RE: BMW Z4 M40i prototype: Driven

[shalmaneser]

Is this going to be the first non-M BMW with a LSD for a while? Interesting to see they're bringing them back, presumably there won't be a Z4M in that case...

[Fishy Dave]

port13 said:

and who is gonna track a Z4 anyway?

Edited by port13 on Monday 4th June 08:47

Lots of people, I see them at most trackdays, there were four of them at Spa a couple of months back.

[McFarnsworth]

So let me get this straight:

It's about as heavy as the old one, despite the cloth roof.
It's down 50hp because of .... reasons?
It'll look about as ungainly as feared.
It's auto only, with flimsy plastic paddles to add insult to injury.
BMW persist with their sound symposer nonsense instead of actually making it sound good. (It's an inline 6, how hard could it be?)

But first impressions are positive because it's not too bad to drive, but not as good as an M2 which will be a 4 year old car by the time this thing launches.


With praise like that I can only imagine the queues outside of BMW dealerships once this goes on sale. They'll sell, like three of them no problem!

[E65Ross]

McFarnsworth said:

So let me get this straight:

It's about as heavy as the old one, despite the cloth roof.
It's down 50hp because of .... reasons?
It'll look about as ungainly as feared.
It's auto only, with flimsy plastic paddles to add insult to injury.
BMW persist with their sound symposer nonsense instead of actually making it sound good. (It's an inline 6, how hard could it be?)

But first impressions are positive because it's not too bad to drive, but not as good as an M2 which will be a 4 year old car by the time this thing launches.


With praise like that I can only imagine the queues outside of BMW dealerships once this goes on sale. They'll sell, like three of them no problem!

Not sure about the weight, bit of a weird one. Nothing wrong with automatic only, almost everyone would opt for this anyway as the market is so small for manuals these days. The 50bhp down, you've asked for reasons yet they're stated in the article. Looks are subjective. Some will like, some won't. I'm not sure about this car, but the noise of an M140i is really rather pleasant so don't knock it until you've witnessed it.

[SpudLink]

port13 said:

I actually do very much prefer metal roofs - just for the looks and the folding origami alone...

Call me a bad driver if you like, but I'm certainly not able to feel marginal differences in the handling department - and who is gonna track a Z4 anyway? If there ever was a car designed for a relaxed drive on a sunny day in California and not for Silverstone...

(actually I do believe that the fact that the Z-cars are designed to be cruisers stands at the base of the whole partnership: one sportier coupe in form of the Supra, one relaxing convertible) - and remember even James Bond did nothing but some nice little drives with wind in his hair in Z-cars - they are not supposed to be sportscars, go get an M2 or M4 for that!

Edited by port13 on Monday 4th June 08:47

It’s not unusual to see the 1st generation trackdays in coupe guise. It acquits itself very well.
BMW seem to have pitched the original Z4 between sports car and California cruiser. The coupe between sports car and GT. I don’t think that’s a bad thing, because it almost has its own niche in the market.
The 2nd generation moved the balance more towards cruiser, which is a shame for the ‘Ultimate Driving Machine’. I would be happy for the new car to move back in the direction of sports car, or at least as much as legislation and market expectation will allow.

[SpudLink]

Fishy Dave said:

port13 said:

and who is gonna track a Z4 anyway?

Edited by port13 on Monday 4th June 08:47

Lots of people, I see them at most trackdays, there were four of them at Spa a couple of months back.

Yeah. What he said.

[Mike335i]

E65Ross said:

Nothing wrong with automatic only, almost everyone would opt for this anyway as the market is so small for manuals these days.

That's the problem for me, the car is developed to be a volume seller, not the car it could be.

[McFarnsworth]

I just summarized the article and wondered why the conclusion was that "first impressions were positive"

E65Ross said:

Nothing wrong with automatic only, almost everyone would opt for this anyway as the market is so small for manuals these days.

I understand why it's auto only, but I still think it's a shame as I am very much part of this small market.

E65Ross said:

The 50bhp down, you've asked for reasons yet they're stated in the article.

'A' reason was given, but very little explanation. 50bhp seems a lot for a particulate filter, diesels didn't drop that much when they added filters to those, so why does this? I'm assuming this will be the case for all future BMWs with this engine, so this does have me worried a bit.

E65Ross said:

I'm not sure about this car, but the noise of an M140i is really rather pleasant so don't knock it until you've witnessed it.

But is it the engine or the sound symposer making it sound not half bad? And if it's the engine, why does BMW bother adding cost and complexity with no real benefit when there's evidence of penny pinching all around in modern cars? I know it's a minor issue, but it still bothers me. (probably more than it should)

[MDMetal]

Mike335i said:

E65Ross said:

Nothing wrong with automatic only, almost everyone would opt for this anyway as the market is so small for manuals these days.

That's the problem for me, the car is developed to be a volume seller, not the car it could be.

BMW are a volume car seller, Even the M's are fairly high volume, maybe there's a market for a manual M version but I'm doubting it.

It's great that people love cars but nobody in the BMW boardroom is sat there looking at the risk and investment in manuals arguing about the 3% that would buy it, they'll buy something else instead. The ownership figures don't lie and a tiny fraction of people choose manuals and I'll wager those are people with more than 1 car which is a small market, most people are investing in a single semi practical car and it's got to tick those boxes. BMW are not there to actually create the ultimate driving machine, that's a PR tag line, other companies actually occupy those spaces but they shot down for not having the interior trim level of a BMW.

[Mike335i]

MDMetal said:

Mike335i said:

E65Ross said:

Nothing wrong with automatic only, almost everyone would opt for this anyway as the market is so small for manuals these days.

That's the problem for me, the car is developed to be a volume seller, not the car it could be.

BMW are a volume car seller, Even the M's are fairly high volume, maybe there's a market for a manual M version but I'm doubting it.

It's great that people love cars but nobody in the BMW boardroom is sat there looking at the risk and investment in manuals arguing about the 3% that would buy it, they'll buy something else instead. The ownership figures don't lie and a tiny fraction of people choose manuals and I'll wager those are people with more than 1 car which is a small market, most people are investing in a single semi practical car and it's got to tick those boxes. BMW are not there to actually create the ultimate driving machine, that's a PR tag line, other companies actually occupy those spaces but they shot down for not having the interior trim level of a BMW.

I get all that and I'm not disputing it, but it doesn't stop it being a shame that the small sports car can't escape the volume seller demands. Given how many volume selling models they now have, its a shame that there is precious little left for the actual enthusiast. That is across the board, not just BMW.

[ChezzaV8]

Hmmm, I think I'll stick with my Z3M. Much lighter, similar power, no traction control, manual gearbox, hydraulic steering, and a mechanical LSD. None of this nannying nonsense, just drive it....sideways!

Edited by ChezzaV8 on Monday 4th June 13:43

[Limpet]

McFarnsworth said:

But is it the engine or the sound symposer making it sound not half bad? And if it's the engine, why does BMW bother adding cost and complexity with no real benefit when there's evidence of penny pinching all around in modern cars? I know it's a minor issue, but it still bothers me. (probably more than it should)

The M140i sounds superb from outside (if a little quiet), so despite undoubtedly artificial 'enhancement', it does make a decent noise in its own right.

The six pot engine (and RWD) is the car's USP, and as pretty much all 3, 4 and 6 pot petrol BMW non-M cars now use essentially the same modular engine family with up to 50% parts sharing, and the whole family of engines is used across the wider range, the additional cost is not as high as it might otherwise be.

It's a shame the new version will be a "me too" 4 pot AWD job. The silky smoothness of the six really sets the current car apart, IMHO.

Edited by Limpet on Monday 4th June 14:08

[atacama]

Can’t help but wonder if this no manual gearbox info is just bluster - there were some pretty convincing spy shots showing a manual installed in a prototype: http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/05/23/2019-bmw-z4-spys...

[McFarnsworth]

atacama said:

Can’t help but wonder if this no manual gearbox info is just bluster - there were some pretty convincing spy shots showing a manual installed in a prototype: http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/05/23/2019-bmw-z4-spys...

Maybe there's a manual available in the lower powered version(s), but not the 40i?

[Mike335i]

McFarnsworth said:

atacama said:

Can’t help but wonder if this no manual gearbox info is just bluster - there were some pretty convincing spy shots showing a manual installed in a prototype: http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/05/23/2019-bmw-z4-spys...

Maybe there's a manual available in the lower powered version(s), but not the 40i?

That would be my fear.

[dibblecorse]

What a load of tripe, trotting out all the negative cliches you could find ..... how about you swop the badge to a Porky one and then rewrite it, bet its then a fantastical proposition that we should be queueing up to put deposits on before the flippers realise what a weapon it is ....

PH Where Dross Is Published

[kambites]

McFarnsworth said:

atacama said:

Can’t help but wonder if this no manual gearbox info is just bluster - there were some pretty convincing spy shots showing a manual installed in a prototype: http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/05/23/2019-bmw-z4-spys...

Maybe there's a manual available in the lower powered version(s), but not the 40i?

Or in other markets. Wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer had offered manuals only in LHD cars.

[Mike335i]

kambites said:

McFarnsworth said:

atacama said:

Can’t help but wonder if this no manual gearbox info is just bluster - there were some pretty convincing spy shots showing a manual installed in a prototype: http://www.bmwblog.com/2017/05/23/2019-bmw-z4-spys...

Maybe there's a manual available in the lower powered version(s), but not the 40i?

Or in other markets. Wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer had offered manuals only in LHD cars.

US spec E60 M5 springs to mind, as does the LHD Alfa Guilia.

[WJNB]

Merely a 2 seater 4 Series that will mess your hair. Big deal - poor effort.

[unpc]

Those proportions don't do it any favours and I'm not buying the pedestrian safety guff. Plenty of modern stuff meets those regs yet don't have overhangs like that.


Also surprised by the folding metal roof love-in going on in here. I always thought they were a st idea and I'm glad they have been almost universally dumped.