RE: Fancy a first gen Formula E car? Yours for ?1
Discussion
The newer cars are much more capable but it's quite possible these things will be seen very differently in future years, the first electric racing series first cars. How much is an F1 car from the first ever grand prix going to be worth now? I can see these as great future investment's not short term but long term. The individual stats are largely irrelevant
ks sake, the battery's flat again".Toltec said:
VitorioVeloce said:
And that is 12-17 laps of tracks which are specifically tailored to suit FE, so low speeds, no long straights and lots of energy recovery.
Im not sure it could even manage a lap of the nordschleiffe at full speed without running out of puff. 28 kWh of battery means it can do 280 kw, roughly 380bhp for 6 minutes. Even if it can recover a lot of power (where generation, storage and redeployment all take efficiency losses), im not sure if those figures add up.
It depends how you add it up, given the motor is 270bhp or around 200kW you seem to have used the wrong values.Im not sure it could even manage a lap of the nordschleiffe at full speed without running out of puff. 28 kWh of battery means it can do 280 kw, roughly 380bhp for 6 minutes. Even if it can recover a lot of power (where generation, storage and redeployment all take efficiency losses), im not sure if those figures add up.
So possibly 4 Laps of Silverstone. Ouch.
My biggest issue with Formula E isn’t the cars, its the circuits. Boring street circuits. Impossible to tell one from the other. Just flat roads with barricades.
Also, ‘manufacturer teams’ is a bit misleading when the cars are all the same. Manufacturers are in it because it’s cheap.
Also, ‘manufacturer teams’ is a bit misleading when the cars are all the same. Manufacturers are in it because it’s cheap.
RacerMike said:
I don't have that much of a problem with it (there's space in the world for both ICE and Electric motorsport). I am slightly frustrated by the constant marketing rubbish that's quoted about the technology in Formula E 'helping manufacturers develop technology for the road'. It couldn't be further from the truth....the FIA has placed so many arbitrary limits on things like battery size and power that the Battery Technology in FE is probably 5 years out of date. From what I've seen, there is virtually zero technology flow from Formula E to road cars....if anything it's the other way. The actual innovation is happening in OEMs and manufacturers of charging tech. There's very little you can learn from a 300bhp EV with a 28kWh battery and a 50kWh (may even be slower) diesel powered charger...
You'd hope the governing bodies would have learnt and allowed freedom in thew new electric Rally Cross, but yet again, we see overly restrictive silhouette style rules with virtually no breadth for innovation. It's a crazy state of affairs that an electric Formula Student car can be more impressive and technically interesting/challenging than full scale motorsport.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-NCH8ct24U
or here for the actual run where it breaks the overall world record for 0-100kph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annota...
The FIA can't allow a technology war to drive development at such a pace that performance starts to eclipse the halo categories (F1, WEC, WRC) so soon that they can't manage the inevitable decline and replacement of these at the rate they want.You'd hope the governing bodies would have learnt and allowed freedom in thew new electric Rally Cross, but yet again, we see overly restrictive silhouette style rules with virtually no breadth for innovation. It's a crazy state of affairs that an electric Formula Student car can be more impressive and technically interesting/challenging than full scale motorsport.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-NCH8ct24U
or here for the actual run where it breaks the overall world record for 0-100kph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annota...
Edited by RacerMike on Monday 20th August 12:27
G321 said:
Electric cars aren't allowed to enter hill climbs competetively as far as I know,
Damn! Did somebody tell VW? Before or after they broke the Pikes Peak hill climbing record?G321 said:
something to do with the fire risk of the batteries.
Makes sense. Batteries are a yoooge risk. As opposed to gallons of petrol, which, as we all know, doesn't burn at all.tr3a said:
Makes sense. Batteries are a yoooge risk. As opposed to gallons of petrol, which, as we all know, doesn't burn at all.
You can put petrol fires out, the lithium ion batteries used in these cars continue to burn for extended periods and can re ignite apparently. Clearly you're the expert though.... 
G321 said:
tr3a said:
Makes sense. Batteries are a yoooge risk. As opposed to gallons of petrol, which, as we all know, doesn't burn at all.
You can put petrol fires out, the lithium ion batteries used in these cars continue to burn for extended periods and can re ignite apparently. Clearly you're the expert though.... 
There was an article on Autosport yesterday concerning the new hybrid package coming in to BTCC in a few years time. They said that most motorsport associations are way behind schedule on regulations to cope with hybrid racers or full electric racers - notably the retraining of the apprpriate marshals and the recovery teams for cars that have stopped - are the cars safe to touch and handle without electrocution. Also refers to each venue having to have 43,000 litres of water for immediate deployment.
FE cars are not that fast and they've always disguised their lack of speed by racing on circuits without comparisons to other vehicles - except in testing at Donington, they were running the GP loop without any extra added chicanes, and the 2016-7 Formula E car driven by a driver of F1 calibre, with a manufacturers budget was 0.1s faster than a 2002 Monoposto F3 car driven by a ginger bloke called Chris - on a fraction of the budget.
FE cars are not that fast and they've always disguised their lack of speed by racing on circuits without comparisons to other vehicles - except in testing at Donington, they were running the GP loop without any extra added chicanes, and the 2016-7 Formula E car driven by a driver of F1 calibre, with a manufacturers budget was 0.1s faster than a 2002 Monoposto F3 car driven by a ginger bloke called Chris - on a fraction of the budget.
andrewcliffe said:
FE cars are not that fast and they've always disguised their lack of speed by racing on circuits without comparisons to other vehicles - except in testing at Donington, they were running the GP loop without any extra added chicanes, and the 2016-7 Formula E car driven by a driver of F1 calibre, with a manufacturers budget was 0.1s faster than a 2002 Monoposto F3 car driven by a ginger bloke called Chris - on a fraction of the budget.
I'm not sure they've "disguised" anything. Surely everyone who knows what Formula-E is, knows the cars aren't particularly quick as single-seaters go? I'm not sure quite how that matters though, they're not racing against other cars, they're racing against each other. andrewcliffe said:
There was an article on Autosport yesterday concerning the new hybrid package coming in to BTCC in a few years time. They said that most motorsport associations are way behind schedule on regulations to cope with hybrid racers or full electric racers - notably the retraining of the apprpriate marshals and the recovery teams for cars that have stopped - are the cars safe to touch and handle without electrocution. Also refers to each venue having to have 43,000 litres of water for immediate deployment.
This is an interesting point. I was wrong yesterday when I said that electric cars aren't allowed in hill climb competitions. They are according to the MSA blue book but it's the venues in some cases that don't allow them due to not having the infrastructure to cope if one of them did catch fireG321 said:
Electric cars aren't allowed to enter hill climbs competetively as far as I know, something to do with the fire risk of the batteries. Shelsley walsh recently had a formula E car go up the hill but it was for demonstration purposes only for that reason
Friends who run Curborough say the cost of the extra equipment needed to allow an electric car to run is far too high to make an electric class viable. threespires said:
Friends who run Curborough say the cost of the extra equipment needed to allow an electric car to run is far too high to make an electric class viable.
I can't imagine it'll be viable to keep cars with high-voltage electrical systems off them for too long or they'll basically not be allowing any modern road cars. What expensive stuff to FE and F1 have to deal with Lithium Ion battery fires? You only ever seem to see marshals with hand-held extinguishers on the TV.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 21st August 12:03
G321 said:
Electric cars aren't allowed to enter hill climbs competetively as far as I know, something to do with the fire risk of the batteries. Shelsley walsh recently had a formula E car go up the hill but it was for demonstration purposes only for that reason
How dumb is that? There must be at least as much risk having fuel pissing out of a home made petrol driven weird machine, or a 1920's race car where seatbelts were thought to be detrimental to safetyGassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff