RE: Alfa Romeo SZ: Spotted
Discussion
Ultrafunkula said:
What an amazing car, always loved these when I was younger. I saw one on the M4 about 20 years ago, it certainly stood out but I've only ever seen red ones.
Yeah, me and my closest pals love these. They only came in red apart from one black one which was for Fiat management but can't remember if it was for Gianni Agnielli or someone else. I've also seen a RHD conversion which was really well done and I think it was resprayed in a dark metallic red but my memory may be a tad hazy about that. The RZ Convertible was made in red, yellow and black though.These were/are great handling cars and those who are talking about the acceleration may not have taken into account that the gearchange isn't the best around as based on Alfa 75 mechanicals.
These were around the £20-25K mark for quite some time and they've crept up all of a sudden.
Helicopter123 said:
Quite interesting to note as well that these were 911 money when new, at £35k+.
That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
Very true but I guess that is was due to the exotic materials it was made from especially as these were produced during 1989 to 1992 I believe?That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
viggyp said:
Helicopter123 said:
Quite interesting to note as well that these were 911 money when new, at £35k+.
That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
Very true but I guess that is was due to the exotic materials it was made from especially as these were produced during 1989 to 1992 I believe?That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
Helicopter123 said:
viggyp said:
Helicopter123 said:
Quite interesting to note as well that these were 911 money when new, at £35k+.
That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
Very true but I guess that is was due to the exotic materials it was made from especially as these were produced during 1989 to 1992 I believe?That's £5k more than a Lotus Esprit Turbo of the day.
Against these alternatives, the SZ was very slow indeed. Yes it had other qualities, but pace was not one of them.
Agree re the investment potential.
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
The RX7 turbo that was current when the SZ was launched had 200bhp. It was cheaper but offered identical straightline performance to the SZ....the gen 3 RX7 Turbo wouldn't arrive till 2 years later
s m said:
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
The RX7 turbo that was current when the SZ was launched had 200bhp. It was cheaper but offered identical straightline performance to the SZ....the gen 3 RX7 Turbo wouldn't arrive till 2 years later
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
The RX7 turbo that was current when the SZ was launched had 200bhp. It was cheaper but offered identical straightline performance to the SZ....the gen 3 RX7 Turbo wouldn't arrive till 2 years later
However, they did pick the SZ over the M3 that day and regards being a fair bit quicker ....maybe off the lights but they had this to say re the M3 and SZ once on the move
".....drive the M3 round a track with the Alfa SZ behind and the message is clear. While you are fighting to keep the nose pointing even vaguely in the chosen direction of travel, the chap waiting to get by is combing his hair..."
Checked the price of the Merc EVO 2 with 235bhp as well - hefty £55k - but a limited edition like the Alfa and M3 in a late 1990 Autocar. Merc claimed 0-62mph in 7.1 so 60 a smidge under 7 you'd say ) and 155 top end. Very similar claims to the Alfa albeit the Merc was heavier than both the BMW and Alfa, not faster than the BMW on track though
Interestingly in the same 1990 issue they had perhaps another closer competitor, the Renault Alpine GTA LE Mans, the limited edition special of the Turbo
£37 grand worth of rwd 2-seater with presence
As timed below, 0.1 of a second faster than the Alfa and slightly less top end
Granted, there were faster cars about but the Alfa doesn't look painfully slow compared to those three.
There weren't really any naturally aspirated 210bhp 1200kg - 1300kg cars that were substantially quicker off the lights at this price point. 0.5 of a second is not much at all imho - one fluffed change in either the M3 or Alfa and the other car would be away
Throw in some bends and you'd struggle to think of any n/a cars ...( bearing in mind the n/a 3litre 944 S2 with the same power - 210bhp - got beaten in terms of lap time by a Sapphire Cosworth on track too at a 1990 Handling Day )
In view of all that, I don't think the Alfa was particularly tardy.
Yes, it would have been quicker with an extra 50bhp but still not slow
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
woody33 said:
Helicopter123 said:
s m said:
Do people consider the RX7! Turbo, E30 M3 Evolution (220bhp )and Merc 190 EVolution 2 ( 235bhp ) slow cars ( in a straight line ) of their day (1990 ) as well ?
Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
I think you need to look at peer groups and compare.Just interested in the perception.
I know the modern day GT86 is seen as slow nowadays but the SZ seems to have a wodge more performance than that......back 28 years ago?
SZ was 911 money new and just under 7 seconds to 60.
RX7 would have been a fraction of that to buy new yet just over 5 seconds to 60. That's brisk even today, and for the money huge bang for your buck back in the day.
I went back and checked, and guess what, it wasn't.
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