RE: Jaguar's 400hp electric SUV unveiled

[Camelot1971]

MrGTI6 said:

I must be the only one who thinks it looks really ugly!

You aren't - I think it's hideous.

[Camelot1971]

Condi said:

Thats a bit naive IMO.

Yes it has negatives - limited range, for example.

But you've got to weight that up against the positives which exist over an ICE car;

0 tax
0 congestion charge
Much lower company car tax if you're getting it through work
In future diesels will get banned from many city centers, electrics wont
Much cheaper to run (fuel costs)
Much lower servicing cost
etc etc

Most of those benefits are short lived - as soon as the tax take on ICE cars starts to drop the Government will almost certainly increase taxes on EV cars to compensate.

[Burwood]

I fully expected to see a ‘ludicrous’ price point ala JLR. It looks like a decent package

[Jellinek]

Bibbs said:

Can anyone Gaydon tell me where Jaguar are based? Gaydon.
I don't think the article mentioned it. Gaydon.

(I've noticed Gaydon this a lot lately in PH articles. It's st, stop it Gaydon)

Ingolstadt

Ironically Jag has historically been based at Whitley (since the 80’s) and Gaydon was home to Land Rover.
True, nowadays Engineering and Management personnel are split over both sites but for example being a Jag designer, Ian Callum’s base is still Whitley as far as I am aware.

[Bibbs]

Jellinek said:

Bibbs said:

Can anyone Gaydon tell me where Jaguar are based? Gaydon.
I don't think the article mentioned it. Gaydon.

(I've noticed Gaydon this a lot lately in PH articles. It's st, stop it Gaydon)

Ingolstadt

Ironically Jag has historically been based at Whitley (since the 80’s) and Gaydon was home to Land Rover.
True, nowadays Engineering and Management personnel are split over both sites but for example being a Jag designer, Ian Callum’s base is still Whitley as far as I am aware.

It's in every article I've read lately. Well, the ones where they (think they) know where they are based.

Porsche = Stuttgart, Alfa = tubleweeds.

[Limpet]

We could make a 250 mile range EV work in our household without any inconvenience at all, alongside an IC powered car. I cannot remember a single occasion where both of our cars needed to do that kind of mileage on the same day.

It is going to be interesting to see what happens as the "proper" car manufacturers turn their attention to EVs. With their volume production expertise, infrastructure and supplier relationships, plus their experience in car design, it stands to reason that they will be able to make, distribute and market better cars for less money than Tesla. And as Tesla has open sourced all their IP, I can't see where their future lies. If the objective was to pioneer EV technology and get the world thinking differently, they've done very well, but I can't see them competing with the big car manufacturers in the medium to long term.

[kambites]

Limpet said:

And as Tesla has open sourced all their IP, I can't see where their future lies.

Probably selling batteries to the established US car makers.

I personally don't see them surviving as a stand-alone car manufacturer, I think they'll either get bought out for their model lineup by the slowest US car maker to jump on the EV bandwagon, or shut down their car operations and exist purely as a battery supplier.

[TooLateForAName]

rxe said:

Excellent, the first electric car that actually looks like a car, rather than some overblown design statement to tell everyone that it is an electric car. Pricing is more realistic than Tesla as well.

Zoe? Fluence? etc

[culpz]

Camelot1971 said:

Most of those benefits are short lived - as soon as the tax take on ICE cars starts to drop the Government will almost certainly increase taxes on EV cars to compensate.

Yupp. When EV's become the norm, the Government will find a a way to justify being able to tax them to the high Heavens. It's certainly looking like the electric era really isn't far off now though.

I will say that i do like the look of the F/E Pace and this new all-electric model is no different. In my eyes, it's one of the best looking SUV's out there. Most of them tend to do absolutely nothing for me.

[rsbmw]

Most interesting thing I've read in this article is that 350kw charging stations are a thing. That's a game changer.

[rxe]

kambites said:

You don't think the Model-S looks like a car? If anything that's one of it's weaknesses - it looks utterly bland and generic.

Sort of, but it’s aimed at the American market, and is far too big. The interior is also fecking hideous, it’s as though someone who has watched too much Space 1999 as a kid was given the chance to design “the car of the future”. This Jag looks like a car (you could pass it on the street and not notice), and the interior looks like a car (until you set off, you won’t realise what it is). I like that.

[Burwood]

rsbmw said:

Most interesting thing I've read in this article is that 350kw charging stations are a thing. That's a game changer.

Call me a cynic but the build rate will be woefully inadequate.

[RobDickinson]

I doubt there will be any cars that can use 350kw for a while mission-e perhaps?

[Limpet]

If we accept that no government is going to impose additional blanket taxes on domestic electricity bills, there are only two practical ways to tax EVs that come to mind. One is using a sealed smart meter that's attached to your domestic charger, and taxes the energy going into your car at a fixed rate per watt-hour. The other is national road pricing, where every car has a transponder, and you get a monthly or quarterly bill based on usage.

It's a very important point though. Fuel duty and VAT on fuel are worth about £30bn a year to the Treasury, and will need to be replaced. The only thing you can be sure of is that, over time, the government will increase the overall tax take from EV owners by £30bn a year relative to today. It will have to.

Edited by Limpet on Friday 2nd March 08:45

[PhantomPH]

Bibbs said:

Can anyone Gaydon tell me where Jaguar are based? Gaydon.
I don't think the article mentioned it. Gaydon.

(I've noticed Gaydon this a lot lately in PH articles. It's st, stop it Gaydon)

Ingolstadt

Drives me up the wall as well. "Gaydon says that...", does it? A village made that statement? No it fking didn't - Jaguar did.

I promised myself I was just not going to bother reading any more of the ste that gets churned out by some of the Hacks on here (see what I did there?) but damnit if I couldn't help myself but skim read looking for the actual salient points about the car...because...you know that's what I'm interested in. Not how great a writer the author is. Or very much isn't.

[culpz]

My money's on the latter. I reckon it'll all be based on road usage. Seems to make more sense them still acknowledging the fact that it's a car that just happens to be powered by electric as apposed to more of just an appliance.

[RobDickinson]

We have road usage charge here.

Duty on petrol, nothing on diesel so they pay ruc, per 1000 kilometers.

Ev are exempt for now.

[Dan_1981]

Looking forward to getting to have a poke around one of these next week.

[oldtimer2]

DonkeyApple said:

One of the most interesting aspects is that although it is a little smaller than the 100D Model X and so a bit lighter it is getting pretty much the same range and performance using 90kw of batteries. I don’t know who Jaguar’s battery tech partner is but this does show that the tech is at least equal and that’s from starting later and investing less.

And it’s difficult to reconcile the price disparity between the two cars with the X being almost twice as expensive. That is an immense contrast and it’s hard to see why the X is so expensive unless Jaguar have got their basic costs very wrong?

I believe that Panasonic are Jaguars partner.

Ian Callum said at the launch that the platform would be the basis for other models. Unsaid was the implication that this would include an XJ replacement and a Rover luxury car (which I believe he has said he is working on). Such an approach would fit JLR's premium price positioning and meet the needs of wealthy city dwellers/workers as and when cities ban petrol/diesel engines cars.

[Limpet]

rxe said:

Sort of, but it’s aimed at the American market, and is far too big. The interior is also fecking hideous, it’s as though someone who has watched too much Space 1999 as a kid was given the chance to design “the car of the future”.

I quite like the Model S interior.