RE: Ford drops hatches from US line up
Discussion
t ecosport with it.Some of the comments here -- about Ford, about small cars, about innovation -- are curious to say the least. A reordering of events that's not too far from, "Those bellicose Poles attacked our radio station in Gleiwitz."
Some facts:
- US consumers have abandoned classical hatches and saloons en masse, from most manufacturers (not just Ford)
- Most crossovers are simply tall cars; OEMs can shift easily from one to the other; they can also combine the two formats (Mustang SUV anyone?)
- Today's advanced ICE and ICE hybrid powertrains insulate consumers from most future-cost scenarios of petrol
- The traditional ownership model is being disrupted; consumers will be able to afford "more" car and/or transport that reduces total cost of ownership
- The business model of personal transportation is shifting; it is less about a transaction and more about recurring revenue
If you feel that Ford's decision applies to the US and not to Blighty or its neighbours on the Continent, think again. This is not about, "We like hot hatches and you like muscle-y three-box coupes."
It is more holistic than that. Ironically, one can argue that it has little to do with transportation.
Some facts:
- US consumers have abandoned classical hatches and saloons en masse, from most manufacturers (not just Ford)
- Most crossovers are simply tall cars; OEMs can shift easily from one to the other; they can also combine the two formats (Mustang SUV anyone?)
- Today's advanced ICE and ICE hybrid powertrains insulate consumers from most future-cost scenarios of petrol
- The traditional ownership model is being disrupted; consumers will be able to afford "more" car and/or transport that reduces total cost of ownership
- The business model of personal transportation is shifting; it is less about a transaction and more about recurring revenue
If you feel that Ford's decision applies to the US and not to Blighty or its neighbours on the Continent, think again. This is not about, "We like hot hatches and you like muscle-y three-box coupes."
It is more holistic than that. Ironically, one can argue that it has little to do with transportation.
fblm said:
The one difference you can't escape in the UK is that there simply isn't the infrastructure for US sized SUV's. I've got 2 garages in London that you can *just* get out of a narrow body 964 in, anything bigger forget it...
Right. Just as today, the transportation of tomorrow (if that doesn't sound too much like a naff TV programme) will differ in degrees -- but not in kind.And, because we're all more connected than ever, these degrees of difference can lead to unintended and even fun outcomes. For example, the Citroen Cactus caught the eyes of many crossover fans in the US. But, alas, Johnny French has been absent from US dealership forecourts for nearly 30 years now.
Edited by unsprung on Sunday 29th April 19:17
fblm said:
The one difference you can't escape in the UK is that there simply isn't the infrastructure for US sized SUV's. I've got 2 garages in London that you can *just* get out of a narrow body 964 in, anything bigger forget it...
Which is probably the reason why we're seeing so many small SUV's being released and becoming ever so popular over here in the UK.There's loads of those Ford Ecosport's and Kuga's in our work's car park now. They're not even a niche market anymore, it's everything else that is.
Jon_S_Rally said:
I was in Germany recently and a friend was in a hire car - a 1.5-litre EcoBoost powered Ford Kuga. It was doing 23mpg running around. He just about managed to get it up to 30mpg with a longer stint on an autobahn, driving sensibly. It was horrendous. Slow and terrible on fuel. Totally incorrect engine for such a car admittedly, but still blinkin' awful.
Wife has a 1.5 Ecoboost Kuga. It tends to return high 30's mpg, and i've had it as high as 46mpg on a run. Never seen it anywhere near as low as 23mpg. 0-60mph takes less than 10 seconds. Performance and economy is totally acceptable for a fairly large SUV.
unsprung said:
Some of the comments here -- about Ford, about small cars, about innovation -- are curious to say the least. A reordering of events that's not too far from, "Those bellicose Poles attacked our radio station in Gleiwitz."
Some facts:
- US consumers have abandoned classical hatches and saloons en masse, from most manufacturers (not just Ford)
- Most crossovers are simply tall cars; OEMs can shift easily from one to the other; they can also combine the two formats (Mustang SUV anyone?)
- Today's advanced ICE and ICE hybrid powertrains insulate consumers from most future-cost scenarios of petrol
- The traditional ownership model is being disrupted; consumers will be able to afford "more" car and/or transport that reduces total cost of ownership
- The business model of personal transportation is shifting; it is less about a transaction and more about recurring revenue
If you feel that Ford's decision applies to the US and not to Blighty or its neighbours on the Continent, think again. This is not about, "We like hot hatches and you like muscle-y three-box coupes."
It is more holistic than that. Ironically, one can argue that it has little to do with transportation.
Beautifully and elegantly put - this is it exactlySome facts:
- US consumers have abandoned classical hatches and saloons en masse, from most manufacturers (not just Ford)
- Most crossovers are simply tall cars; OEMs can shift easily from one to the other; they can also combine the two formats (Mustang SUV anyone?)
- Today's advanced ICE and ICE hybrid powertrains insulate consumers from most future-cost scenarios of petrol
- The traditional ownership model is being disrupted; consumers will be able to afford "more" car and/or transport that reduces total cost of ownership
- The business model of personal transportation is shifting; it is less about a transaction and more about recurring revenue
If you feel that Ford's decision applies to the US and not to Blighty or its neighbours on the Continent, think again. This is not about, "We like hot hatches and you like muscle-y three-box coupes."
It is more holistic than that. Ironically, one can argue that it has little to do with transportation.
IanCress said:
Jon_S_Rally said:
I was in Germany recently and a friend was in a hire car - a 1.5-litre EcoBoost powered Ford Kuga. It was doing 23mpg running around. He just about managed to get it up to 30mpg with a longer stint on an autobahn, driving sensibly. It was horrendous. Slow and terrible on fuel. Totally incorrect engine for such a car admittedly, but still blinkin' awful.
Wife has a 1.5 Ecoboost Kuga. It tends to return high 30's mpg, and i've had it as high as 46mpg on a run. Never seen it anywhere near as low as 23mpg. 0-60mph takes less than 10 seconds. Performance and economy is totally acceptable for a fairly large SUV.
Jeep Wrangler outsells:
Honda Civic
Honda CR-V
Toyota Corolla
Nissan Rogue / Qashqai
Honda Accord
Ford Escape / Kuga
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/the-jeep-wrangle...
Sales volume nearly identical to Toyota Camry.
Honda Civic
Honda CR-V
Toyota Corolla
Nissan Rogue / Qashqai
Honda Accord
Ford Escape / Kuga
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/the-jeep-wrangle...
Sales volume nearly identical to Toyota Camry.
I drive frequently in the US and a couple of times a year take an 8,000km round trip to Arizona. The big difference is how utterly empty lots of the US actually is...endless lightly travelled highways, amazing back roads, no speed cameras and distances that go on forever.
I could not imagine using a hot hatch or a small car for this. Equally I can go West in Canada and to the Pacific , or East to the Atlantic, both thousands of miles.
Sometimes I tow.
Lots of people in the US enjoy road trip, and while there are pockets of congestions. ( I-405 in LA or Manhattan for instance) the number of traffic jams I hit is minuscule. Gas is cheap, so the lure of the open empty road is a reality.
People have moved to SUVs or the crossovers, which I admit I do not get, but I do understand the lack of appeal of small cars. Its a big country. A shot I took in Texas a few years ago....
or Northern California:
I could not imagine using a hot hatch or a small car for this. Equally I can go West in Canada and to the Pacific , or East to the Atlantic, both thousands of miles.
Sometimes I tow.
Lots of people in the US enjoy road trip, and while there are pockets of congestions. ( I-405 in LA or Manhattan for instance) the number of traffic jams I hit is minuscule. Gas is cheap, so the lure of the open empty road is a reality.
People have moved to SUVs or the crossovers, which I admit I do not get, but I do understand the lack of appeal of small cars. Its a big country. A shot I took in Texas a few years ago....
or Northern California:
Edited by RDMcG on Thursday 3rd May 16:42
The other thing I've really noticed, particularly in Miami where the rain can be biblical, is the gradient changes between, for example, the road and 'gas' station forecourts can be severe; completely impossible to drive over in a real sports car, and you'd grit your teeth in a sporty saloon running at a European road height. US saloons seem to run 30mm+ higher than ROW standard as it is, so the jump up to crossover isn't that big a leap.
fblm said:
The other thing I've really noticed, particularly in Miami where the rain can be biblical, is the gradient changes between, for example, the road and 'gas' station forecourts can be severe; completely impossible to drive over in a real sports car, and you'd grit your teeth in a sporty saloon running at a European road height. US saloons seem to run 30mm+ higher than ROW standard as it is, so the jump up to crossover isn't that big a leap.
And yet The Magic City is home to all manner of low-slung supercars from Europe. Miami Vice anyone?unsprung said:
And yet The Magic City is home to all manner of low-slung supercars from Europe. Miami Vice anyone?
I guess the speed they drive round SoBe is slow enough they can run with the suspension raised. 
Presumably if you live there you quickly figure out where you can and can't go without that excruciating cracking carbon sound.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff