinner plate angled steering wheel) and the gearchange isn't particularly memorable.
I can't help but feel, amongst owners in particular, the numbered plaque on the seat is a key reason for the Trophy's "specialness" - which is to be expected I guess.
The Integra's a more special car - perfect seating position, much better seats, proper steering wheel position, gearchange and that engine. The LSD adds a dimension too.
You sit much lower and I think it is a better driver's car - the highs are higher in the Integra because you're a cog in the machine.
Then there's the engineering details - the additional body stiffening, spot welds, the forged wheels (weighing 5.5KG each), fat tyres, double wishbone suspension etc.
I find the overhangs a real drawback and it's not much fun in traffic, built up areas.
The Integra was a fair bit more expensive though.
The DC2 really is a special car, and I suspect the Trophy would not feel as good after the LSD.
To address the CLB24's points, of the cars I've owned/driven, The DC2 is top of that tree for me. The FD2 is a quicker car, and better in many ways, but the DC2 is just so right (and organic, which sounds w
k). The DC5 is softer than both, but in itself better than a 197, which I thought was an awful car. manracer said:
Did the trophy come with Michelin Pilot Sport 3 tyres? I thought it was Pilot exalto's?
The 182 Trophy came with Michelin Pilot Exalto 2 tyres which, due to a relatively stiff sidewall and square shoulder, suited the car perfectly.They were discontinued in the Trophy's 205 45 16 size and so the Pilot Sport 3 was the next best option from Michelin.
However, the PS3 was a more rain-biased tyre and lost a bit of feel (perhaps coinciding with when I began to fall out of love with the Trophy).
Some suggested trying it in a W rating to get back some stiffness but I didn't do that.
I suspect a Trophy would work very well on a light 15 inch wheel with something like 195 55 15 Yokohama AD08Rs.
is1 said:
The 182 Trophy came with Michelin Pilot Exalto 2 tyres which, due to a relatively stiff sidewall and square shoulder, suited the car perfectly.
They were discontinued in the Trophy's 205 45 16 size and so the Pilot Sport 3 was the next best option from Michelin.
However, the PS3 was a more rain-biased tyre and lost a bit of feel (perhaps coinciding with when I began to fall out of love with the Trophy).
Some suggested trying it in a W rating to get back some stiffness but I didn't do that.
I suspect a Trophy would work very well on a light 15 inch wheel with something like 195 55 15 Yokohama AD08Rs.
My 172 Cup works very well on 15" R888's :drive:They were discontinued in the Trophy's 205 45 16 size and so the Pilot Sport 3 was the next best option from Michelin.
However, the PS3 was a more rain-biased tyre and lost a bit of feel (perhaps coinciding with when I began to fall out of love with the Trophy).
Some suggested trying it in a W rating to get back some stiffness but I didn't do that.
I suspect a Trophy would work very well on a light 15 inch wheel with something like 195 55 15 Yokohama AD08Rs.
Daily tyres are now PS3's, not massively impressed with them coming from (much cheaper) Toyo T1R's.
Alpinestars said:
Interesting, thanks.
The DC2 really is a special car, and I suspect the Trophy would not feel as good after the LSD.
To address the CLB24's points, of the cars I've owned/driven, The DC2 is top of that tree for me. The FD2 is a quicker car, and better in many ways, but the DC2 is just so right (and organic, which sounds wk). The DC5 is softer than both, but in itself better than a 197, which I thought was an awful car.
Didn't you say the M20 was the best fwd car you have driven? But the DC2 is top of the tree?The DC2 really is a special car, and I suspect the Trophy would not feel as good after the LSD.
To address the CLB24's points, of the cars I've owned/driven, The DC2 is top of that tree for me. The FD2 is a quicker car, and better in many ways, but the DC2 is just so right (and organic, which sounds w
k). The DC5 is softer than both, but in itself better than a 197, which I thought was an awful car. Chris Harris didn't really like the Mugen FN2.
https://youtu.be/KMcWxBCq0ss
LordHaveMurci said:
My 172 Cup works very well on 15" R888's :drive:
Daily tyres are now PS3's, not massively impressed with them coming from (much cheaper) Toyo T1R's.
I think a drop to 15s should be near the top of the list for any 1*2 given the weight of OEM 1*2 wheels - don't they weight just over 10KGs each?Daily tyres are now PS3's, not massively impressed with them coming from (much cheaper) Toyo T1R's.
Even the Speedline Turinis on the Trophy weigh a shade under 9KG.
A 15 inch OZ/TD wheel can weight as little as 5.5 KG - that's a massive amount of weight to take off the hubs.
MRobbins1987 said:
Alpinestars said:
Interesting, thanks.
The DC2 really is a special car, and I suspect the Trophy would not feel as good after the LSD.
To address the CLB24's points, of the cars I've owned/driven, The DC2 is top of that tree for me. The FD2 is a quicker car, and better in many ways, but the DC2 is just so right (and organic, which sounds wk). The DC5 is softer than both, but in itself better than a 197, which I thought was an awful car.
Didn't you say the M20 was the best fwd car you have driven? But the DC2 is top of the tree?The DC2 really is a special car, and I suspect the Trophy would not feel as good after the LSD.
To address the CLB24's points, of the cars I've owned/driven, The DC2 is top of that tree for me. The FD2 is a quicker car, and better in many ways, but the DC2 is just so right (and organic, which sounds w
k). The DC5 is softer than both, but in itself better than a 197, which I thought was an awful car. Chris Harris didn't really like the Mugen FN2.
https://youtu.be/KMcWxBCq0ss
Harris' view is irrelevant. It might inform those that have not driven the car, but it's a subjective matter - ie, I can make my own mind up.
As a contrary view, Sutcliffe loved it.
https://youtu.be/WpA0EHSdjm0
An interesting article, and some interesting comments, particularly from the DC2 owner who'd had a Trophy too. Anyone else who's had both care to comment?
Despite test driving a DC2 years ago and not being blown away I still look out for one, but having seen an exceptional 38k miler a couple of years ago that had had one owner for 16 years and still had clear signs of arch rust I gave in, seems a Trophy might be the next best thing.
Despite test driving a DC2 years ago and not being blown away I still look out for one, but having seen an exceptional 38k miler a couple of years ago that had had one owner for 16 years and still had clear signs of arch rust I gave in, seems a Trophy might be the next best thing.
Got mine out of the garage this morning and took it to the office.
There has been a lot of conversation and discussion on this thread about values and investments. Whilst I don't ever plan on selling it again (I owned this car for 10 months back in 2008 and found it for sale last September) it wont lose me money, but I bought it and had it fully refurbished for nostalgia rather than an investment.
It will be used, but probably only a few hundred miles a year. It makes it even more enjoyable and mind bending when only driving it rarely.
In my opinion it is the greatest hot hatch of all time and sadly cars wont ever be the engaging ever again.
There has been a lot of conversation and discussion on this thread about values and investments. Whilst I don't ever plan on selling it again (I owned this car for 10 months back in 2008 and found it for sale last September) it wont lose me money, but I bought it and had it fully refurbished for nostalgia rather than an investment.
It will be used, but probably only a few hundred miles a year. It makes it even more enjoyable and mind bending when only driving it rarely.
In my opinion it is the greatest hot hatch of all time and sadly cars wont ever be the engaging ever again.
MrGman said:
I had one too, driving it down through the swiss alps has been my best ever motoring experience. loved that car a really wish i still had it.
Reading this has bought some simply amazing memories flooding back of the drive of my life down the Route Napoleon, via Gap, Sisteron and Castelaine and on to St Tropez in my pearl white 86 R5 GT Turbo, two up, loaded with camping gear and two cycles lashed to a Halfords carrier in July 93 C400 GME Where Are You Now ??
Edited by neutral 3 on Friday 4th October 14:43
After looking on and off for about 2 years, i recently bought a late 182 with 100k on it, needing some tlc for £ very little. It has the lovely Anthracite alloys, larger rear spoiler and the front lip spoiler, which i believe is the FF or both Cup packs car ?
Worst issue with it is that sometimes whilst stationery it wont select a gear apart from top, it then selects gears fine.
It had been stripped out and partly prepared as a track day car, then work stalled.
It has Eibach red springs ( very firm )
Still on its OE dampers ( the rears not suprisingly are tired )
A full stainless exhaust system inc headers, the silencer is a Scorpion,
A K tec air filter, plus wheel spacers and a K-tec engine mount.
Its running Kumhos on the front and odd brand ditchfinders on the rear. But i was thinking of swapping to the latest Uniroyal Rain Sports or Conti Sports.
Ive had probably 25 x R5 GT Turbos over the years and lived / breathed them, for far too long, plus a lovely white H reg 1.9 205 GTi ( over rated in my humble opinion compared to the 5 Turbo ) plus several R5 Gordini Turbos, a blue Renault 19 16Valve ( really miss this M reg car, M401 TKP ) but patchy build quality, an 82 Golf GTi 1.8, plus 3 x 911s, a quick Corvette Stingray, a lovely manual E46 M3 with a CSL steering rack and my “ Tweaked “ Griff 500, plus many R1s and other Super Bikes.
Initial impressions of this modified 182 are its appalling seat position, its awful, far too high, although its 100,000 mile OE seat is pretty suportive still ( the 5 GT Turbo and R19 16 Valves seats were terrible )
Very little low down torque, it needs to be revved hard to get it go.
Performance TBH is a tad disapointing, although i suspect it needs setting up due to the full de cat exhaust system ( any info much appreciated )
Throw it @ a corner or roundabout and the thing is simply awesome, its definatly “ A Drivers Car” .
Fuel economy is not its strong point either.
The exhaust drones badly, so ive made a start on re fitting the carpet and rear and front passengers seats back in, to quieten it down a little.
Headlamps have the usual Clio fade, so il replace them.
Worst issue with it is that sometimes whilst stationery it wont select a gear apart from top, it then selects gears fine.
It had been stripped out and partly prepared as a track day car, then work stalled.
It has Eibach red springs ( very firm )
Still on its OE dampers ( the rears not suprisingly are tired )
A full stainless exhaust system inc headers, the silencer is a Scorpion,
A K tec air filter, plus wheel spacers and a K-tec engine mount.
Its running Kumhos on the front and odd brand ditchfinders on the rear. But i was thinking of swapping to the latest Uniroyal Rain Sports or Conti Sports.
Ive had probably 25 x R5 GT Turbos over the years and lived / breathed them, for far too long, plus a lovely white H reg 1.9 205 GTi ( over rated in my humble opinion compared to the 5 Turbo ) plus several R5 Gordini Turbos, a blue Renault 19 16Valve ( really miss this M reg car, M401 TKP ) but patchy build quality, an 82 Golf GTi 1.8, plus 3 x 911s, a quick Corvette Stingray, a lovely manual E46 M3 with a CSL steering rack and my “ Tweaked “ Griff 500, plus many R1s and other Super Bikes.
Initial impressions of this modified 182 are its appalling seat position, its awful, far too high, although its 100,000 mile OE seat is pretty suportive still ( the 5 GT Turbo and R19 16 Valves seats were terrible )
Very little low down torque, it needs to be revved hard to get it go.
Performance TBH is a tad disapointing, although i suspect it needs setting up due to the full de cat exhaust system ( any info much appreciated )
Throw it @ a corner or roundabout and the thing is simply awesome, its definatly “ A Drivers Car” .
Fuel economy is not its strong point either.
The exhaust drones badly, so ive made a start on re fitting the carpet and rear and front passengers seats back in, to quieten it down a little.
Headlamps have the usual Clio fade, so il replace them.
Edited by neutral 3 on Friday 4th October 15:19
neutral 3 said:
Performance TBH is a tad disapointing, although i suspect it needs setting up due to the full de cat exhaust system ( any info much appreciated )
Mine felt awful with a decat, as did all the others I've driven with them, I put a sports cat in mine and the power curve was visibly better on a dyno, not sure why but they do not like a decat at all.If that doesn't fix it entirely, get hold of a set of port matched inlets for it and it'll improve it no end.
neutral 3 said:
Fuel economy is not its strong point either.
This is a little bit odd, they're normally very good on fuel if driven sensibly, that could be part of the problem too, injectors can be an issue and they could be causing it to use more fuel than normal.Robmarriott said:
This is a little bit odd, they're normally very good on fuel if driven sensibly, that could be part of the problem too, injectors can be an issue and they could be causing it to use more fuel than normal.
Thanks, was wondering re a Sports De Cat. Seller told me that he replaced one injector, so perhaps the other 3 are past their sell by date.
Performace wise, perhaps i am expecting too much, but i cant wait to give some, on my fave, remote, shake down route.
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