RE: McLaren BP23 to 'exceed' 243mph
Discussion
RobM77 said:
What I find sad is how many manufacturers, including McLaren, have not made cars to this spec again and focus on speed instead. Of course the latest range are very usable, but they don't follow that original purist brief, which is what I think is a shame.
Although the answer there is that:-
- Most buyers (globally, this is) in the >>£100k segment are more interested in bragging rights (power / speed / acceleration / badge) than about outright driveability. Or about trinkets and image. Or they've got a fleet of cars so don't really want a 'do it all' supercar.
- Those that do favour driveability tend to go straight to a GT3 / Speciale, or to a classic / modern classic, where the engagement is so much better.
- Manufacturers are only interested in making a profit. Which CAN include building a brand-image...but brand-image is hardly ever done on "oh their cars drive so nicely".
hyphen said:
But they could outsource it. Jag's new e-pace is being built by Magna Steyr who have also undertaken production for the likes of Aston Martin and Merc SLS AMG in the past. At a cheaper price point I don't think buyers would care where it was built.
I think it is more about brand positioning, do McLaren want to a be a Porsche/Lotus (sports cars) Or do they want to be a Ferrari /Lambo(supercars)
The supercar manufacturers don't make cheap models to compete with base spec 911, they want to be exclusive.
The earlier Aston Vantage were cheaper iirc, but the new Vantage starts at £120k so even they no longer want to compete with Porsche/Lotus level brands directly.
They could use the likes of Magna to build the car for them - but they still have to tool up their factory. If you add this to the cost of producing full production tooling for 30-50k cars per year (which is needed to make a model work at this price point) it's still not a cheap hobby, with an already busy market and diminishing demand for sports cars in this price bracket. I think it is more about brand positioning, do McLaren want to a be a Porsche/Lotus (sports cars) Or do they want to be a Ferrari /Lambo(supercars)
The supercar manufacturers don't make cheap models to compete with base spec 911, they want to be exclusive.
The earlier Aston Vantage were cheaper iirc, but the new Vantage starts at £120k so even they no longer want to compete with Porsche/Lotus level brands directly.
Edited by hyphen on Monday 12th March 09:52
The ROI is relatively low per vehicle and development costs are high. I can fully understand why they are happy making 3k cars a year.
LarsG said:
Where could you test 5he top speed to prove it?
This place 
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Ehra-Lessien,+...
Rich_W said:
There's no point in McLaren launching a hyper GT that isn't as fast as the competition that's been around for 18months (Chiron) If they are serious about being the best, they need to knock it out of the park. To me it needs to be faster than Chiron, be utterly luxurious like the Bugatti or even a S Class AND crucially handle better than both
Think something like a SLR+++ Super fast, easy to drive across Europe and a nice place to sit.
I understand the lack of interest in top speed, but it matters for bragging rights, people who buy these cars want that. Remember that you can get a Brabus Rocket EV12 for half a million that does 230mph and can carry 4 (and luggage) across Europe. These are the cars you're trying to take sales from.
It's quite amusing to read how they've got the concept so wrong for a car that's sold out. Think something like a SLR+++ Super fast, easy to drive across Europe and a nice place to sit.
I understand the lack of interest in top speed, but it matters for bragging rights, people who buy these cars want that. Remember that you can get a Brabus Rocket EV12 for half a million that does 230mph and can carry 4 (and luggage) across Europe. These are the cars you're trying to take sales from.
donteatpeople said:
It's quite amusing to read how they've got the concept so wrong for a car that's sold out.
We're talking hypothetically obviously. What WE would like McLaren to make. Not that I'm ever likely to be in the position to buy one. 
But like it or not, when McLaren release this car. People WILL mention that the Chiron is a chunk faster. How can a company as powerful as McLaren allow that to happen? Why not sit at the top of the tree for a while? They certainly have the ability to make BP23 faster and keep in all the other attributes they want.
Being sold out doesn't mean much these days. If ALL the buyers were planning to keep the car for a few years then it might. But given a lot of those will be quick flippers...
I’m sure people will mention that the Chiron is faster. I’d imagine they could allow it to happen because having the highest top speed in the world was never a priority for this car. Top speed wasn’t a priority for the F1, it was just a result. I don’t think there’s any real ‘spiritual’, marketing or practical reasons why it should need to have the top speed record. Over 243mph/Fastest ever McLaren would be enough to secure my hypothetical purchase.
People will also complain that it weighs more than 1000kg, there’s no clutch pedal, it’s got traction control, it’s not normally aspirated, it’s only got 8 cylinders, it's a hybrid, it’s irrelevant, it’s ugly, it’s got the wrong name, it’s too expensive, they’re not driven on the road enough, they’re driven too much in London and that PH wrote an article on it when they can’t buy one. McLaren will never please everyone but if they can sell every car they will make and investors are so confident demand will outstrip supply they’re willing to buy to ‘flip’ I’d say they have succeeded.
I’m sure the car will be fantastic to drive, I’m sure I will never drive one, I hope it’s as nice to look at as the P1.
People will also complain that it weighs more than 1000kg, there’s no clutch pedal, it’s got traction control, it’s not normally aspirated, it’s only got 8 cylinders, it's a hybrid, it’s irrelevant, it’s ugly, it’s got the wrong name, it’s too expensive, they’re not driven on the road enough, they’re driven too much in London and that PH wrote an article on it when they can’t buy one. McLaren will never please everyone but if they can sell every car they will make and investors are so confident demand will outstrip supply they’re willing to buy to ‘flip’ I’d say they have succeeded.
I’m sure the car will be fantastic to drive, I’m sure I will never drive one, I hope it’s as nice to look at as the P1.
Rich_W said:
Only if VW allow them to.
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