RE: Lancia Delta HF Integrale 8V: Spotted

[M666 EVO]

Max_Torque said:

M666 EVO said:

British Beef said:

Even the Evo Integrale would struggle to keep up with a Fiesta St on twisty roads such is hatch back progression.

Wow. You clearly haven't driven an EVO.

And you're clearly a bit biased!

A std Evo integrale gets pasted by a Fiesta ST these days. The Evo had a claim 220bhp, but if it makes that (and i'm going to suggest most don't) they make it up at 6500rpm and don't come on boost till around 4000. The fiesta makes everyone of it's claimed bhp (and possibly a few more thanks to modern CoP requirements) makes more torque, at a lower rpm, is lighter, is massively stiffer and handles better, has much more grip and 30+ years of suspension development. Fact is, the 'grale is an icon for good reason, but like most icons, it's time has now passed....

I am genuinely impressed a Ford Fiesta ST with 179bhp and 0-60 time of 6.7 can paste an EVO with 220bhp and 0.60 time of 5.5 seconds.

[Never you mind]

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

[jamies30]

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

It's Alfa Romeo SZ vs. Audi A4 diesel on another thread, too. I despair.

[Never you mind]

jamies30 said:

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

It's Alfa Romeo SZ vs. Audi A4 diesel on another thread, too. I despair.

That's just fking stupid.

[J4CKO]

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

I think the Fiesta ST looks good, not as pretty as an Integrale but we are talking hatchback here, not 250 GTO's and Muiras.

I do think we over eulogise old stuff, its how religions start, we have been told its a pretty ropey shell with more power than it was designed for, plus its Italian, and old.

Not sure why we have to slag of the Fiesta because its comparatively new, realistically how much better is an old Integrale to drive if its flopping about the place, only packing 185 bhp if it still has its full compliment and this example possibly hiding all manner of expensive nasties, can get a Fiat Coupe with that engine (well the sixteen valve one anyway) in for £1500 and get some of the experience.

The Fiesta is a modern, stiff shell with an unbusrtable 1.6 turbo engine that is very tunable, it will run rings round one of these, but no fun comes from having something iconic, even if realistically, its actually a bit crap and breaks all the time.

Sometimes I do wonder whether we tend to gravitate to what we think we should say, I thoroughly enjoyed my go in one in 1991 (ish) as it was against a Manta GTE 25 years ago, but I am in no doubt that this one is a bit of an old woofer that would bankrupt me and not actually deliver more enjoyment than that Fiesta ST, pound for pound.



Would hold out for a proper 16 valve Evo one, pay fifty grand as part of a collection and not drive it much and get someone else to look after it.


this from the ad, speaks volumes,


Extremely rare vehicle. There are only 147 of these vehicles left in UK, 35 Licensed and 112 Sorn. Check for yourself at HOWMANYLEFT.

[unpc]

In my youthful stupidity I always had a hankering for one of these and was intending to move on up from my Delta HF Turbo but I ever did for some reason. After reading this I'm glad I didn't as the HF was bad enough and hideously unreliable. It's party piece was leaving the instrument panel in your lap after a full bore start.

[Never you mind]

J4CKO said:

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

I think the Fiesta ST looks good, not as pretty as an Integrale but we are talking hatchback here, not 250 GTO's and Muiras.

I do think we over eulogise old stuff, its how religions start, we have been told its a pretty ropey shell with more power than it was designed for, plus its Italian, and old.

Not sure why we have to slag of the Fiesta because its comparatively new, realistically how much better is an old Integrale to drive if its flopping about the place, only packing 185 bhp if it still has its full compliment and this example possibly hiding all manner of expensive nasties, can get a Fiat Coupe with that engine (well the sixteen valve one anyway) in for £1500 and get some of the experience.

The Fiesta is a modern, stiff shell with an unbusrtable 1.6 turbo engine that is very tunable, it will run rings round one of these, but no fun comes from having something iconic, even if realistically, its actually a bit crap and breaks all the time.

Sometimes I do wonder whether we tend to gravitate to what we think we should say, I thoroughly enjoyed my go in one in 1991 (ish) as it was against a Manta GTE 25 years ago, but I am in no doubt that this one is a bit of an old woofer that would bankrupt me and not actually deliver more enjoyment than that Fiesta ST, pound for pound.



Would hold out for a proper 16 valve Evo one, pay fifty grand as part of a collection and not drive it much and get someone else to look after it.


this from the ad, speaks volumes,


Extremely rare vehicle. There are only 147 of these vehicles left in UK, 35 Licensed and 112 Sorn. Check for yourself at HOWMANYLEFT.

I get what your saying but lets not compare old stuff to new stuff. 50K will get your a lovely Lotus Cortina which in all honesty isn't that fast these days, will grumble and complain on the odd day and might even need constant tinkering. 50K will also get you R8 which will be usable everyday, will run rings round the Cortina and there is a very high chance won't let you down. But there is something special in owning a classic that I am just beginning to get that goes way beyond the speed and handling of owning modern stuff.

So comparing this old car to a Fiesta ST isn't very fair and not even a good comparison. Maybe compare it to an Astra GTE or something.

[J4CKO]

Never you mind said:

J4CKO said:

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

I think the Fiesta ST looks good, not as pretty as an Integrale but we are talking hatchback here, not 250 GTO's and Muiras.

I do think we over eulogise old stuff, its how religions start, we have been told its a pretty ropey shell with more power than it was designed for, plus its Italian, and old.

Not sure why we have to slag of the Fiesta because its comparatively new, realistically how much better is an old Integrale to drive if its flopping about the place, only packing 185 bhp if it still has its full compliment and this example possibly hiding all manner of expensive nasties, can get a Fiat Coupe with that engine (well the sixteen valve one anyway) in for £1500 and get some of the experience.

The Fiesta is a modern, stiff shell with an unbusrtable 1.6 turbo engine that is very tunable, it will run rings round one of these, but no fun comes from having something iconic, even if realistically, its actually a bit crap and breaks all the time.

Sometimes I do wonder whether we tend to gravitate to what we think we should say, I thoroughly enjoyed my go in one in 1991 (ish) as it was against a Manta GTE 25 years ago, but I am in no doubt that this one is a bit of an old woofer that would bankrupt me and not actually deliver more enjoyment than that Fiesta ST, pound for pound.



Would hold out for a proper 16 valve Evo one, pay fifty grand as part of a collection and not drive it much and get someone else to look after it.


this from the ad, speaks volumes,


Extremely rare vehicle. There are only 147 of these vehicles left in UK, 35 Licensed and 112 Sorn. Check for yourself at HOWMANYLEFT.

I get what your saying but lets not compare old stuff to new stuff. 50K will get your a lovely Lotus Cortina which in all honesty isn't that fast these days, will grumble and complain on the odd day and might even need constant tinkering. 50K will also get you R8 which will be usable everyday, will run rings round the Cortina and there is a very high chance won't let you down. But there is something special in owning a classic that I am just beginning to get that goes way beyond the speed and handling of owning modern stuff.

So comparing this old car to a Fiesta ST isn't very fair and not even a good comparison. Maybe compare it to an Astra GTE or something.

I compared it to a Manta

What you are buying is rarity, the iconic nature and being part of a fairly exclusive club, also helps that they look good and a good one, on a good day is quite good fun, as a car its a bit rubbish in most ways but you probably arent buying it for normal duties.

I have decided that classics are a bit like snow, you wish for it and it seems like a fantastic idea, when it happens there is some joy but it quickly becomes apparent that it isnt that often and not for long, rest of the time its a pain in the arse.

You have to excuse me, I am off old cars after my TT, 944 S2, Fiat 500s etc, all generally more agro than they were worth.

[Jon_S_Rally]

Amazes me that people can't let go of the new/old comparisons. Utterly ridiculous. Just because one particular type of car is 'better' doesn't mean it is more desirable.

Anyway, moving on from the usual silliness. £18k is a lot, especially if it's in need of work. I personally wouldn't spend £18k of my money on an 8v Integrale but I can absolutely see why some would. A friend of mine has an HF 4WD rally car and it's just a fabulous thing. Has all the Martini graphics so it looks exactly like you want a Delta rally car to look and, even though it obviously isn't that fast by modern standards, the noise it makes, the way it delivers its power in the typical '80s turbo way, it's just brilliant in my eyes.

Not something I would own myself but I can definitely see the appeal and I love that it exists.

[SlimJim16v]

The integrale frequently features in magazine articles about the greatest cars ever made. Sometimes it even comes first.

[AER]

SlimJim16v said:

The integrale frequently features in magazine articles about the greatest cars ever made. Sometimes it even comes first.

i

It also features in lots of classic issues too . I don't know why we're comparing these newfangled magazines to the older classic issues of yore. They were clearly superior and the pages handled much better...

[SlimJim16v]

AER said:

It also features in lots of classic issues too . I don't know why we're comparing these newfangled magazines to the older classic issues of yore. They were clearly superior and the pages handled much better...

[sledge68]

I despair, apparently a Golf R will show the 30 year old integrale a clean pair of heels, who would of thought eh?

Apparently an Aventador will leave a Muira for dead, I don't believe it myself.

And I am sure the Fiesta STis a fine car and will run and run, but when you are leaving Gaydon Motor Museum in a red Evo 1 integrale or a Fiesta ST ( and I've had this ) would people be leaning out of other cars on the motorway to take a picture of the integrale or the Fiesta on the way home? ( I actually left the motorway as was concerned for the number of people leaning out of cars and their safety.)

Its not the fastest by modern standards, however as my dads Morris Minor struggles in modern traffic the integrale never did.

You buy these cars to experience the car and way it drives, be temperamental, old style boost ( a new intercooler can improve boost so it comes on at 2500rpm till the red line, I had this done to mine but as we know some cars that spool up quick also run out of puff at high revs, the Lancia didn't).

If a Fiesta ST can stay with me on a country road then so be it, I am not fussed, its a newer car with newer electronics etc, why wouldn't it keep up.

We all get our "fizz" from different inputs.

Could you drive to a car show near Petersfield on a Sunday, just to have a look, and come away in the Fiesta with 2nd place even though you didn't enter the competition?

You buy this and other retro cars with your heart, not for pub bragging rights.

We are all entitled to our opinions , but to rubbish another's persons viewpoint by saying a 30 year newer or even 10 years newer car is better, is surely clutching at straws.

Looking at the prices of Evo2s, this early one seems reasonable to me, but that's my opinion.

Never you mind said:

I am genuinely impressed that people are comparing a Lancia Delta ( a car older than a fair few on here) to a modern crap looking Fiesta.

[culpz]

I remember my mate in work telling me that he once got absolutely blitzed by one of these but didn't really have a clue what it was at the time. I can't quite remember what car he was driving then but he's had all sorts of stuff over the years. He was pretty gob-smacked though. He said it just left him standing.

[sledge68]

On one of my Sunday morning run outs in my integrale my mirrors were suddenly full of a Audi Quattro, so the inevitable happened on a country road, it was 6.30am so no one about.
We stopped and chatted, his was a RR so similar age to my 1991 Evo1, ( mine was in standard BHP at the time) he admitted he could not stay with me.
Today both are not considered fast but the way they make you feel its what's important.

culpz said:

I remember my mate in work telling me that he once got absolutely blitzed by one of these but didn't really have a clue what it was at the time. I can't quite remember what car he was driving then but he's had all sorts of stuff over the years. He was pretty gob-smacked though. He said it just left him standing.

[Behemoth]

And then there's the noise. They sound wonderful out of the box, stock. No Capristos & Larinis or valve fakery necessary.