RE: JLR Classic Defender V8: Driven
Discussion
Pintofbest said:
I read it more that the supplier cannot deliver to quality hence the issue is solely theirs until they make a part that is acceptable, the parts that do make the grade get accepted therefore there should be no issue to the customers.
Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Exactly this.Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Nothing that will effect the final customer, either way. The tooling is ancient, and belongs to JLR. The onus is definitely shifted onto the supplier.
I offer an alternative theory about these many V8 limited editions from SVO - whether reworking old Land Rover's or offering new versions of the Range Rover like the coupe. JLR has to find some way of selling the numbers it has committed to buy from Ford before it's contract ends. Jaguar XJ and F-type sales are weak; something new is needed to take up the slack. Hey presto! Limited editions to the rescue.
cmvtec said:
Pintofbest said:
I read it more that the supplier cannot deliver to quality hence the issue is solely theirs until they make a part that is acceptable, the parts that do make the grade get accepted therefore there should be no issue to the customers.
Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Exactly this.Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Nothing that will effect the final customer, either way. The tooling is ancient, and belongs to JLR. The onus is definitely shifted onto the supplier.
But interestingly, I was told by a Land Rover Indie that many electrical parts are now sourced via Indian suppliers instead of Taiwan and there's been a marked increase in QA issues with these parts. An example was given of a 'Clock Spring' part that had been swapped out 2-3 times.
robm3 said:
cmvtec said:
Pintofbest said:
I read it more that the supplier cannot deliver to quality hence the issue is solely theirs until they make a part that is acceptable, the parts that do make the grade get accepted therefore there should be no issue to the customers.
Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Exactly this.Interesting thing to muse over though, JLR design, engineer and bolt together in the main, suppliers make the parts. When parts fail due to quality then JLR get the blame not the supplier which is not correct.
Nothing that will effect the final customer, either way. The tooling is ancient, and belongs to JLR. The onus is definitely shifted onto the supplier.
But interestingly, I was told by a Land Rover Indie that many electrical parts are now sourced via Indian suppliers instead of Taiwan and there's been a marked increase in QA issues with these parts. An example was given of a 'Clock Spring' part that had been swapped out 2-3 times.
I'm pleased, personally, that UK PLC is still deeply involved in the automotive industry, even if we don't own any of it any more.
It just seems a bit of a shame that JLR has seen fit not only to stop building a car which clearly had continuing demand so that it could make even more Beckham-esque chitz models, but the soils the reputation of a great icon by chucking a cheap boat anchor V8 in the front of it and demanding £150k for the privilege of doing so.
Christ there are farmers and mud-pluggers all over the UK who've done similar engine conversions for £5k...
Christ there are farmers and mud-pluggers all over the UK who've done similar engine conversions for £5k...
donkmeister said:
I can't imagine those Salisbury axles are designed for whizzing round at 140 mph!!!
They don't have Salisbury axles. The rear Salisbury was phased out in about 2003 and was never in a 90corozin said:
Christ there are farmers and mud-pluggers all over the UK who've done similar engine conversions for £5k...
Having fitted an LS2/3 along with the 6spd auto in a Defender myself I can assure you it cost a lot more than 5k. Brooking10 said:
I was about to say somebody will be along soon to say “ I wouldn’t buy one even if I won the lottery” and surprise, surprise ! :]
You called?Well, I have to say that “I wouldn’t buy one even if I won the lottery”.
For me even a bonkers car has to make a tiny bit of sense and this one doesn't.
sgtBerbatov said:
Brynjaminjones said:
LewisR said:
"all-wheel drive" ??
What's wrong with stating 4WD ?
I would guess that it's to highlight that it's in permanent 4wd with a centre differential.What's wrong with stating 4WD ?
AWD power is constant to all four wheels at the same time.
4WD power is moved back and forth when needed.
IIRC anyway.
te.A Twisted Land Rover 90 in their 'Classic II' spec starts at £81k (£67,580 + VAT), and that still has the 2.2 Puma Diesel.
Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
aaron_2000 said:
TooMany2cvs said:
If the reason the old one's unprofitable is because it's massively labour-intensive to build, yep.
Don't recall it being discontinued due to profits, I think you'd find it was discontinued due to emissions, now how do we fix emissions issues? By updating it 
2007, and Euro 4 inescapable? Puma 2.4
2012, and Euro 5 inescapable? Puma 2.2
So why would Ingenium be impossible for Euro 6? It wouldn't...
The emissions story is rubbish.
Dr Interceptor said:
A Twisted Land Rover 90 in their 'Classic II' spec starts at £81k (£67,580 + VAT), and that still has the 2.2 Puma Diesel.
Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
Exactly Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
LS3 conversions plus auto box from the likes of Twisted, Bespoke and Urban are all running at 100k and upwards.
This is a sanctioned build (basically a nut and bolt rebuild) with an OEM engine and as you say versus the market it’s on the money.
And therein lies the key - the market. Irrespective of what the “never gonna buy one” brethren think of it there is a market for these.
Brooking10 said:
Dr Interceptor said:
A Twisted Land Rover 90 in their 'Classic II' spec starts at £81k (£67,580 + VAT), and that still has the 2.2 Puma Diesel.
Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
Exactly Add in the engine swap, and associated engineering/testing, and your're well over £100k.
Then the fact that it's an official Land Rover product, not something aftermarket, and I think they're spot on price wise.
LS3 conversions plus auto box from the likes of Twisted, Bespoke and Urban are all running at 100k and upwards.
This is a sanctioned build (basically a nut and bolt rebuild) with an OEM engine and as you say versus the market it’s on the money.
And therein lies the key - the market. Irrespective of what the “never gonna buy one” brethren think of it there is a market for these.
Not like on the production line where if a rubber doesn't quite fit, its banged in with a hammer, and rectified later through warranty. These will be painstakingly rebuilt, where if one part doesn't fit, work halts until its re-machined so it fits perfectly.
Dr Interceptor said:
Plus the fact that it's being rebuilt by Land Rover Heritage will make it very special indeed, I'd imagine the fit and finish will be excellent.
Not like on the production line where if a rubber doesn't quite fit, its banged in with a hammer, and rectified later through warranty. These will be painstakingly rebuilt, where if one part doesn't fit, work halts until its re-machined so it fits perfectly.
It's only £150k, y'know.Not like on the production line where if a rubber doesn't quite fit, its banged in with a hammer, and rectified later through warranty. These will be painstakingly rebuilt, where if one part doesn't fit, work halts until its re-machined so it fits perfectly.
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