RE: Ford Fiesta ST: Driven
Discussion
Sounds like the recipe hasn't changed too much and Quaife diff seems like a no brainer. But it seems the exterior team thought, Ah, more grown up? Let's make it look like the MPV at the rear.
1980kg sounds a bit heavy. But in serious what's the weight penalty if any of the new model? Suzuki got this part of the new version correct.
1980kg sounds a bit heavy. But in serious what's the weight penalty if any of the new model? Suzuki got this part of the new version correct.
anthonysjb said:
CheezyMcWeezy said:
1) the MK3 RS does everything the MK8 ST does but better
No, it doesn't. Driven both and Fiesta ST is so much more fun on a UK road. RS is 400kg heavier and it shows. RS is just a bit faster than a stage 2 ST.
Its going to be a fantastic little car, the old one is, it isnt going to be worse, not night and day better but the old one was that good it wasnt going to be.
People who buy them generally arent looking at the Focus RS, its an order of magnitude more expensive to buy and run, the Fiesta is more than enough car for a lot of folk.
And residuals wise, they don't seem to half after three years, a 2015 is still 11 grand or so, dont think anyone paid 22k for one, I think that 11 grand, plus a grand on a remap and some other goodies has a very capable, quick, fun car, I remember getting a shock in my 350Z from a Mountuned one.
People who buy them generally arent looking at the Focus RS, its an order of magnitude more expensive to buy and run, the Fiesta is more than enough car for a lot of folk.
And residuals wise, they don't seem to half after three years, a 2015 is still 11 grand or so, dont think anyone paid 22k for one, I think that 11 grand, plus a grand on a remap and some other goodies has a very capable, quick, fun car, I remember getting a shock in my 350Z from a Mountuned one.
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Ahbefive said:
The fiesta ST may be more fun pottering/nipping about around town (mk7) but at the limit the RS is way more fun. Where did you drive the RS? I'm assuming nowhere that you can even approach the limits as otherwise your opinion would be the reverse.
Fun is completely subjective so I don't know why you're attempting to talk with objective authority about which vehicle is better. Early reviews all seem to suggest the MK7 ST is more fun than the MK8 ST, enough of them to think it's likely to be correct (i.e. more than one bloke's opinion). So in terms of fun, MK7 ST > MK3 RS > MK8 ST.
Also what's the point of a car you have to be on the edge to enjoy, how often are you doing that? You talk dismissively of pottering/nipping about town as if you're talking about an Aygo.
Hilarious.
CheezyMcWeezy said:
Fun is completely subjective so I don't know why you're attempting to talk with objective authority about which vehicle is better. Early reviews all seem to suggest the MK7 ST is more fun than the MK8 ST, enough of them to think it's likely to be correct (i.e. more than one bloke's opinion).
So in terms of fun, MK7 ST > MK3 RS > MK8 ST.
Also what's the point of a car you have to be on the edge to enjoy, how often are you doing that? You talk dismissively of pottering/nipping about town as if you're talking about an Aygo.
RS is the better car. People deluding themselves that the ST is better because they can't afford it, it's as simple as that. Tragic to see but true. Why buy an ST MK8 when you can pretty much get RS MK3 for same money now? So in terms of fun, MK7 ST > MK3 RS > MK8 ST.
Also what's the point of a car you have to be on the edge to enjoy, how often are you doing that? You talk dismissively of pottering/nipping about town as if you're talking about an Aygo.
DoreenWong said:
Why buy an ST MK8 when you can pretty much get RS MK3 for same money now?
Well a brand new Mk8 ST can be had for £18k. A 2 year old RS is £25k so that £7k difference may be a factor along with all the other reasons that for some people make a new car the more desirable choice.Ahbefive said:
Well a brand new Mk8 ST can be had for £18k. A 2 year old RS is £25k so that £7k difference may be a factor along with all the other reasons that for some people make a new car the more desirable choice.
Guff, complete guff. A half-decently specced ST2 or ST3 is coming in at around 22k even with discount. It'll be £10k at 3 years. An RS now will if anything go up over the next 3 years especially if you garage it. So are "CheezyMcWeezy" and "DoreenWong" the same person alternately agreeing/disagreeing with each other? Very weird. Regardless, thanks for ruining the thread on a car that I was very interested to find out more about and discuss with others. For the money, I would just go 996 Carrera/E92 M3... 
In all seriousness, the new Fiesta ST (or the mk7 for that matter) is a car that I would be potentially be very interested in buying. No need to spend 23k on one in my opinion. To be honest, I would be perfectly happy with an ST-1, possibly an ST-2, as so far from pictures, I prefer the look of the 5 door and possibly (although I could probably live without it, the Performance Package). That should still be a 20k car and I think for VFM on the new car market, that's pretty difficult to argue with, especially compared to Cooper S MINIs/Abarth 595 Competiziones etc. If the PCP/lease deals are decent then that ought to mitigate the depreciation somewhat.
I fully respect that you can get a Focus RS for 25k and it's a great car too but running costs are considerably higher (20mpg vs. 40mpg in the ST), there's still a question mark over the engine reliability (yes, it should be covered by warranty but how long will it be off the road?) and although some may see this as a disadvantage, the ST would blend in a bit more, whereas the RS is always going to attract attention (good or bad) and people trying to race you.
I also suspect that the ST might be more fun at lower speeds and that you can get closer to the limits on the road, whereas if you're driving an RS at 9/10 or 10/10 on the road, then you're driving like an idiot!
CheezyMcWeezy/DoreenWong or whoever you are, I get your argument about going for a faster, used alternative. I myself have thought about a used M car/AMG/RS/Porsche over a new/nearly new hot hatch but the spectre is the potential of a 4-figure repair bill and would I actually be having any more fun than in my Fiesta ST? A new 20k Fiesta ST makes perfect sense to me and I think at that price level, 5k more for a Focus RS would be quite a significant financial barrier to most.
In all seriousness, the new Fiesta ST (or the mk7 for that matter) is a car that I would be potentially be very interested in buying. No need to spend 23k on one in my opinion. To be honest, I would be perfectly happy with an ST-1, possibly an ST-2, as so far from pictures, I prefer the look of the 5 door and possibly (although I could probably live without it, the Performance Package). That should still be a 20k car and I think for VFM on the new car market, that's pretty difficult to argue with, especially compared to Cooper S MINIs/Abarth 595 Competiziones etc. If the PCP/lease deals are decent then that ought to mitigate the depreciation somewhat.
I fully respect that you can get a Focus RS for 25k and it's a great car too but running costs are considerably higher (20mpg vs. 40mpg in the ST), there's still a question mark over the engine reliability (yes, it should be covered by warranty but how long will it be off the road?) and although some may see this as a disadvantage, the ST would blend in a bit more, whereas the RS is always going to attract attention (good or bad) and people trying to race you.
I also suspect that the ST might be more fun at lower speeds and that you can get closer to the limits on the road, whereas if you're driving an RS at 9/10 or 10/10 on the road, then you're driving like an idiot!
CheezyMcWeezy/DoreenWong or whoever you are, I get your argument about going for a faster, used alternative. I myself have thought about a used M car/AMG/RS/Porsche over a new/nearly new hot hatch but the spectre is the potential of a 4-figure repair bill and would I actually be having any more fun than in my Fiesta ST? A new 20k Fiesta ST makes perfect sense to me and I think at that price level, 5k more for a Focus RS would be quite a significant financial barrier to most.
CheezyMcWeezy said:
Guff, complete guff. A half-decently specced ST2 or ST3 is coming in at around 22k even with discount. It'll be £10k at 3 years. An RS now will if anything go up over the next 3 years especially if you garage it.
I never said anything about an ST2 or 3. An ST1 list price is £18995 and DTD can get it for less than that.Guff? Are you 12?
Edited by Ahbefive on Monday 14th May 21:27
DoreenWong said:
RS is the better car. People deluding themselves that the ST is better because they can't afford it, it's as simple as that. Tragic to see but true. Why buy an ST MK8 when you can pretty much get RS MK3 for same money now?
I'm sure this has been mentioned before and I haven't read the whole thread but comparing new to old is moronic.People don't tend to buy new cars outright in cash and therefore comparing actual price is a bit meaningless. Plus some people buy new for various reasons which are too obvious to repeat here.
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