RE: Mazda MX-5 2.0 (2019): Driven
Discussion
Some interesting and repetitive generalisation about the feeble 4 pot in the Mazda, BBR's full fat naturally aspirated iteration of the current Mazda SkyActive engine is actually quite a gem in my opinion. Some initial clever engine design by Mazda plus a bit of aftermarket work resulting in a punchy unit with superb low down torque and a nice free reving top end, and in a package that can readily deliver 40 mpg.
Feeble it is not, quite good a touring and with an abundance of character ... oh and nanny aids that can be turned off for real petrolheads :-)
Feeble it is not, quite good a touring and with an abundance of character ... oh and nanny aids that can be turned off for real petrolheads :-)
four vehicles in my house..........6 practical usable seats - no kids is a wonderful thing.God knows why this TVR man has such a pressing need to assert how incomparably wonderful his old chugger is . Look , we all love TVRs but they are not the answer to every question about sports cars. I am not for a moment saying my MX 5 is 'better' , yah boo sucks ,just different but really... mine does 300 miles plus on a tank ,looks like it has more boot space than the gas powered TVR and fits my ample frame just fine. And I don't have to wake the neighbours with the sound of my 58 year old Buick engine coughing into life .
V8 TVRs are pleasant enough things, but hardly the last word .
V8 TVRs are pleasant enough things, but hardly the last word .
I've owned two TVRs - and loved them. Great for what they are/were.
The Chim fell to bits however (and was old and hadn't been looked after)
The Griff500 was a thing of beauty, but the chassis dynamics are terrible.
I'd wager me in an Mx5 down a country road versus me in the Griff500 - I'd be much faster and a lot less close to imminent death (due to something falling off) in the Mazda.
This new car looks really rather good indeed. I love the styling of the 124 Abarth.........but this new MX5 has to be a contender if you were choosing a lightweight sports convertible at a very reasonably price point.
The Chim fell to bits however (and was old and hadn't been looked after)
The Griff500 was a thing of beauty, but the chassis dynamics are terrible.
I'd wager me in an Mx5 down a country road versus me in the Griff500 - I'd be much faster and a lot less close to imminent death (due to something falling off) in the Mazda.
This new car looks really rather good indeed. I love the styling of the 124 Abarth.........but this new MX5 has to be a contender if you were choosing a lightweight sports convertible at a very reasonably price point.
mike9009 said:
molineux1980 said:
I've much want for an MX5 since I sold my NA 3 years ago. This looks spot on.
Sadly 2 young kids and a new house means it's a pipe dream.
Maybe in the future......
Same here, not sure I could justify it to my missus and the two kids would constantly argue about who is coming with Dad! I suspect I will be in coupes (four seaters) for another ten years! Sadly 2 young kids and a new house means it's a pipe dream.
Maybe in the future......
Simon Owen said:
Some interesting and repetitive generalisation about the feeble 4 pot in the Mazda, BBR's full fat naturally aspirated iteration of the current Mazda SkyActive engine is actually quite a gem in my opinion. Some initial clever engine design by Mazda plus a bit of aftermarket work resulting in a punchy unit with superb low down torque and a nice free reving top end, and in a package that can readily deliver 40 mpg.
Feeble it is not, quite good a touring and with an abundance of character ... oh and nanny aids that can be turned off for real petrolheads :-)
I assume you mean this near £4,000 package, and that on top of your £20k Mazda?Feeble it is not, quite good a touring and with an abundance of character ... oh and nanny aids that can be turned off for real petrolheads :-)
http://www.bbrgti.com/product/bbr-mx-5-nc-super-22...
Feeble is of course a subjective term, I guess if your used to a standard MX5 then 175 ft/lbs is a proper rocket ship land, sadly when you're used to a car that weighs the same but serves up 25hp more and more importantly a whopping 263 ft/lbs of Mazda crushing torque... the for me the so called 'BBR full fat naturally aspirated iteration' is firmly placed in 'skin/rice pudding' territory I'm afraid.
Jam12321 said:
7K buys you a v6 conversion from rocketeer ltd for your mx5 which has a brand new jag aj30 crate motor and a lot of bespoke kit. That engine made 240bhp and 216lb/ft In the S type. Bit less torque and weight in the mx, so similar specs for a lot less money and pretty much guaranteed it will be more reliable than a chimera.
Still a bit down on torque, quite thirsty compared to my TVR no doubt, and clearly missing two cylinders plus a full 1,000cc of engine capacity, but granted we're getting a little bit closer Edited by Jam12321 on Friday 31st August 14:37
The reliability point is of course complete nonsense, I don't care what Racketeer will try to have you believe any such engine transplant is very invasive heart surgery and comes with way more detail and packaging challenges than you could ever appreciate, unless that is you've been around this type of practice for years. To get a car right in every detail respect take a huge amount of in depth development work, the idea of just slapping a different engine in there even if you've been told it's a properly engineered kit is pure fantasy, believe me when I say you're about to become a development engineer for the nest 2-3 years as you fight to get the thing right of your car.
£7k is also a lot of money to lay down on top of the price of buying the MX5 in the first place, I would also see that figure as a starting point because these things always have a habit of spiraling way beyond the original quoted conversion cost if you really want to do the job properly. Back in the real world I very much doubt you'll get much change out of £20k 'all in' by the time you've bought the donor car and addressed brakes, suspension and drivetrain properly to deliver genuine turn key product status which lets face it is a tuner car seldom achieves.
TVRs do have a reputation for unreliability but the truth is the expensive engine and drivetrain components in a Rover V8 Chimaera or Griffith is all bullet proof OEM developed engineering, just the wiring lets the cars down and that's easy and super cheap to resolve, but I admit it's not a car for someone afraid of picking up a screwdriver or resolving a poor earth or two. If you really think an MX5 with an engine transplant would be any different, I'm afraid to say you're verging delusional
The bottom line is choose either the so called 'BBR full fat naturally aspirated iteration' or the v6 conversion from Rocketeer Ltd, you need to accept you'll not come out of either project with change out of £20k, and in truth you'll probably spend a lot more, both will serve up a fuel bill that my duel fuel Chimaera with it's 48mpg average petrol equivalent (£0.11p a mile) simply laughs at
Following the conversion both will instantly become tuner/modified cars that will depreciate faster than may wish to admit to yourself, and here's the thing... both will still be considerably slower than my TVR
I call a 'FAIL' on every count from both MX5 hop up kits
wst said:
If you have a TVR and keep banging on about how fuel efficient it is, you've missed the point more than anyone else in humanity ever has.
Not really 
It's the real deal 'Cake & Eat It' full package of performance and cost effective fuel bills, all wrapped up in a back to basics truly connected drivers car that'll blow all these little Mazda MX5s into the weeds every time, even the tuned naturally aspirated ones or those with V6 transplants.
And it won't depreciate at all either!
My original point was and still is this new Mazda MX5 isn't really progress, it's a costly under-performing little thing that is way more expensive to fuel and will lose you thousands of pounds in depreciation during the period you own it.
How is that progress
Tvrs are pretty unreliable, no doubts there they are fairly renowned for it. My friends 4.0 had a fire in its fusebox in the passenger seat area. Luckily the car came with a fire extinguisher because tvr knew what they were selling! Luckily only cost a couple of grand to fix but ah well that's tvr for you.
Then he realised the chassis was corroding badly, the exhaust gaskets were failing and none of the dials inside worked.
You can organise a 10K drive in drive out conversion with rocketeer, why not have a look before talking rubbish about it? Mx5 brakes are well known to handle track work and can be upgraded with oem parts at a tiny cost, shocks might cost you upwards of £700 and the 6spd gearbox is the same as the turbocharged rx7 Your 20 grand 'estimate' is complete BS buddy.
So all in all cheaper, more reliable and probably likely to be just as quick in the real world and on track.
Don't get me wrong I love tvr and am working towards owning a cerbera when I can get the house sorted with a larger garage but I can at least appreciate another car and not just try to s
t all over it on an mx5 specific thread.
Honestly mate, why cant you let people appreciate what they want to?
Then he realised the chassis was corroding badly, the exhaust gaskets were failing and none of the dials inside worked.
You can organise a 10K drive in drive out conversion with rocketeer, why not have a look before talking rubbish about it? Mx5 brakes are well known to handle track work and can be upgraded with oem parts at a tiny cost, shocks might cost you upwards of £700 and the 6spd gearbox is the same as the turbocharged rx7 Your 20 grand 'estimate' is complete BS buddy.
So all in all cheaper, more reliable and probably likely to be just as quick in the real world and on track.
Don't get me wrong I love tvr and am working towards owning a cerbera when I can get the house sorted with a larger garage but I can at least appreciate another car and not just try to s
t all over it on an mx5 specific thread. Honestly mate, why cant you let people appreciate what they want to?
ChimpOnGas said:
Still a bit down on torque, quite thirsty compared to my TVR no doubt, and clearly missing two cylinders plus a full 1,000cc of engine capacity, but granted we're getting a little bit closer The reliability point is of course complete nonsense, I don't care what Racketeer will try to have you believe any such engine transplant is very invasive heart surgery and comes with way more detail and packaging challenges than you could ever appreciate, unless that is you've been around this type of practice for years.
To get a car right in every detail respect take a huge amount of in depth development work, the idea of just slapping a different engine in there even if you've been told it's a properly engineered kit is pure fantasy, believe me when I say you're about to become a development engineer for the nest 2-3 years as you fight to get the thing right of your car.
£7k is also a lot of money to lay down on top of the price of buying the MX5 in the first place, I would also see that figure as a starting point because these things always have a habit of spiraling way beyond the original quoted conversion cost if you really want to do the job properly. Back in the real world I very much doubt you'll get much change out of £20k 'all in' by the time you've bought the donor car and addressed brakes, suspension and drivetrain properly to deliver genuine turn key product status which lets face it is a tuner car seldom achieves.
TVRs do have a reputation for unreliability but the truth is the expensive engine and drivetrain components in a Rover V8 Chimaera or Griffith is all bullet proof OEM developed engineering, just the wiring lets the cars down and that's easy and super cheap to resolve, but I admit it's not a car for someone afraid of picking up a screwdriver or resolving a poor earth or two. If you really think an MX5 with an engine transplant would be any different, I'm afraid to say you're verging delusional
The bottom line is choose either the so called 'BBR full fat naturally aspirated iteration' or the v6 conversion from Rocketeer Ltd, you need to accept you'll not come out of either project with change out of £20k, and in truth you'll probably spend a lot more, both will serve up a fuel bill that my duel fuel Chimaera with it's 48mpg average petrol equivalent (£0.11p a mile) simply laughs at
Following the conversion both will instantly become tuner/modified cars that will depreciate faster than may wish to admit to yourself, and here's the thing... both will still be considerably slower than my TVR
I call a 'FAIL' on every count from both MX5 hop up kits
The reliability point is of course complete nonsense, I don't care what Racketeer will try to have you believe any such engine transplant is very invasive heart surgery and comes with way more detail and packaging challenges than you could ever appreciate, unless that is you've been around this type of practice for years. To get a car right in every detail respect take a huge amount of in depth development work, the idea of just slapping a different engine in there even if you've been told it's a properly engineered kit is pure fantasy, believe me when I say you're about to become a development engineer for the nest 2-3 years as you fight to get the thing right of your car.
£7k is also a lot of money to lay down on top of the price of buying the MX5 in the first place, I would also see that figure as a starting point because these things always have a habit of spiraling way beyond the original quoted conversion cost if you really want to do the job properly. Back in the real world I very much doubt you'll get much change out of £20k 'all in' by the time you've bought the donor car and addressed brakes, suspension and drivetrain properly to deliver genuine turn key product status which lets face it is a tuner car seldom achieves.
TVRs do have a reputation for unreliability but the truth is the expensive engine and drivetrain components in a Rover V8 Chimaera or Griffith is all bullet proof OEM developed engineering, just the wiring lets the cars down and that's easy and super cheap to resolve, but I admit it's not a car for someone afraid of picking up a screwdriver or resolving a poor earth or two. If you really think an MX5 with an engine transplant would be any different, I'm afraid to say you're verging delusional
The bottom line is choose either the so called 'BBR full fat naturally aspirated iteration' or the v6 conversion from Rocketeer Ltd, you need to accept you'll not come out of either project with change out of £20k, and in truth you'll probably spend a lot more, both will serve up a fuel bill that my duel fuel Chimaera with it's 48mpg average petrol equivalent (£0.11p a mile) simply laughs at
Following the conversion both will instantly become tuner/modified cars that will depreciate faster than may wish to admit to yourself, and here's the thing... both will still be considerably slower than my TVR
I call a 'FAIL' on every count from both MX5 hop up kits
Tannedbaldhead said:
The FIAT isn't the better car it's just better suited to you.
I've been small roadster daft since my early 20s (how do you think my bald head got so tanned?).
I have owned a Reliant Scimitar SS1, a Panther Lima, Mk1 I, II and III versions of MX5 and an MGTF. My roadsters have been bought new when my sole transport and older when used as weekend fun and bald head tanners.
For me the sweet spot of the MX5/124 Spider range is the 124 Lusso, red with tobacco leather. 140bhp, punchy mid range, pretty (in my eyes anyway) and a nice burbley exhaust note.
A nice top down; quick without being ridiculously fast, sunny day entertainer is all most roadster drivers are looking for.
200-250bhp ultra focused Abarth road racer the forum is crying out for? A 200hp @ 10,000 rpm MX5? Neither is the car for me. It would blow off my wig.
Would the fact the 124 in 140bhp Lusso trim is the best suited roadsters for my needs make it the best roaster there is? Far from it.
Superb response, you describe the experience very well, ours is a Red Lusso Plus but with black interior. I wasn't implying the Fiat was better, just responding to the clown who is clearly still living in the 70's and called Fiats "crappy" and clearly has no clue whatsoeverI've been small roadster daft since my early 20s (how do you think my bald head got so tanned?).
I have owned a Reliant Scimitar SS1, a Panther Lima, Mk1 I, II and III versions of MX5 and an MGTF. My roadsters have been bought new when my sole transport and older when used as weekend fun and bald head tanners.
For me the sweet spot of the MX5/124 Spider range is the 124 Lusso, red with tobacco leather. 140bhp, punchy mid range, pretty (in my eyes anyway) and a nice burbley exhaust note.
A nice top down; quick without being ridiculously fast, sunny day entertainer is all most roadster drivers are looking for.
200-250bhp ultra focused Abarth road racer the forum is crying out for? A 200hp @ 10,000 rpm MX5? Neither is the car for me. It would blow off my wig.
Would the fact the 124 in 140bhp Lusso trim is the best suited roadsters for my needs make it the best roaster there is? Far from it.
Edited by ninepoint2 on Friday 31st August 19:52
Fiddly-Dee said:
Well, this thread took an unexpected turn...
Didn't it just.Back on topic, well done Mazda for allocating the time and funds to make a superb car even better. Especially as their engineers have been working hard on developing the interesting Skyactive X engine for the 2019 Mazda 3.
ninepoint2 said:
Superb response, you describe the experience very well, ours is a Red Lusso Plus but with black interior. I wasn't implying the Fiat was better, just responding to the clown who is clearly still living in the 70's and called Fiats "crappy" and clearly has no clue whatsoever
Sorry, I obviously didn't make myself clear-it's often difficult to get across exactly what you mean on an internet forum rather than in a day to day chat. Apologies!I didn't mean to imply all Fiats are crappy, I'm quite the fan of the little 500 as it happens at least in the styling and handing departments. The 124 Spider however, yes, that is crappy.
Sorry for the confusion again!
ChimpOnGas said:
wst said:
If you have a TVR and keep banging on about how fuel efficient it is, you've missed the point more than anyone else in humanity ever has.
Not really It's the real deal 'Cake & Eat It' full package of performance and cost effective fuel bills, all wrapped up in a back to basics truly connected drivers car that'll blow all these little Mazda MX5s into the weeds every time, even the tuned naturally aspirated ones or those with V6 transplants.
And it won't depreciate at all either!
My original point was and still is this new Mazda MX5 isn't really progress, it's a costly under-performing little thing that is way more expensive to fuel and will lose you thousands of pounds in depreciation during the period you own it.
How is that progress
The TVR has a nice sounding engine but it won't have the chassis ability of the MX. Has a TVR ever won any sort of handling contest? I can't remember one.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff