JLR on 3 day week

[craigjm]

No ideas for a name said:

craigjm said:

It can’t be that because it must have been in the spec that people were expecting. My bet is on something physical missing like a wiring loom meaning that it would be too costly to put right.

Regardless it shouldn’t happen total shambles and knocks the confidence of consumers in their quality

I have something similar in my XF-S. Sold as having a TV tuner, listed on the build spec. as having a TV tuner - it just isn't there. Apparently it can't be retrofitted.

Yes these should not be clearing QC and leaving the factory. My 2008 XF didn’t have its heated steering wheel wired up and the sub on the B&W system wasn’t connected either

[JxJ Jr.]

craigjm said:

Well quality control is still as rubbish as ever

https://www.carscoops.com/2019/01/jaguar-e-pace-su...

Actually delivered to customers and then because there is “no fix” they are offering $600 compensation! Outrageous.

Oh come now, "the decision was made to proactively communicate this to potential buyers", as opposed to, you know, keeping quiet that a basic and expected functionality was missing.

[Burwood]

Basic functionality? The smart buyers would reject. The better supplier would fix the problem to the customers satisfaction.

[Digga]

Often this is a side-effect of JIT manufacturing. You will see cars around the factory with white shrink wrap type cover on the bodywork - these are awaiting 'something' that either didn't arrive at the productions line or arrived but was rejected for some reason.

It's not unique to JLR either. Mrs Digga ordered a brand new 3 series touring about 10 years back (I forget exactly when). It was when DAB was just coming through as an option, which she'd chosen (one of the main reasons for buying new, rather than used) and was very much looking forward too... New car, no DAB. Got cost refunded and free servicing and, and and, but it pissed her off enough that she never bought another BMW.

[Jazzy Jag]

Burwood said:

Basic functionality? The smart buyers would reject. The better supplier would fix the problem to the customers satisfaction.

Did JLR sack you?

You really seem bitter and have an axe to grind.

[havoc]

Jazzy Jag said:

Burwood said:

Basic functionality? The smart buyers would reject. The better supplier would fix the problem to the customers satisfaction.

Did JLR sack you?

You really seem bitter and have an axe to grind.

I think most people who've had the misfortune to deal with JLR over the last 15-20 years have an axe to grind, quite honestly.

You'll struggle to find a good word said about them in the Tier-1 community, whilst their reputation for unreliability precedes them everywhere except the UK, where patriotism still seems to trump common sense.



I'm not saying BMW or Merc are blameless, but they ARE a lot more professional to deal with than JLR and have better reliability scores. In the interest of balance I have very little time for VAG as a manufacturer either.

[fiatpower]

Digga said:

You will see cars around the factory with white shrink wrap type cover on the bodywork - these are awaiting 'something' that either didn't arrive at the productions line or arrived but was rejected for some reason.

That's not true, the white shrink wrap is transit panel protection fitted as standard to every body. Same at all OEMs.

[Digga]

fiatpower said:

Digga said:

You will see cars around the factory with white shrink wrap type cover on the bodywork - these are awaiting 'something' that either didn't arrive at the productions line or arrived but was rejected for some reason.

That's not true, the white shrink wrap is transit panel protection fitted as standard to every body. Same at all OEMs.

Not what I was told at Lode Lane by the LR Experience guy.

Anyway, better news for JLR in the USA last month, record sales: https://www.expressandstar.com/news/business/2019/...

[stumpage]

fiatpower said:

Digga said:

You will see cars around the factory with white shrink wrap type cover on the bodywork - these are awaiting 'something' that either didn't arrive at the productions line or arrived but was rejected for some reason.

That's not true, the white shrink wrap is transit panel protection fitted as standard to every body. Same at all OEMs.

Yep if that was the case VW must have serious problems.....



As do other car manufacturers

[Digga]

stumpage said:

fiatpower said:

Digga said:

You will see cars around the factory with white shrink wrap type cover on the bodywork - these are awaiting 'something' that either didn't arrive at the productions line or arrived but was rejected for some reason.

That's not true, the white shrink wrap is transit panel protection fitted as standard to every body. Same at all OEMs.

Yep if that was the case VW must have serious problems.....



As do other car manufacturers

It's the ones with the partial bits, I was told, that were after re-work.

[LDN]

havoc said:

Jazzy Jag said:

Burwood said:

Basic functionality? The smart buyers would reject. The better supplier would fix the problem to the customers satisfaction.

Did JLR sack you?

You really seem bitter and have an axe to grind.

I think most people who've had the misfortune to deal with JLR over the last 15-20 years have an axe to grind, quite honestly.

You'll struggle to find a good word said about them in the Tier-1 community, whilst their reputation for unreliability precedes them everywhere except the UK, where patriotism still seems to trump common sense.



I'm not saying BMW or Merc are blameless, but they ARE a lot more professional to deal with than JLR and have better reliability scores. In the interest of balance I have very little time for VAG as a manufacturer either.

I’ve dealt with JLR a lot and they’ve been ten times better than Mercedes, in my experience... and that’s on repeated occasions. Can’t comment on BMW personally but a family member found them to be awful and won’t go near them ever again.

As for reliability surveys... I’d have to check, but I’m not sure JLR are behind BMW...

[Digga]

The thing I found with JLR was, they did always tend to hit quality/recall issues head-on, rather than sweeping them under the carpet or trying to minimise service network disruption by waiting to catch them on a scheduled service..

[LDN]

Digga said:

The thing I found with JLR was, they did always tend to hit quality/recall issues head-on, rather than sweeping them under the carpet or trying to minimise service network disruption by waiting to catch them on a scheduled service..

I agree. Recalls get dealt with as they should; for the most part.

[Gibbo205]

I feel its a real shame.

When I was car hunting over a year ago I drove many cars like the AMG GTS, R8 V10 Plus, R35 GTR, BMW M4 CS, Vantage V8S and the car I purchased in the end was an F-Type SVR, its not suffered depreciation any worse than the other cars on my list like scaremongers told me it would, in fact it seems to held price much better than the BMW and Audi counterparts.

But the reason I went for it was because it was so much fun to drive whilst remaining at legal speed limits, but if you really wanted to push on hard it was just as capable as the R8 and GTR with limits way beyond any kind of speed you should be doing on the road.

The car has been faultless, any minor issue I had JLR dealt with professionally and quickly, the biggest shock was the servicing cost, they did the full service including gear box oil and the price was just £315, none of the competing cars on my list come even close, they are all typically £800-£1500 for a service.

It is such a shame because the SVR is one incredible car, I am only selling it to try something else and the fact that for a replacement I am looking in the Lamborghini, Ferrari and Mclaren stables says it all really.

I hope JLR pull through this because for me their product has not only been amazing, but so has the service too.

[blademansw]

LDN said:

I’ve dealt with JLR a lot and they’ve been ten times better than Mercedes, in my experience... and that’s on repeated occasions.

10 times 0 is still 0...

[JD]

Can anyone with a more financey brain than I, explain this link?

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/jaguar...

[NomduJour]

They’ve committed a tonne of cash to develop and build diesel engines, which is now worthless.

[anonymous-user]

NomduJour said:

They’ve invested a tonne of cash in diesel which is now worthless.

its in the article, sounds like accounting tweakery.

'' £3.1 billion charge was part of the firm’s Charge and Accelerate transformation schemes, designed to invigorate the struggling company with around £2.5 billion of investment.''

[craigjm]

It’s done when you have an asset and that asset becomes impaired and is therefore worth less than it was to that point. Take the hit now on the balance sheet and save money in the long term.

[havoc]

craigjm said:

It’s done when you have an asset and that asset becomes impaired and is therefore worth less than it was to that point. Take the hit now on the balance sheet and save money in the long term.

Well, not 'save money', more recognise the loss now to avoid recognising it piecemeal over future years.

Suggestion was that the 'loss' was split 50/50:-
- 50% is as above - they've invested in "product development" (probably ingenium mainly) which hasn't paid off, so previously they'd capitalised those costs as a (non-physical) asset of the business, and have now decided those ideas and research aren't really an asset so are writing them off.
- 50% is a write down of tangible assets - plant and machinery. This for me is actually more significant, as that means they've invested in the wrong bits of kit. Could also be related to the engine plant, as they now expect to sell far fewer diesel engines than before.

Either way note it's only relating to Q4. Of more interest is the 'underlying loss' of £270m in Q4 + another £90m in Q3. This is a loss on continuing operations, which means that (yet again) they're carrying too many costs vs the amount of vehicles they're selling. Hence the '000s of redundancies...