RE: The ?100k Sagaris: Spotted

[Clockwork Cupcake]

borat52 said:

I'm not disagreeing with you as a new purchase, I'm just trying to highlight that the used market is motivated by different things.

Well, quite. Supply and demand, and all that.

You can say what you want about the Sagaris, but you can't deny that it is an appreciating asset rather than a depreciating one.

[anonymous-user]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

borat52 said:

I'm not disagreeing with you as a new purchase, I'm just trying to highlight that the used market is motivated by different things.

Well, quite. Supply and demand, and all that.

You can say what you want about the Sagaris, but you can't deny that it is an appreciating asset rather than a depreciating one.

Yes. I mean people don’t seem to have a problem with a 1970’s 911 costing upwards of 250K?

[Zippee]

I can't complain about the 100k price tag on this Sag but it is IMHO in no way worth that.
They are nice cars, I've driven several and own a T350 but there are much nicer, more exotic cars out there for that price - Merc AMG GT anyone?
The Sag handles better than my 350, albeit only very slightly and to the layman on the road you don't really notice any different. Inside it really is identical to that of the T350 and seat/dash wise, the Tamora.
Engine, originally a 4.0 versus the 350/Tam 3.6. BUT a 4.3 in those 2 put power at an equal or better level. That leaves looks and I love the Sag but it's a little too extreme for me.
I'm not saying this as I own one, but more that I can't see 60 plus grand worth of difference between a T350 or Tamora based solely on the looks and slightly different handling characteristics. Yes, it was TVRs swansong but the other cars were also made pretty much to the end, there being Tams, Tuscans & 350s registered right up till 06.

[swisstoni]

Zippee said:

I can't see 60 plus grand worth of difference between a T350 or Tamora based solely on the looks and slightly different handling characteristics. Yes, it was TVRs swansong but the other cars were also made pretty much to the end, there being Tams, Tuscans & 350s registered right up till 06.

I agree with what you say and have said pretty much the same thing in this thread.

But (and strap in for this one) nobody cares! The simple fact is that perfect versions of the Sagaris are finding homes for on or close to £100k.

We can noodle on all we like about the car's merits or otherwise; doesn't matter. Doesn't matter to classic Porsche, Escort buyers either.

[Don1]

[redacted]

[Zippee]

swisstoni said:

I agree with what you say and have said pretty much the same thing in this thread.

But (and strap in for this one) nobody cares! The simple fact is that perfect versions of the Sagaris are finding homes for on or close to £100k.

We can noodle on all we like about the car's merits or otherwise; doesn't matter. Doesn't matter to classic Porsche, Escort buyers either.

I know - all was IMHO. Personally I couldn't care less how people spend their money, I just don't see the justification myself.

[J4CKO]

[redacted]

[pdj81]

Parkway literally are the biggest speculators out there - literally dreaming up prices on most of the stock, nice example but never in a million years worth that money. Impeccable service history... 4 fluid changes in its life... lol a true example of where 5 years of future classic growth has got us and now significantly halted.

[Vitorio]

J4CKO said:

Am sure the Gallardo is better in most ways, but the TVR is way, way cooler. you dont see them being thrapped round town centres by sketchy looking geysers, not saying proper enthusiasts dont own Gallardos as plenty do and they are fantastic, but TVR's never seem to get the dodgy owners (or at least dodgy in different ways)

Does that matter though? The fact that lambos/Ferraris are also favoured by the less savoury occupied doesnt mean they arent the pinacle of sportscars

I like TVRs, especially the Sag, but 100K is just looney tunes money for one, unless you have some very specific reason to want a Sag, you cant tell me that the same money wont get more thrillls spent on other cars

[raceboy]

I think the mistake is thinking of these cars as actual 'cars', in order to command the halo speculator price tags they need to immaculate unused examples, no one is going to buy the Sag with 6000 miles on it for £100k pop it on their multicar policy and head off to Donington for a track day or two, it'll be trailed off to a nice heated unit popped in a Carcoon and forgot about for another 5 years, same as the 2000 mile £100k Mk3 Escorts, they aren't being driven down to the local McD's, they are investments pure and simple, it's an ISA. a Pension Fund, an alternative to a buy to let, the dynamics of the car do not mater one bit.

Edited by raceboy on Friday 25th May 14:54

[Squirrelofwoe]

Vitorio said:

Does that matter though? The fact that lambos/Ferraris are also favoured by the less savoury occupied doesnt mean they arent the pinacle of sportscars

I like TVRs, especially the Sag, but 100K is just looney tunes money for one, unless you have some very specific reason to want a Sag, you cant tell me that the same money wont get more thrillls spent on other cars

Horses for courses.

My £100k would probably get spent on a top notch C Type replica / GT40 replica - both of which are probably significantly worse 'cars' than the Sag, but ever so slightly more desirable to me.

On the other hand, were it a straight choice between the Sag or a Gallardo, the Lamborghini may as well be a Ford Fiesta- purely because it does not illicit even the slightest stirring of emotion that leads to the irrational desire to own such things. The Sagaris does that in spades.

It might be looney tunes money, but if you want it more than anything else available at that price then it's a pretty moot point

[TR4man]

raceboy said:

I think the mistake is thinking of these cars as actual 'cars', in order to command the halo speculator price tags they need to immaculate unused examples, no one is going to buy the Sag with 6000 miles on it for £100k pop it on their multicar policy and head off to Donington for a track day or two, it'll be trailed off to a nice heated unit popped in a Carcoon and forgot about for another 5 years, same as the 2000 mile £100k Mk3 Escorts, they aren't being driven down to the local McD's, they are investments pure and simple, it's an ISA. a Pension Fund, an alternative to a buy to let, the dynamics of the car do not mater one bit.

Edited by raceboy on Friday 25th May 14:54

[Pat H]

[redacted]

[borat52]

raceboy said:

I think the mistake is thinking of these cars as actual 'cars', in order to command the halo speculator price tags they need to immaculate unused examples, no one is going to buy the Sag with 6000 miles on it for £100k pop it on their multicar policy and head off to Donington for a track day or two, it'll be trailed off to a nice heated unit popped in a Carcoon and forgot about for another 5 years, same as the 2000 mile £100k Mk3 Escorts, they aren't being driven down to the local McD's, they are investments pure and simple, it's an ISA. a Pension Fund, an alternative to a buy to let, the dynamics of the car do not mater one bit.

Edited by raceboy on Friday 25th May 14:54

Exactly this.

I do agree the 'investment' car market seems to be out of hand, and if the cheap money ends it will surely come crashing down but on the flip side at what point does a Sagaris price crash meet up with a queue of us willing to buy one of the remaining (160?) examples that find there way on to the market.

I personally don't see such a limited car ever going back to £20-30k in price. There are too many people who's snap your hands off at that money.

Something like a 10 year old gallardo would be impacted far more imho by a general downturn in the market if lending dries up and those who used to see equity growth in their house as a way of justifying an expensive car look towards house price stagnation/falls and curbing excesses.

[DeejRC]

Jonny TVR said:

Clockwork Cupcake said:

I'm not driving mine anywhere near as often as I used to.

It's a combination of factors, not least that driving on public roads in the South of England simply isn't any fun any more - way too many potholes, congestion, cyclists (when in Surrey), and people who furiously flash their lights when you dare to overtake (on the rare occasions where traffic is light enough for an overtake).

Living where I do in Devon there are some fantastic almost empty roads just a couple of miles from my home. Problem is the lanes out of my house are hideous and have to tip toe my fun cars out which takes ages. You still get the people however who furiously flash you for overtaking safely. You do get some people who are the opposite and love the cars.

You live in the wrong part of Devon Jonny
Round my bit the locals are the fastest drivers going and frankly anybody doing less than 70mph gets flashed to get a bloody move on!!

Oke to Holsworthy - great road

[so called]

TR4man said:

raceboy said:

I think the mistake is thinking of these cars as actual 'cars', in order to command the halo speculator price tags they need to immaculate unused examples, no one is going to buy the Sag with 6000 miles on it for £100k pop it on their multicar policy and head off to Donington for a track day or two, it'll be trailed off to a nice heated unit popped in a Carcoon and forgot about for another 5 years, same as the 2000 mile £100k Mk3 Escorts, they aren't being driven down to the local McD's, they are investments pure and simple, it's an ISA. a Pension Fund, an alternative to a buy to let, the dynamics of the car do not mater one bit.

Edited by raceboy on Friday 25th May 14:54

That said, and I agree in part, the link to the $300k Tuscan I posted earlier was certainly being used as whoever it was that paid that that much for it ended up smashing up the front end.