Dumb question - when do you use N in an auto?
Discussion
hyphen said:
Wills2 said:
Pommy said:
Bloody hell just leave it in D and foot on the brake when stopped.
All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
Agreed, what farce over nothing. All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
And light bulbs are always a b
h to change, so the less used the better 
Wills2 said:
hyphen said:
Wills2 said:
Pommy said:
Bloody hell just leave it in D and foot on the brake when stopped.
All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
Agreed, what farce over nothing. All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
And light bulbs are always a b
h to change, so the less used the better Mine wear out frequently but then i turn them on and off when im stationary at traffic lights at night - its much more efficient on the battery .
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
My torque converter auto uses about half as much fuel at idle in N as D, also the idle is a bit quieter. So I tend to knock it to N if I'm stopped for more than a few seconds.
I do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
What a load of bI do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
ks." if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time"
This is just nonsense.
What bits?
Half as much fuel in N as in D? What like half a pipettes drop worth.
Fuel - 0.2 gal/hr vs 0.4 gal/hr it works out to roughly £1/hr difference when idling in my car, not that I'd bothered to work it out prior to the arrival of your curmudgeonliness, I just like to think about what I'm doing when I'm driving, I can get pleasure from driving efficiently just as I can from stringing a good set of corners together, which when you follow it through often ends up being the same thing.
I thought the use of the word b
ks was a bit strong for an opening argument, especially one with as little substance as yours.ks because youre asserting some sort of truth over random guessed factsIts worth pointing put that youre presuming someone who doesnt use their handbrake in an auto also doesnt use it when they stop the journey fully and turn off their car. This conversation was purely about stopping temporarily and putting it on.
'Most' cars (and i give credence to it of course varies) use about 0.7L/hr when idling or about 0.15 Gallons and this might be at 500-850 rpm. When Auto are in D but sat still, guess what, they arent at DOUBLE the idle rpm.
Most of my Autos, and have had a fair few, generally idled around 500-850 rpm - they didnt start winding up to 1700 rpm in D whilst i was just sat on the brake.
There is nothing greatly efficient either time wise or economics wise about shifting from D to N to D. If anything youre probably putting extra wear on the mechanical moving parts of your gearbox.
So in summary:
You dont save any real money moving into Neutral when stood still
You spend more time undertaking an action than is needed.
Your handbrake wont rust out
Youll likely add a little but of extra wear on your gearbox
Youll achieve NOTHING.
Its jusy utter nonsense this assertion that this is 'the correct and efficient'way.
Edited by Pommy on Monday 23 July 00:05
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
My torque converter auto uses about half as much fuel at idle in N as D, also the idle is a bit quieter. So I tend to knock it to N if I'm stopped for more than a few seconds.
I do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
What a load of bI do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
ks." if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time"
This is just nonsense.
What bits?
Half as much fuel in N as in D? What like half a pipettes drop worth.
Fuel - 0.2 gal/hr vs 0.4 gal/hr it works out to roughly £1/hr difference when idling in my car, not that I'd bothered to work it out prior to the arrival of your curmudgeonliness, I just like to think about what I'm doing when I'm driving, I can get pleasure from driving efficiently just as I can from stringing a good set of corners together, which when you follow it through often ends up being the same thing.
I thought the use of the word b
ks was a bit strong for an opening argument, especially one with as little substance as yours.ks because youre asserting some sort of truth over random guessed factsIts worth pointing put that youre presuming someone who doesnt use their handbrake in an auto also doesnt use it when they stop the journey fully and turn off their car. This conversation was purely about stopping temporarily and putting it on.
'Most' cars (and i give credence to it of course varies) use about 0.7L/hr when idling or about 0.15 Gallons and this might be at 500-850 rpm. When Auto are in D but sat still, guess what, they arent at DOUBLE the idle rpm.
Most of my Autos, and have had a fair few, generally idled around 500-850 rpm - they didnt start winding up to 1700 rpm in D whilst i was just sat on the brake.
There is nothing greatly efficient either time wise or economics wise about shifting from D to N to D. If anything youre probably putting extra wear on the mechanical moving parts of your gearbox.
So in summary:
You dont save any real money moving into Neutral when stood still
You spend more time undertaking an action than is needed.
Your handbrake wont rust out
Youll likely add a little but of extra wear on your gearbox
Youll achieve NOTHING.
Its jusy utter nonsense this assertion that this is 'the correct and efficient'way.
Edited by Pommy on Monday 23 July 00:05
buggalugs said:
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
Pommy said:
buggalugs said:
My torque converter auto uses about half as much fuel at idle in N as D, also the idle is a bit quieter. So I tend to knock it to N if I'm stopped for more than a few seconds.
I do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
What a load of bI do the same as that other chap too when parking its N, handbrake on to take the strain then P, no point having strain through the drivetrain when they when to the trouble of putting bakes on the wheels, also if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time.
ks." if you never use the handbrake when the car's a few years old there's a fair change you'll end up having to replace bits at MOT time"
This is just nonsense.
What bits?
Half as much fuel in N as in D? What like half a pipettes drop worth.
Fuel - 0.2 gal/hr vs 0.4 gal/hr it works out to roughly £1/hr difference when idling in my car, not that I'd bothered to work it out prior to the arrival of your curmudgeonliness, I just like to think about what I'm doing when I'm driving, I can get pleasure from driving efficiently just as I can from stringing a good set of corners together, which when you follow it through often ends up being the same thing.
I thought the use of the word b
ks was a bit strong for an opening argument, especially one with as little substance as yours.ks because youre asserting some sort of truth over random guessed factsIts worth pointing put that youre presuming someone who doesnt use their handbrake in an auto also doesnt use it when they stop the journey fully and turn off their car. This conversation was purely about stopping temporarily and putting it on.
'Most' cars (and i give credence to it of course varies) use about 0.7L/hr when idling or about 0.15 Gallons and this might be at 500-850 rpm. When Auto are in D but sat still, guess what, they arent at DOUBLE the idle rpm.
Most of my Autos, and have had a fair few, generally idled around 500-850 rpm - they didnt start winding up to 1700 rpm in D whilst i was just sat on the brake.
There is nothing greatly efficient either time wise or economics wise about shifting from D to N to D. If anything youre probably putting extra wear on the mechanical moving parts of your gearbox.
So in summary:
You dont save any real money moving into Neutral when stood still
You spend more time undertaking an action than is needed.
Your handbrake wont rust out
Youll likely add a little but of extra wear on your gearbox
Youll achieve NOTHING.
Its jusy utter nonsense this assertion that this is 'the correct and efficient'way.
Edited by Pommy on Monday 23 July 00:05
Pommy said:
Wills2 said:
hyphen said:
Wills2 said:
Pommy said:
Bloody hell just leave it in D and foot on the brake when stopped.
All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
Agreed, what farce over nothing. All this ‘put it in N’ when stationary and handbrake on is a load of tosh
And light bulbs are always a b
h to change, so the less used the better Mine wear out frequently but then i turn them on and off when im stationary at traffic lights at night - its much more efficient on the battery .
vikingaero said:
Sealed for life automatic transmissions says the manufacturer - I'll continue to have a fluid change at xx,000 miles.
ZF, who manufacture the transmissions for BMW (and others), actually state they should have a fluid and filter change every 60,000 - 80,000 miles. BMW don't recommend any fluid and filter changing, but conceed that some owners insist on a sevice at 100,000 miles. Since ZF are the onces who make the 'boxes and know all the ins and outs, I'll go on their advice.
As for shifting between D and neutral when stationary, not really needed at traffic lights as they dont hold for long enough. I might occasionally do it when the engine is cold at the lights at the end of my road and I've just put the air con on, but really it's not required unless you want to keep the engine running while you are stationary, say while you are waiting for someone, or sitting stationary in a trafic jam. All that is happening is you are spinning the torque converter on the engine crank side, and the engine is under a bit of load from the viscous drag of the fluid. The fluid is cooled by heat exchangers (usualy circulating the oil through the radiator i.e. the engine coolant is being used to cool the trans oil). There isnt really much wear on any mechanical components.
Edited by thatdude on Wednesday 25th July 09:54
JimSuperSix said:
Yeah, I turn my lights off at night when driving if there's no traffic around as it saves wear and tear on the bulbs. I also remove the bulbs when I park the car and store them in a padded briefcase to avoid stress / vibration damage to the filaments. Check your brake pedal rubbers also, they wear out quicker if you use the brakes hard or wear abrasive shoes, so I always drive in rollerskates to lower the foot-to-pedal friction.
^ this.I just do what feels comfortable.
For all those above taking the piss about shifting to N to save fuel, it's just as ridiculous to state that shifting to N and back to D will cause the gearbox to wear out. Any studies to back that up?
My old Volvo suffers with creep very badly and I prefer to knock it into N if I'm going to be sat there for more than a few seconds.
Just what I prefer to do, and what I will continue to do.
For all those above taking the piss about shifting to N to save fuel, it's just as ridiculous to state that shifting to N and back to D will cause the gearbox to wear out. Any studies to back that up?
My old Volvo suffers with creep very badly and I prefer to knock it into N if I'm going to be sat there for more than a few seconds.
Just what I prefer to do, and what I will continue to do.
I have 245,000km on my Cayenne V8. About 50,000 towing.
I never use N. D at traffic lights, P if I am stopped for a longer period. Wear on gearbox nonexistent. I have had a dozen auto cars at least which have had over 100,000 km - no gearbox failures unlike my manual cars which have had occasional clutch replacements.
Auto boxes are pretty indestructible in my experience
M
I never use N. D at traffic lights, P if I am stopped for a longer period. Wear on gearbox nonexistent. I have had a dozen auto cars at least which have had over 100,000 km - no gearbox failures unlike my manual cars which have had occasional clutch replacements.
Auto boxes are pretty indestructible in my experience
M
RDMcG said:
I have 245,000km on my Cayenne V8. About 50,000 towing.
I never use N. D at traffic lights, P if I am stopped for a longer period. Wear on gearbox nonexistent. I have had a dozen auto cars at least which have had over 100,000 km - no gearbox failures unlike my manual cars which have had occasional clutch replacements.
Auto boxes are pretty indestructible in my experience
M
Luckily you never use N otherwise you would have got through numerous gearboxes, not mention all the elbow joint replacements you would have needed due to the excessive wear and tear on your arm when moving the gear selector and handbrake.I never use N. D at traffic lights, P if I am stopped for a longer period. Wear on gearbox nonexistent. I have had a dozen auto cars at least which have had over 100,000 km - no gearbox failures unlike my manual cars which have had occasional clutch replacements.
Auto boxes are pretty indestructible in my experience
M
A confession - not only do I often knock my auto gearbox into neutral at traffic lights, but I also do so in slow moving traffic so as to coast when the car's natural creeping speed is a bit quicker than the traffic is moving. Maybe this is why I need to replace my gearbox every six months.
30 years of driving Mercedes autos and have never changed a brake light bulb. Plenty of headlight bulbs though, but not a sidelight or indicator one. As regards the Neutral conundrum,if it is night and the road is flat I slip it into neutral as a courtesy to the driver behind. I tried the "hand brake" the other month only to find out it didn't work. Calipers possibly seized due to lack of use. The MOT man said it didn't matter because everyone just uses P anyway.
lowdrag said:
30 years of driving Mercedes autos and have never changed a brake light bulb. Plenty of headlight bulbs though, but not a sidelight or indicator one. As regards the Neutral conundrum,if it is night and the road is flat I slip it into neutral as a courtesy to the driver behind. I tried the "hand brake" the other month only to find out it didn't work. Calipers possibly seized due to lack of use. The MOT man said it didn't matter because everyone just uses P anyway.
I think you will find it does matter at MOT.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff