RE: Jaguar I-Pace Laguna Seca lap: Time For Coffee
Tuesday 11th September 2018
Jaguar I-Pace Laguna Seca lap: Time For Coffee?
Jag EV laps the iconic Californian track, gets within a couple of tenths of an Evo IX
Whichever way you cut it, there's a heck of a lot of attention on the Jaguar I-Pace at the moment. Even on PH, the reveal story attracted nearly 250 comments, and the drive comfortably more than 300. People are interested, and want to know more. Perfect time to introduce the Laguna Seca lap, then...
Alright, so the timing is a little out. A less commercial, plainer version of this vid originally appeared Motor Trend's channel as an unlisted upload on August 18th; it was picked up and then the subject of some discussion on PH last month, in fact. But it was only released publically on the channel over the weekend, complete with more than its fair share of Jag endorsement for this HSE First Edition. Get beyond that - the lap begins at 2:00 in the 'full' video - and there's an entirely electric lap of Laguna Seca, so often the location for incredible combustion engined feats, to watch and analyse.
Of course it's quiet, and the sense of relaxation is not helped by Randy Pobst's rather laid back style, though there's decent speed and composure from what we can see here. Certainly there have been cars less at home on track. How long it might last flat out on track is rather a different matter, of course, but maybe we'll discuss that another time...
The time? 1:48.18, placing it on Fastest Laps leaderboard just behind an Evo IX time of 1:47.93 and ahead of a previous generation Focus ST, Mk7 Golf GTI and - it says here - a 997 Carrera S, although 1:50 seems a little slow.
Anyway, the lap is here, it's new and it's different, so it seemed worth sharing. Both versions are below, just in case you want to cut through the blurb and straight into the lap.
Discussion
Rather relaxed wheel grip from the driver, casual one handed into the start finish straight! I take it it's incredibly light steering.
Saw one of these in the metal in Soho a few weeks ago, looks very very good. I would happily own one of these. Having driven electric cars for a few hundred miles now I can see the appeal of the instant torque and the whisper quiet ride (so long as there's still a decent sounding car I can jump into!)
I was in the market for an i3 to be the frugal runaround when not in my M140i but then I was shown a crazy good ipace lease deal that's hard to ignore!
Saw one of these in the metal in Soho a few weeks ago, looks very very good. I would happily own one of these. Having driven electric cars for a few hundred miles now I can see the appeal of the instant torque and the whisper quiet ride (so long as there's still a decent sounding car I can jump into!)
I was in the market for an i3 to be the frugal runaround when not in my M140i but then I was shown a crazy good ipace lease deal that's hard to ignore!
Yeah, there's a few really crazy deals appearing, especially for business users. I think one of them effectively works out about £450 a month if you're doing 10,000 a year (the deal itself is £300 a month but for only 5,000 miles. The extra mileage would be another £150 on top of the base deal) which considering I worked out that I'd save £150 a month in fuel (even when accounting for the cost of charging) it seems incredible really. £300 a month to drive around in a brand new £60k car!
Mike - the deal I saw last week had a rather hefty up-front payment before the £300/month, so possibly not as attractive as you make it sound...
As for the lap - hmm, "£60k, 400bhp quasi-SUV is quicker than £30k, 220bhp last-gen hot-hatches*." Wow, now there's news!
More to the point, why oh why do manufacturers of anything that's not expected to go on-track regularly (so anything less than a hardcore hot-hatch, a hardcore sports car or a full-on supercar) insist on showing-off lap-times?!? Says nothing about how the car will behave in the real world...
...where the I-Pace is probably going to be rather effective - good ride, instant torque, plenty of space...
* The Evo-IX is now well over 10 years old and was under-tyred at launch...and those tyres are now 10y.o. tech so hardly comparable with modern rubber. Same for the 997 re: tyre tech, as it was launched in 2004. Even so that lap-time doesn't seem to make sense...
As for the lap - hmm, "£60k, 400bhp quasi-SUV is quicker than £30k, 220bhp last-gen hot-hatches*." Wow, now there's news!
More to the point, why oh why do manufacturers of anything that's not expected to go on-track regularly (so anything less than a hardcore hot-hatch, a hardcore sports car or a full-on supercar) insist on showing-off lap-times?!? Says nothing about how the car will behave in the real world...
...where the I-Pace is probably going to be rather effective - good ride, instant torque, plenty of space...
* The Evo-IX is now well over 10 years old and was under-tyred at launch...and those tyres are now 10y.o. tech so hardly comparable with modern rubber. Same for the 997 re: tyre tech, as it was launched in 2004. Even so that lap-time doesn't seem to make sense...
havoc said:
Mike - the deal I saw last week had a rather hefty up-front payment before the £300/month, so possibly not as attractive as you make it sound...
I think I read either on here, or another forum that someone has got that deal though. Sounded like they'd done a decent amount of research, and whilst I know it's not cheap, I'm still surprised the monthly payments can be that low. Seems promising as a lot of Jag stuff isn't traditionally very cheap on finance.Ultimately, I guess the lap is a way of showing that it doesn't wilt after 300m, as is the general opinion on most EVs. This does have some relevance in the real world, purely from changing the perceptions of the motoring public. Along with the 'I regularly do 500 miles a day and never need to stop', 'the batteries will only hold 20% of the original charge after a year', 'the national grid won't be able to cope' and 'you're just moving the pollution elsewhere', not being able to cope with fast driving is another EV cliche which is an excuse/misconception that puts people off the idea. Doing a lap like this is a way of saying 'look....the future isn't totally depressing and EVs can actually be fun/comparable to an ICE car'. There's a long way to go, but stuff like this helps to move the perspective away from sandal wearing tech billionaires who live in California.
As a Model X owner I love the fact that other marques are stepping up and pushing the EV marketplace forward.
I knew when I bought it the likelihood was it'd be a Betamax in not long at all. Hasn't happened yet, but seeing the established manufacturers take electric seriously bodes very well for the future. Just not for me resale value!!!
I knew when I bought it the likelihood was it'd be a Betamax in not long at all. Hasn't happened yet, but seeing the established manufacturers take electric seriously bodes very well for the future. Just not for me resale value!!!
RacerMike said:
Doing a lap like this is a way of saying 'look....the future isn't totally depressing and EVs can actually be fun/comparable to an ICE car'. There's a long way to go, but stuff like this helps to move the perspective away from sandal wearing tech billionaires who live in California.
Yes and no.1 lap says nothing at all about ability or range - as you know better than most of us on here, nearly any car can do 1 fast lap, but it's how the tyres / brakes / transmission cope after everything heats up that determine true durability. And in the case of an EV, battery content / remaining range...
Fun? Again I feel I'm preaching to the choir, but a fast lap doesn't necessarily = 'fun'. See archetypal old-school fast-Audi.
...on top of which different people get their driving fun in different ways...acceleration, high-speed, grip, agility, sound, feel/feedback, responsiveness, 'balance' to the experience (e.g. control weights)...
I'm not anti-EV here, I'm anti-pointless-marketing.
havoc said:
Yes and no.
1 lap says nothing at all about ability or range - as you know better than most of us on here, nearly any car can do 1 fast lap, but it's how the tyres / brakes / transmission cope after everything heats up that determine true durability. And in the case of an EV, battery content / remaining range...
Fun? Again I feel I'm preaching to the choir, but a fast lap doesn't necessarily = 'fun'. See archetypal old-school fast-Audi.
...on top of which different people get their driving fun in different ways...acceleration, high-speed, grip, agility, sound, feel/feedback, responsiveness, 'balance' to the experience (e.g. control weights)...
I'm not anti-EV here, I'm anti-pointless-marketing.
Randy seems to be fairly genuine in his enjoyment for the car on track (despite the clear fact it's pretty advertorial for JLR), and many of the press drives in Portimao commented that they were able to complete several laps without any sign of a de-rate.1 lap says nothing at all about ability or range - as you know better than most of us on here, nearly any car can do 1 fast lap, but it's how the tyres / brakes / transmission cope after everything heats up that determine true durability. And in the case of an EV, battery content / remaining range...
Fun? Again I feel I'm preaching to the choir, but a fast lap doesn't necessarily = 'fun'. See archetypal old-school fast-Audi.
...on top of which different people get their driving fun in different ways...acceleration, high-speed, grip, agility, sound, feel/feedback, responsiveness, 'balance' to the experience (e.g. control weights)...
I'm not anti-EV here, I'm anti-pointless-marketing.
I'm not naive enough to suggest that we're at the point where you could bang out an entire track day at Castle Combe with a production EV car, but I think for most customers, we're at the point where an electric car can deliver performance of a level that would match their experience in an ICE car. The I Pace has already been spied earlier in the year at the Nurburgring, so it's clearly capable of a lap, and the Mission E has been there quite a bit. Already this has moved on from the Model S which de-rates so much by the first straight that it's barely worth continuing! Initial reports suggest the Model 3 is already a big step on from this also.
Edited by RacerMike on Tuesday 11th September 11:38
Evilex said:
Laguna Seca makes a nice change from the inevitable Nurburgring lap, and it's a considerably shorter watch!
I guess it would overheat on a full lap and turn in a woeful time.As an aside I treated myself to 3 days driving Laguna Seca at Christmas. It's an absolutely fantastic track, IMO up there with Spa; anyone who gets the chance, take it, it's worth the trip!
RacerMike said:
fblm said:
I guess it would overheat on a full lap and turn in a woeful time.
Not entirely sure that's true. The car did a reasonable amount of testing at the 'Ring. Its an EV, it should be governed by actual speed limits and have an optimal and safe acceleration ability. High levels of performance etc shouldnt be a requirement. All of these EV's coming out trying to replicate high performance premium/exec deisels just do not make sense. Why make something econimical to then allow it to drain the battery uneconimically and shorten its range.....
Edited by vz-r_dave on Tuesday 11th September 16:08
vz-r_dave said:
Its an EV, it should be governed by actual speed limits and have an optimal and safe acceleration ability. High levels of performance etc shouldnt be a requirement. All of these EV's coming out trying to replicate high performance deisels just do not make sense. Why make something econimical to then allow it to drain the battery uneconimically and shorten its range.....
Utterly bizarre comment.fblm said:
vz-r_dave said:
Its an EV, it should be governed by actual speed limits and have an optimal and safe acceleration ability. High levels of performance etc shouldnt be a requirement. All of these EV's coming out trying to replicate high performance deisels just do not make sense. Why make something econimical to then allow it to drain the battery uneconimically and shorten its range.....
Utterly bizarre comment.vz-r_dave said:
fblm said:
vz-r_dave said:
Its an EV, it should be governed by actual speed limits and have an optimal and safe acceleration ability. High levels of performance etc shouldnt be a requirement. All of these EV's coming out trying to replicate high performance deisels just do not make sense. Why make something econimical to then allow it to drain the battery uneconimically and shorten its range.....
Utterly bizarre comment.vz-r_dave said:
fblm said:
vz-r_dave said:
Its an EV, it should be governed by actual speed limits and have an optimal and safe acceleration ability. High levels of performance etc shouldnt be a requirement. All of these EV's coming out trying to replicate high performance deisels just do not make sense. Why make something econimical to then allow it to drain the battery uneconimically and shorten its range.....
Utterly bizarre comment.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff