IOM TT 2018 Car Lap record run?
Discussion
Welshbeef said:
But different to a racing driver in one of those cars
True but the riders weren't racers either.Here''s a nice vid of a bikers view on an SLS.
https://youtu.be/HLm7WvIZxaI
Here's a review of 1000cc Sportsbikes so you can get a better understanding of their performance parameters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHs8AvUPoL0
wormus said:
Electro1980 said:
Something something F1 car something something bumps something something GT1 car something something bananas are clearly superior fruit for making apple pie.
You forgot the Porsche 919 and Audi A6 2.0, probably 2 of the fastest things on the planet. Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars.
If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected; the entire front or entire rear. Plus of course on a bike you're using the grip to balance, whereas a car balances itself due to having four contact patches. A bit of understeer on a bike due to loss of front grip risks lowsiding, whereas in a car it's not really an issue, and if it's just one wheel affected in a car (e.g. due to a bump) you may barely notice in a car.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected; the entire front or entire rear. Plus of course on a bike you're using the grip to balance, whereas a car balances itself due to having four contact patches. A bit of understeer on a bike due to loss of front grip risks lowsiding, whereas in a car it's not really an issue, and if it's just one wheel affected in a car (e.g. due to a bump) you may barely notice in a car.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
Edited by RobM77 on Thursday 22 August 09:56
RobM77 said:
Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars. If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
I'm surprised at this.. the lack of mass on a bike I would have thought would more likely skim over the bumps with the suspension travel taking the brunt Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
a 1300kg car hitting bumps with less?! suspension travel, in my head would be more likely to cause things to get unbalanced pretty quickly.
But again that's probably my odd inexperienced logic
likesachange said:
RobM77 said:
Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars. If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
I'm surprised at this.. the lack of mass on a bike I would have thought would more likely skim over the bumps with the suspension travel taking the brunt Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
a 1300kg car hitting bumps with less?! suspension travel, in my head would be more likely to cause things to get unbalanced pretty quickly.
But again that's probably my odd inexperienced logic
RobM77 said:
Yes, but this is an issue of inherent stability. Imagine how a one wheel bump affects a car and then think about a bike.
Maybe there is an element of the symmetry in a bike and the wheels being on center line? That the bump doesn't cause inbalance side to side?Not stating a fact, just wondering.
Hungrymc said:
Maybe there is an element of the symmetry in a bike and the wheels being on center line? That the bump doesn't cause inbalance side to side?
Not stating a fact, just wondering.
Yeah this also maybe true. There will be a bit of science behind it other than contact area.. Ive seen them bikes flat out over bumps on the rear wheel and they seem to handle them pretty well.. or at least the rider does. Not stating a fact, just wondering.
RobM77 said:
likesachange said:
RobM77 said:
Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars. If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
I'm surprised at this.. the lack of mass on a bike I would have thought would more likely skim over the bumps with the suspension travel taking the brunt Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
a 1300kg car hitting bumps with less?! suspension travel, in my head would be more likely to cause things to get unbalanced pretty quickly.
But again that's probably my odd inexperienced logic
ZX10R NIN said:
wormus said:
I was reading yesterday how Dean Harrison’s ZX10 super bike still has a standard showroom frame. Pretty impressive.
Yes pretty much all the racers use the standard frames as the WSB/BSB versions are to stiff which causes no end of issues.warch said:
RobM77 said:
likesachange said:
RobM77 said:
Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars. If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
I'm surprised at this.. the lack of mass on a bike I would have thought would more likely skim over the bumps with the suspension travel taking the brunt Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
a 1300kg car hitting bumps with less?! suspension travel, in my head would be more likely to cause things to get unbalanced pretty quickly.
But again that's probably my odd inexperienced logic
However, you’ve missed the key point from my explanation above. Cadwell’s mountain is a whole vehicle ‘bump’ (I.e. a jump); we’re talking about a one wheel bump in a corner - on a bike that’s the whole front or rear end affected, but in a car it’s only 50% of one end. Crucial difference.
Edited by RobM77 on Thursday 22 August 11:55
RobM77 said:
However, you’ve missed the key point from my explanation above. Cadwell’s mountain is a whole vehicle ‘bump’ (ie a jump); we’re talking about a one wheel bump in a corner - on a bike that’s the whole front or rear end affected, but in a car it’s only 50% of one end. Crucial difference between s
t yourself and barely notice.
S'ok I'm being deliberately facetious (as you're no doubt aware). In my experience hitting a bump with a bike usually affects both wheels, unless you're backing it in or something. And you are absolutely right that it can interfere with steering inputs and putting the power down. t yourself and barely notice. Edited by RobM77 on Thursday 22 August 11:39
Edited by RobM77 on Thursday 22 August 11:51
Against that I'd say that professional riders rarely seem to be the least bit bothered by bumps and dips and camber irregularities. I suspect a fair few use experience of the courses and circuits they ride to choose the smoothest line around a corner. Unlike myself (I've hit the same recessed drain about four in a row on the way home from work, with gonad crushing force).
likesachange said:
RobM77 said:
Bumps actually affect motorbikes far more than cars. If one wheel hits a bump on a bike, that's 50% of your contact patch affected.
Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
I'm surprised at this.. the lack of mass on a bike I would have thought would more likely skim over the bumps with the suspension travel taking the brunt Speak to any biker at the ring and all they can talk about are the scary bumps; most car drivers don't even notice them.
a 1300kg car hitting bumps with less?! suspension travel, in my head would be more likely to cause things to get unbalanced pretty quickly.
But again that's probably my odd inexperienced logic
To me the bigger problem is the angle the suspension is operating at when a bike encounters a bump mid corner. It's leaning well over and the shock is trying to bend the forks more than it is trying to compress the suspension. I'd imagine that presents more of a challenge than it does for a car.
kiseca said:
A bike leaning over in a corner doesn't have a lot of suspension travel available to deal with a vertical deflection, but I wouldn't think that matters much. How many bumps are they going to encounter on a road fit for racing that require full deflection in anything other than a formula car to deal with?
To me the bigger problem is the angle the suspension is operating at when a bike encounters a bump mid corner. It's leaning well over and the shock is trying to bend the forks more than it is trying to compress the suspension. I'd imagine that presents more of a challenge than it does for a car.
This image of talentless tv personality Guy Martin hard over, wheelieing and airborne springs to mind. It doesn't look like he's backed off much for that cornerTo me the bigger problem is the angle the suspension is operating at when a bike encounters a bump mid corner. It's leaning well over and the shock is trying to bend the forks more than it is trying to compress the suspension. I'd imagine that presents more of a challenge than it does for a car.
Edited by warch on Thursday 22 August 12:38
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