Are these Vloggers just a scam? SOL or Shmee etc? (Vol 2)
Discussion
Buster73 said:
Followed a few of these guys both on YouTube and Instagram, but the final straw for me was Shmee draining oil from a car in a heavily sponsored Mobil set up.
One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
Bit harsh that. One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
I quite enjoyed it though. Beats the first oil change I did, that was on a Corsa!
I don't really care if its a sponsored video or not, as long as it's not overly in your face and doesn't distract from the overall video.
Could have been a whole lot worse. 'OMG!! I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY LET ME DO THIS TO A LAMBO!'. Thumbnail of Tim covered in oil holding a spanner....
Buster73 said:
Followed a few of these guys both on YouTube and Instagram, but the final straw for me was Shmee draining oil from a car in a heavily sponsored Mobil set up.
One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
Unlike other channels, Tim not only flagged the video as being sponsored content, but also made it clear it was supported and promoted by Mobil - I don't see a problem with that. It wasn't a "sell out", and nor was it hidden. The folks making these videos, much like all of us, have to earn an income after all. Do you stop following a sportsperson because they make a TV advert for a product, support a brand, wear a logo, etc?One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
Provided the support is acknowledged from the creator, and not hidden, I don't have a problem. Unfortunately there's far, far too many channels out there who aren't doing the right thing, but that's not the case with Tim.
(And no, I'm not a follower of Tim so the above isn't a defence - I do watch some of his clips, mostly the road-trip type, but there's easily more that I don't watch than I do).
Buster73 said:
Followed a few of these guys both on YouTube and Instagram, but the final straw for me was Shmee draining oil from a car in a heavily sponsored Mobil set up.
One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
Every single popular youtuber does promotional work, every single one of them, even the one your wouldn't expect. Even that Ally Law guy that climbs buildings and does overnight challenges gets Go Pros to film with.One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
In regards to Shmee it's obvious he's promoting the products without there needing to be a disclaimer. He went to Finland to the Mobil 1 factory. I'm no expect but I suspect he didn't travel all the way there of his own accord to find out about viscosity of oil. It was pretty obvious it was a Mobil 1 tour.
A bit shocked that Tim might be selling his GT3 but his reason behind makes sense. Not a good DD and he has to make room for other cars coming in.
Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
Buster73 said:
Followed a few of these guys both on YouTube and Instagram, but the final straw for me was Shmee draining oil from a car in a heavily sponsored Mobil set up.
One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
That seems a very odd thing to get upset/offended about, which part exactly was the step too far for you out of interest?One step too far for me I’m afraid , lost a follower for good , not that it’ll make any difference to him.
Slippery slope downwards from here in imho.
KHK said:
Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
STG Sam is for certain, and I think James may be too. Sure I read on Instagram somewhere that he is - not sure if I've dreamt it now. Weird dream if I did. KHK said:
A bit shocked that Tim might be selling his GT3 but his reason behind makes sense. Not a good DD and he has to make room for other cars coming in.
Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
Wish I had the cash to buy it. Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
WarrenB said:
KHK said:
Are any of the UK YT'bers heading to car week? I'm leaving for Cali on Thursday, attending Quail as a guest of Lambo for the unveiling of the SVJ.
STG Sam is for certain, and I think James may be too. Sure I read on Instagram somewhere that he is - not sure if I've dreamt it now. Weird dream if I did. I do feel for the creators re the sponsorship / promtion aspect. There is a well known mantra in the tech fraternity that if you give the consumer the service for free, then the consumer is the product - you are selling eyeballs. Sadly I think that the youth skewed demographic have grown up being funded by their parents with a sense of entitlement and no real concept that time is money and in addition to opportunity cost there is an actual cost to paying for travel, film equipment, not to mention the cars themselves. They consume vsst amounts of content for free yet begrudge the creator a few seconds of eyeball time to help pay for it. As said, people have been used to sponsored TV programmes, adverts and merchandise deals for years, whats changed is the personal direct relationship via comments that viewers feel they 'own' to an extent that content by granting their subsribes which is why the common thing is 'I don't like xyz so stop it or i'll unsub', and if a creator sats 'nobody forces you to watch, you didn't pay' cue irate tirade of entitlement of how they are the subscribers and the creator serves at their pleasure and sadly for the full-time youtube creators the fear of a mass-backlass means they have to often suffer in fear of losing the business they may have taken years to build.
As the famous line goes 'the mob are fickle brother.'
The irony is that the viewers seem to begrudge the creators having the means to fund the very thing they are there to consume - glamerous expensive lifestyles. It doesn't matter how you fund it - rich parents, sponsorship, shwag, advertising - somone will complain you are just 'selling out' 'cashing in' or somehow exploiting them. I think thats to be expected given a large core of immaturity in the audience, and the standard adage of 'you can't please all of the people...'
The catch 22 is, if you can't at least offset the expense then why bother? These guys are putting in more work than most pro film crews and youtube mostly pays buttons unless you have a huge arsenal of back content.
It is partly a self-made problem - the audience participation aspect is what drives the entitlement where the creators try to please the audience too much allowing them to dictate creative and commercial policy to a degree - I think Harry's Garage is much more stable for the long term because he's curating an audience of genuine car enthusiasts rather than a more fickle demographic.
I think a lot of channels will implode this year and be forced to retire, merge, or wither on the vine - its getting a very expensive game to play with guys niw investing in 4k cinema quality kit from the likes of red and arri, and production values trending up into traditional broadcast territory.
Sorry for the long post - It's been fascinating to watch the content market iterate from the sidelines - I'm thankful to an extent I stayed out the fray and didn't start the channel I had planned simply because it allowed me to grow my day business to the point where I could probably fund an entire production crew without needing to do any snake oil selling, the question I suppose would be why bother I'm a passionate film maker and love supercars and motorsport, but why suffer the tirade of comment abuse when you could invest all that shiny cinematic kit in making feature length content for the paid subscription market? If we're going to take flak for getting sponsored by motoring related firms for sponsoring motoring content and the viewers expect to watch for free, why spend the hours of work doing it? I'd much rather watch Jon Olsson's lush cinematography than some filmed on a potato shaky cam iphone footage of a car being ragged round tescos carpark, and I've got no problem with Jon getting sponsored to cover the investment to produce content that is vastly more interesting than anything on T.V
As said above - given the interest in buy shiny thing/wrap/sell is there any real market for properly made content focused on hunting down rare classic unicorns then content on the buying, maintaining and running of them?
Is anyonebreally interested in the hunt for a mint 348tb or 328gts that doesn't involve a trip to yiannimize to get it wrapped chrome?
How many people want to actually learn something about the history of the models etc rather than just 5 minutes of 'wow, awesome, what is happening here, words cannot explain?'
For me personally I'd love to make the sort of lovingly shot car porn of a classic V12 snaking through the mountains through a anamorphic shot non instagra filtered camera than a MTV mashup of 'omg lifegoals' selfies with actual owners perspectives rather than somone who borrowed a car for an hour to get reaction videos round chelsea.
I think really you need to just make content you would watch and hope you find a like-minded audience, I don't think I could cope with the stress of trying to make a living from it, but a chillaxed Harry's Garage style channel aimed more at a smaller mature enthusiast market might be rewarding way to justify the expense of collecting a bunch of cars I don't need without resorting to lendimg them out for reaction videos and fake pranks - you know who you are my cheeky petit chien )
Food for thought and sorry for the long post, youtube is such a great content platform with so much potential, just seems to be slightly toxic at times which makes you wonder if the positives outweigh the negatives.
As the famous line goes 'the mob are fickle brother.'
The irony is that the viewers seem to begrudge the creators having the means to fund the very thing they are there to consume - glamerous expensive lifestyles. It doesn't matter how you fund it - rich parents, sponsorship, shwag, advertising - somone will complain you are just 'selling out' 'cashing in' or somehow exploiting them. I think thats to be expected given a large core of immaturity in the audience, and the standard adage of 'you can't please all of the people...'
The catch 22 is, if you can't at least offset the expense then why bother? These guys are putting in more work than most pro film crews and youtube mostly pays buttons unless you have a huge arsenal of back content.
It is partly a self-made problem - the audience participation aspect is what drives the entitlement where the creators try to please the audience too much allowing them to dictate creative and commercial policy to a degree - I think Harry's Garage is much more stable for the long term because he's curating an audience of genuine car enthusiasts rather than a more fickle demographic.
I think a lot of channels will implode this year and be forced to retire, merge, or wither on the vine - its getting a very expensive game to play with guys niw investing in 4k cinema quality kit from the likes of red and arri, and production values trending up into traditional broadcast territory.
Sorry for the long post - It's been fascinating to watch the content market iterate from the sidelines - I'm thankful to an extent I stayed out the fray and didn't start the channel I had planned simply because it allowed me to grow my day business to the point where I could probably fund an entire production crew without needing to do any snake oil selling, the question I suppose would be why bother I'm a passionate film maker and love supercars and motorsport, but why suffer the tirade of comment abuse when you could invest all that shiny cinematic kit in making feature length content for the paid subscription market? If we're going to take flak for getting sponsored by motoring related firms for sponsoring motoring content and the viewers expect to watch for free, why spend the hours of work doing it? I'd much rather watch Jon Olsson's lush cinematography than some filmed on a potato shaky cam iphone footage of a car being ragged round tescos carpark, and I've got no problem with Jon getting sponsored to cover the investment to produce content that is vastly more interesting than anything on T.V
As said above - given the interest in buy shiny thing/wrap/sell is there any real market for properly made content focused on hunting down rare classic unicorns then content on the buying, maintaining and running of them?
Is anyonebreally interested in the hunt for a mint 348tb or 328gts that doesn't involve a trip to yiannimize to get it wrapped chrome?
How many people want to actually learn something about the history of the models etc rather than just 5 minutes of 'wow, awesome, what is happening here, words cannot explain?'
For me personally I'd love to make the sort of lovingly shot car porn of a classic V12 snaking through the mountains through a anamorphic shot non instagra filtered camera than a MTV mashup of 'omg lifegoals' selfies with actual owners perspectives rather than somone who borrowed a car for an hour to get reaction videos round chelsea.
I think really you need to just make content you would watch and hope you find a like-minded audience, I don't think I could cope with the stress of trying to make a living from it, but a chillaxed Harry's Garage style channel aimed more at a smaller mature enthusiast market might be rewarding way to justify the expense of collecting a bunch of cars I don't need without resorting to lendimg them out for reaction videos and fake pranks - you know who you are my cheeky petit chien )
Food for thought and sorry for the long post, youtube is such a great content platform with so much potential, just seems to be slightly toxic at times which makes you wonder if the positives outweigh the negatives.
Actually missed the real point of my post in my long ramble, and what I wanted to kick out for some opinion.
You're in a position where after several hard years your business is now ticking along generating cash and you are bored and want a new challenge, after a decade of all work no fun you fancy cashing out a bit and indulging in your fantasy garage bucket list, but feel you don't want to just leave the things gathering dust, but don't just want to stand round at shows/meets but actually take them on some epic drivers with friends.
Would you start a channel under the current climate to share the whole experience to scratch your filmaker itch, or not bother, enjoy the cars in private and go and film wildlife in the serengeti instead/become a secret porn producer?
Assumimg you think said channel would be interesting, focusing mostly on find and running some rare unicorns - like finding a delivery mileage classic and getting it on the road after decades sat in storage, what sort of stuff would be interesting? buying? workshop? driving experiences? comparisons with other era or newer models?
I don't want to copy Harry, so I'd like something a bit different, but not too much anorak real ale type thing to try and at least get younger generations to realise classics can be as interesting as the xbox gen cars.
Any thoughts appreciated. I've promised myself an Alexa Mini kit for my birthday so want to put it to work in the new year once I get bored of filming migrating geese and artistic w
k shorts of an alcoholic monologue about his imaginary pet duck.
You're in a position where after several hard years your business is now ticking along generating cash and you are bored and want a new challenge, after a decade of all work no fun you fancy cashing out a bit and indulging in your fantasy garage bucket list, but feel you don't want to just leave the things gathering dust, but don't just want to stand round at shows/meets but actually take them on some epic drivers with friends.
Would you start a channel under the current climate to share the whole experience to scratch your filmaker itch, or not bother, enjoy the cars in private and go and film wildlife in the serengeti instead/become a secret porn producer?
Assumimg you think said channel would be interesting, focusing mostly on find and running some rare unicorns - like finding a delivery mileage classic and getting it on the road after decades sat in storage, what sort of stuff would be interesting? buying? workshop? driving experiences? comparisons with other era or newer models?
I don't want to copy Harry, so I'd like something a bit different, but not too much anorak real ale type thing to try and at least get younger generations to realise classics can be as interesting as the xbox gen cars.
Any thoughts appreciated. I've promised myself an Alexa Mini kit for my birthday so want to put it to work in the new year once I get bored of filming migrating geese and artistic w
k shorts of an alcoholic monologue about his imaginary pet duck.nyxster said:
Actually missed the real point of my post in my long ramble, and what I wanted to kick out for some opinion.
You're in a position where after several hard years your business is now ticking along generating cash and you are bored and want a new challenge, after a decade of all work no fun you fancy cashing out a bit and indulging in your fantasy garage bucket list, but feel you don't want to just leave the things gathering dust, but don't just want to stand round at shows/meets but actually take them on some epic drivers with friends.
Would you start a channel under the current climate to share the whole experience to scratch your filmaker itch, or not bother, enjoy the cars in private and go and film wildlife in the serengeti instead/become a secret porn producer?
Assumimg you think said channel would be interesting, focusing mostly on find and running some rare unicorns - like finding a delivery mileage classic and getting it on the road after decades sat in storage, what sort of stuff would be interesting? buying? workshop? driving experiences? comparisons with other era or newer models?
I don't want to copy Harry, so I'd like something a bit different, but not too much anorak real ale type thing to try and at least get younger generations to realise classics can be as interesting as the xbox gen cars.
Any thoughts appreciated. I've promised myself an Alexa Mini kit for my birthday so want to put it to work in the new year once I get bored of filming migrating geese and artistic wk shorts of an alcoholic monologue about his imaginary pet duck.
Many might say it's a saturated market, but in truth, there's a lot of people doing the same thing - to the point where if you do something different, you begin to stand out from the crowd. With the number of people around the globe getting connected to the internet only increasing, there's never been a better time to start a channel (in some respects - ignoring the perceived $$$ on offer, which isn't why you'd start a channel now that it's much harder to make a living out of YT revenue). For the joy of film making, and being able to get your work out there to an audience for free - YouTube is wonderful.You're in a position where after several hard years your business is now ticking along generating cash and you are bored and want a new challenge, after a decade of all work no fun you fancy cashing out a bit and indulging in your fantasy garage bucket list, but feel you don't want to just leave the things gathering dust, but don't just want to stand round at shows/meets but actually take them on some epic drivers with friends.
Would you start a channel under the current climate to share the whole experience to scratch your filmaker itch, or not bother, enjoy the cars in private and go and film wildlife in the serengeti instead/become a secret porn producer?
Assumimg you think said channel would be interesting, focusing mostly on find and running some rare unicorns - like finding a delivery mileage classic and getting it on the road after decades sat in storage, what sort of stuff would be interesting? buying? workshop? driving experiences? comparisons with other era or newer models?
I don't want to copy Harry, so I'd like something a bit different, but not too much anorak real ale type thing to try and at least get younger generations to realise classics can be as interesting as the xbox gen cars.
Any thoughts appreciated. I've promised myself an Alexa Mini kit for my birthday so want to put it to work in the new year once I get bored of filming migrating geese and artistic w
k shorts of an alcoholic monologue about his imaginary pet duck.I mentioned on a previous page, it would be nice to see more retro, mechanical, nuts and bolts content get more of a following - the trouble is (and I might be completely wrong in thinking this), the younger generation just getting into the car scene, have less interest in learning about and working on cars - they're more keen on treating them like jewelry to show off with). Maybe when the PPF / exhaust / road trip / prank / sell thing has run its course, there'll be a need to produce something different. Personally I like how the production value on certain channels has really moved the goal posts (Carfection and Petrolicious - they're the go to places if you want well beautifully shot content, and the care & attention in a shot is readily apparent).
+1 on the Harry's Garage comments; Harry's old school, and when he does a road trip, he goes full nuclear - it's brilliant to watch.
Anyway, get the Arri kit bought, you only live once
NFC 85 Vette said:
Many might say it's a saturated market, but in truth, there's a lot of people doing the same thing - to the point where if you do something different, you begin to stand out from the crowd. With the number of people around the globe getting connected to the internet only increasing, there's never been a better time to start a channel (in some respects - ignoring the perceived $$$ on offer, which isn't why you'd start a channel now that it's much harder to make a living out of YT revenue). For the joy of film making, and being able to get your work out there to an audience for free - YouTube is wonderful.
I mentioned on a previous page, it would be nice to see more retro, mechanical, nuts and bolts content get more of a following - the trouble is (and I might be completely wrong in thinking this), the younger generation just getting into the car scene, have less interest in learning about and working on cars - they're more keen on treating them like jewelry to show off with). Maybe when the PPF / exhaust / road trip / prank / sell thing has run its course, there'll be a need to produce something different. Personally I like how the production value on certain channels has really moved the goal posts (Carfection and Petrolicious - they're the go to places if you want well beautifully shot content, and the care & attention in a shot is readily apparent).
+1 on the Harry's Garage comments; Harry's old school, and when he does a road trip, he goes full nuclear - it's brilliant to watch.
Anyway, get the Arri kit bought, you only live once
Thanks, I didn't need that much encouragement I mentioned on a previous page, it would be nice to see more retro, mechanical, nuts and bolts content get more of a following - the trouble is (and I might be completely wrong in thinking this), the younger generation just getting into the car scene, have less interest in learning about and working on cars - they're more keen on treating them like jewelry to show off with). Maybe when the PPF / exhaust / road trip / prank / sell thing has run its course, there'll be a need to produce something different. Personally I like how the production value on certain channels has really moved the goal posts (Carfection and Petrolicious - they're the go to places if you want well beautifully shot content, and the care & attention in a shot is readily apparent).
+1 on the Harry's Garage comments; Harry's old school, and when he does a road trip, he goes full nuclear - it's brilliant to watch.
Anyway, get the Arri kit bought, you only live once
- it was the usual 'start out on something modest then oooh shiny' that escalated into enough kit to shoot the next Bladerunner being on the shopping list. Like you said, you only live once and having had to muddle through my student film making with begged & borrowed kit being in the fortunate position to fund that lomg held passion is really something I don't want to regret that I missed out on. not really bothered about it being profit making - I struggled through running crappy jobs to fund 15 minute shortd that would get a friends and family showing then that was it, so like you say having a non monopoly platform like youtube to get your work out to an audience is the reward for most film makers who do it for the passion of just creating great cinematography they feel pride in. Combining that with my other big passion is a rewarding enough hobby and, well, you can't take it with you.
What tiggered this was I was contemplating reuinited with my first Supercar love - a 512TR, but really struggled to find a lot of quality content on it to while away bored evenings. Endless videos of 458/hurcan gallardos but when you dig around owners vlogs on running stuff from that era is quite hard to dig out - I'd love to do a back to back like a 512TR vs a F12 to show how far the V12 line has evolved, and the differences in the switch to front engine etc, do a original gumball film inspired roadtrip in the cars from that film like the cobra rather than the stickered up aventador fest <ax turned it into. In my head 'i can picture the beautiful alexa anamorphic panning shots of a classic cobra streaking through the Nevada desert back riads and think, yeah I'd watch that ) - the sort of bucket list journeys that you daydream about on a cold winters night with some decent narrative structure and entertaining (not obnoxious) characters who make you feel like you are along for the ride rather than having obnoxious rich people like mo vlogs rubbing your nose in how rich he is thanks to living on his mummys dime.
I suspect my decision is already made, I just want to avoid falling into the clickbait type traps and try and do something with integrity wiithout suffering the embarrassment of having 27 subscribers due to not putting my sister in a bikini on the thumbnail. I suspect hiring some content PR SEO type might solve that with some targetted facebook / youtube ads to curate a target demographic who doesn't comment that he wants us to wrap a daytona chrome and fit sick rims bruv )
Thank god in the meantime we've got Harry to watch. I don't suppose he knows what yeezys are either
NFC 85 Vette said:
Many might say it's a saturated market, but in truth, there's a lot of people doing the same thing - to the point where if you do something different, you begin to stand out from the crowd. With the number of people around the globe getting connected to the internet only increasing, there's never been a better time to start a channel (in some respects - ignoring the perceived $$$ on offer, which isn't why you'd start a channel now that it's much harder to make a living out of YT revenue). For the joy of film making, and being able to get your work out there to an audience for free - YouTube is wonderful.
I mentioned on a previous page, it would be nice to see more retro, mechanical, nuts and bolts content get more of a following - the trouble is (and I might be completely wrong in thinking this), the younger generation just getting into the car scene, have less interest in learning about and working on cars - they're more keen on treating them like jewelry to show off with). Maybe when the PPF / exhaust / road trip / prank / sell thing has run its course, there'll be a need to produce something different. Personally I like how the production value on certain channels has really moved the goal posts (Carfection and Petrolicious - they're the go to places if you want well beautifully shot content, and the care & attention in a shot is readily apparent).
+1 on the Harry's Garage comments; Harry's old school, and when he does a road trip, he goes full nuclear - it's brilliant to watch.
Anyway, get the Arri kit bought, you only live once
totally sold on the Alexa anamorphic look after I saw some showreels like thisI mentioned on a previous page, it would be nice to see more retro, mechanical, nuts and bolts content get more of a following - the trouble is (and I might be completely wrong in thinking this), the younger generation just getting into the car scene, have less interest in learning about and working on cars - they're more keen on treating them like jewelry to show off with). Maybe when the PPF / exhaust / road trip / prank / sell thing has run its course, there'll be a need to produce something different. Personally I like how the production value on certain channels has really moved the goal posts (Carfection and Petrolicious - they're the go to places if you want well beautifully shot content, and the care & attention in a shot is readily apparent).
+1 on the Harry's Garage comments; Harry's old school, and when he does a road trip, he goes full nuclear - it's brilliant to watch.
Anyway, get the Arri kit bought, you only live once
https://youtu.be/euoQ60D8tSA
F65 is fantastic for eyeball popping landscape vistas but for a really cinematic film look the alexa is just sublime - just feel amazed and thankful that digital means we can now shoot at a level you could only dream of. I know all the DSLR vlog mob swear thats all you need, but I think with the classics getting that retro cinematic look helps give it a more contextual appearance than super crisp digital.
I'll shut up now - boys and their toys eh? WHAT IS HAPPENNING! lol.
The one thing I do know about youtubing, it's the advice everyone gave me and I definitely still ignore - obsessing over gear gets you nowhere. Making videos get you somewhere.
Also, for those of us who travel a lot, the dslrs are a godsend. And I'm pretty sure I could shoot and grade slog3 from an A7s MkII to look identical to that on youtube
But hell, you get all that Arri gear, I'll come cameraman for you for a film!
Also, for those of us who travel a lot, the dslrs are a godsend. And I'm pretty sure I could shoot and grade slog3 from an A7s MkII to look identical to that on youtube
But hell, you get all that Arri gear, I'll come cameraman for you for a film!
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff