RE: Volkswagen Lupo GTI: Spotted
Discussion
Looks like they really hold their value well. Drove one for a couple of years, really liked the thing.
Warning to those thinking these are just slightly more plush Twingo RS / 106 Rallye type cars -- from my experience much safer / grown up / 'boring' at least out of the box. For good or bad, typical VW. OEM chassis setup made for a safe Autobahn VMax, always on ESP, bit heavy for the size.
On the plus side well screwed together, front seat experience is really 'big car made small'. Pretty comfortable and lots of room. Think I remember a commercial where the driver regularly pulled up way to far ahead at the pump
. That type of experience. Also pretty decent Xenons, good gear shift and nice engine. Not super peaky as there is some torque. But still willing to rev nicely. The short gearing also helps (VMax is limiter in 6th).
For an unmodified one, the charm really is in the looks, rarety and useabilty. IIRC the Lupo range wasn't a huge commercial success because he buggers where a bit too expensive to make. Feels to me they gave up at some point and then used the platform as a test bed, for experimenting with then new tech. The 3l TDI versions, the GTI and the now even rarer 1.4 FSI had way to many bespoke bits to make any financial sense.
The GTI had a good amount of totally bespoke body parts, a few of them even in aluminium as the article mentions. Then obvious stuff like the xenon lights (very expensive option almost 20 years ago). But also less obvious things like metal bodied gas struts for the boot *and* the bonnet. The norm would have been standard plastic jobs for the boot and the usual metal prop under the hood. I had climate control and a hard disk based MP3 'cd changer' on mine. GPS nav was available. Fun to have most of the then state of the art equipment in a car as small.
If I bought one now I'd be in two minds about what to do with it. Either treat it as a (minor) collector's item, perhaps discretly bringing the hifi & entertainment system up to current standard (double DIN units look good in them and are mounted in a good spot), trying to make everything look OEM. Same for the rest of the car where appropriate - e.g. use better than OEM bits to upgrade e.g. the chassis. Or strip it, put a cage in and build a track toy.
Looking at the prices I think one needs to dig these little things though. Looks wise I think they have aged exceptionally well and they have a lot of charm. But sensible pants on -- the Swift Sport has made them pretty much redundant. Weighs a bit less, goes a bit better, similar pure NA hatch driving experience, more room, everything a bit more modern. And cheaper to buy.
Warning to those thinking these are just slightly more plush Twingo RS / 106 Rallye type cars -- from my experience much safer / grown up / 'boring' at least out of the box. For good or bad, typical VW. OEM chassis setup made for a safe Autobahn VMax, always on ESP, bit heavy for the size.
On the plus side well screwed together, front seat experience is really 'big car made small'. Pretty comfortable and lots of room. Think I remember a commercial where the driver regularly pulled up way to far ahead at the pump
. That type of experience. Also pretty decent Xenons, good gear shift and nice engine. Not super peaky as there is some torque. But still willing to rev nicely. The short gearing also helps (VMax is limiter in 6th).For an unmodified one, the charm really is in the looks, rarety and useabilty. IIRC the Lupo range wasn't a huge commercial success because he buggers where a bit too expensive to make. Feels to me they gave up at some point and then used the platform as a test bed, for experimenting with then new tech. The 3l TDI versions, the GTI and the now even rarer 1.4 FSI had way to many bespoke bits to make any financial sense.
The GTI had a good amount of totally bespoke body parts, a few of them even in aluminium as the article mentions. Then obvious stuff like the xenon lights (very expensive option almost 20 years ago). But also less obvious things like metal bodied gas struts for the boot *and* the bonnet. The norm would have been standard plastic jobs for the boot and the usual metal prop under the hood. I had climate control and a hard disk based MP3 'cd changer' on mine. GPS nav was available. Fun to have most of the then state of the art equipment in a car as small.
If I bought one now I'd be in two minds about what to do with it. Either treat it as a (minor) collector's item, perhaps discretly bringing the hifi & entertainment system up to current standard (double DIN units look good in them and are mounted in a good spot), trying to make everything look OEM. Same for the rest of the car where appropriate - e.g. use better than OEM bits to upgrade e.g. the chassis. Or strip it, put a cage in and build a track toy.
Looking at the prices I think one needs to dig these little things though. Looks wise I think they have aged exceptionally well and they have a lot of charm. But sensible pants on -- the Swift Sport has made them pretty much redundant. Weighs a bit less, goes a bit better, similar pure NA hatch driving experience, more room, everything a bit more modern. And cheaper to buy.
Kolbenkopp said:
The GTI had a good amount of totally bespoke body parts, a few of them even in aluminium as the article mentions.
Looking at the prices I think one needs to dig these little things though. Looks wise I think they have aged exceptionally well and they have a lot of charm. But sensible pants on -- the Swift Sport has made them pretty much redundant. Weighs a bit less, goes a bit better, similar pure NA hatch driving experience, more room, everything a bit more modern. And cheaper to buy.
I'd be surprised if the Swift was any lighter than this or faster....or at least the last n/asp Swift Sport if that's the one you mean?Looking at the prices I think one needs to dig these little things though. Looks wise I think they have aged exceptionally well and they have a lot of charm. But sensible pants on -- the Swift Sport has made them pretty much redundant. Weighs a bit less, goes a bit better, similar pure NA hatch driving experience, more room, everything a bit more modern. And cheaper to buy.
They were aiming to get the new turbo Swift Sport down to under 1000kg though
I had one of these for a couple of years and enjoyed it - it was a bit hollow feeling but overall a great car to own. Currently I drive an R53 Mini Cooper S and find it to be a class above the Lupo GTi, just feels a bit better built, nicer to drive and not quite so flimsy.
I sometimes think about getting another GTi, but I think I’d be disappointed behind the wheel of one after spending over £4k on it, considering what’s available that’s similar and for half of that price.
I sometimes think about getting another GTi, but I think I’d be disappointed behind the wheel of one after spending over £4k on it, considering what’s available that’s similar and for half of that price.
I drove one of these, briefly, earlier in the week.
It's the first car I've driven in EONS where the steering wheel felt like it was turning the front wheels through some sort of mechanical system.
Zero centre slop or play, no "rubber band" feeling, no variable assistance bulls
t - just a wheel which turned the wheels, it was lovely!
I really despise a lot of modern car steering systems, they feel like they use elastic and custard in varying amounts - I genuinely get zero feedback of what the front wheels of most modern cars are doing, indeed some seem to REVEL in how light the can be (it seems the no of buttons and the fact it's non-circular matter to designers more these days?)
p.s. the Lupo obviously has no steering-wheel buttons either - another massive plus then...
It's the first car I've driven in EONS where the steering wheel felt like it was turning the front wheels through some sort of mechanical system.
Zero centre slop or play, no "rubber band" feeling, no variable assistance bulls
t - just a wheel which turned the wheels, it was lovely!I really despise a lot of modern car steering systems, they feel like they use elastic and custard in varying amounts - I genuinely get zero feedback of what the front wheels of most modern cars are doing, indeed some seem to REVEL in how light the can be (it seems the no of buttons and the fact it's non-circular matter to designers more these days?)
p.s. the Lupo obviously has no steering-wheel buttons either - another massive plus then...
Always fancied one of these but boy do the seem t hold price. You can get a much newer swift for the money and seems to be very little in the package setup =
Lupo gti facts (according to Parker’s)
Power = 123 bhp
Top speed = 127 mph
0=60 = 8 sec
Torque = 152nm
Co2 = 178
Weight = 1015 kg
Wheelbase = 2323
Suzuki swift 2011 - 2017 nav model
Power = 134 bhp
Top speed = 121 mph
0 = 60. = 8.4
Torque = 160nm
Co2 = 147
Weight = 1045 kg
Wheelbase = 2430
Lupo gti facts (according to Parker’s)
Power = 123 bhp
Top speed = 127 mph
0=60 = 8 sec
Torque = 152nm
Co2 = 178
Weight = 1015 kg
Wheelbase = 2323
Suzuki swift 2011 - 2017 nav model
Power = 134 bhp
Top speed = 121 mph
0 = 60. = 8.4
Torque = 160nm
Co2 = 147
Weight = 1045 kg
Wheelbase = 2430
406dogvan said:
I drove one of these, briefly, earlier in the week.
It's the first car I've driven in EONS where the steering wheel felt like it was turning the front wheels through some sort of mechanical system.
Zero centre slop or play, no "rubber band" feeling, no variable assistance bullst - just a wheel which turned the wheels, it was lovely!
I really despise a lot of modern car steering systems, they feel like they use elastic and custard in varying amounts - I genuinely get zero feedback of what the front wheels of most modern cars are doing, indeed some seem to REVEL in how light the can be (it seems the no of buttons and the fact it's non-circular matter to designers more these days?)
p.s. the Lupo obviously has no steering-wheel buttons either - another massive plus then...
This!It's the first car I've driven in EONS where the steering wheel felt like it was turning the front wheels through some sort of mechanical system.
Zero centre slop or play, no "rubber band" feeling, no variable assistance bulls
t - just a wheel which turned the wheels, it was lovely!I really despise a lot of modern car steering systems, they feel like they use elastic and custard in varying amounts - I genuinely get zero feedback of what the front wheels of most modern cars are doing, indeed some seem to REVEL in how light the can be (it seems the no of buttons and the fact it's non-circular matter to designers more these days?)
p.s. the Lupo obviously has no steering-wheel buttons either - another massive plus then...
I own a high mileage early 5 speed... even with 150k on the clock the steering feels so tight and surprisingly weighty. It was the first thing I noticed when I bought the car.
I did a track day at Bruntingthorpe years ago and the instructor asked us at the start which car we thought we'd end up enjoying the most. The list included 355 (race prepped), Westfield, Monaro, Atom amongst others. At the end of the day he asked again and we almost unanimously said Lupo. They'd bought a set of 1-make competition Touring cars from Germany. Whilst clearly not the fastest, the steering, grip and all-round fun round the aerodrome track was phenomenal. I've never drive a stock GTi but the basic design must be absolutely spot-on.
Furberger said:
BAM225 said:
rallycross said:
If you'd spent any time behind the wheel of a Lupo Gti you'd have a very different opinion as these were/are a fantastic little hot hatch and feel much quicker than the on paper numbers suggest.
Warm hatch, they were a warm hatch.The modern, bloated iterations of the golfs etc aren't hot hatches any more.
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